Dozer Rental Question? Need to Cut V ditch.

[AlanB]

In the FWIW catagory, I have changed several small ditches to swales with my small underpowered Bobcat (610) and it works pretty well. I do not consider myself a proficient operator, but the jobs came out OK. Was I a better operator, there would have been less hand work.

It is definetely an option you should consider.

Or hire someone that is proficient on a skid steer and have them do it. I think you would find it cheaper then a dozer.

 

[coastalguy]

Here are some pictures......Hope this gives a better understanding. It has been raining lately. You can see the mess I have.....

 

[AlanB]

Boy, you sure do not have much grade change to make it fall though, I guess that is the "coast" part of your name.

I think a skid steer would do that fairly nicely, or heck a box blade on the tractor would do it as well with a front loader.

I think the trick for you will be that it is going to have to be darn near exact or you will always have those puddles, I know as a landscaper I would be squirming looking at that job and you telling me you want it too drain and not have puddles.

How much fall do you have total vs. how much run? May be just the pictures, but I sure do not see much there.

I think this would be like a little project I have going on behind my buddies shop. Very little fall to drain for 50' away from his shop, I just keep refining it and refining it when we are out there with the bobcat. The puddles are only an inch or less deep, but, it is real hard to get them all out. It is free, so we just keep picking at it.

 

[coastalguy]

I have to go about 300 feet from the start of the ditch/swale to tie into the existing ditch by the road in front of my house. I have 24 inches of fall (24 inches from the ground elevation at the start of swale to the bottom of the existing ditch).

 

[AlanB]

Man, if I am doing the math right, that gives you .08" fall for every foot of run.

I would be wiggling greatly if I was trying to do that for a paying customer that did not want puddled water in their ditches.

 

[coastalguy]

I dont mind the water if I could just lower the level. Thats why a a ditch on each side is better. Once the water gets a certain head, it will have to flow out.

 

[EddieWalker]

I have to go about 300 feet from the start of the ditch/swale to tie into the existing ditch by the road in front of my house. I have 24 inches of fall (24 inches from the ground elevation at the start of swale to the bottom of the existing ditch).

From seeing your pictures, and reading this last statement, I'm realy questioning if you can accomplish anything here. I'm also thinking that your contractor did as good a job as can be expected considering the distance and slope that he had to work with.

Here's the problem.

If you go in and get it exacly perfect. One hundred percent, dead on, it will still puddle on you after a few rains. It's not enough change in elevation over too long a distance to keep water moving. The water will carry small dirt particles with it and deposit them along the rought. The water will never move fast enough to create any erosion and carry the silt, or dirt particles with it. The result is that after a few rains, you will have areas that have more material in them, and they will create more of what you have right now.

My only solution is to raise the road and get it above the drainage area. Instead of spending $500 on a dozer, spend it on more dirt to build your road up higher. The further away it is from the water, the dryer it will be. You can't go down any deeper, so your only other option is to go up.

I have several areas like this and have had to move in hundreds of yards of dirt to get them up high enough to keep them dry. This past weekend, I received almost 7 inches of rain in two days and have learned that I have even more roads that will have to be built up. Digging down isn't an option as the water is already at it's lowest point. I have to go up. I think you have to go up too.

Eddie

 

[LoneCowboy]

having seen the pictures, I have another idea
French drain
You dig the trench, put sand it in it, perfectly level it, lay the pipe and then bury it in rocks, so the water moves thru the rocks.
It won't puddle, it won't get disturbed and most water should drain right off.
That might be a better long term solution.

 

[toolaholic]

Eddie beat me to it! invest in crushed rock and build up. I think otherwise you'll be grading forever ! Maybe you'll end up being the best grader on both coasts ! good luck

 

[kmdigital]

From seeing your pictures, and reading this last statement, I'm realy questioning if you can accomplish anything here. I'm also thinking that your contractor did as good a job as can be expected considering the distance and slope that he had to work with.

Here's the problem.

If you go in and get it exacly perfect. One hundred percent, dead on, it will still puddle on you after a few rains. It's not enough change in elevation over too long a distance to keep water moving. The water will carry small dirt particles with it and deposit them along the rought. The water will never move fast enough to create any erosion and carry the silt, or dirt particles with it. The result is that after a few rains, you will have areas that have more material in them, and they will create more of what you have right now.

My only solution is to raise the road and get it above the drainage area. Instead of spending $500 on a dozer, spend it on more dirt to build your road up higher. The further away it is from the water, the dryer it will be. You can't go down any deeper, so your only other option is to go up.

I have several areas like this and have had to move in hundreds of yards of dirt to get them up high enough to keep them dry. This past weekend, I received almost 7 inches of rain in two days and have learned that I have even more roads that will have to be built up. Digging down isn't an option as the water is already at it's lowest point. I have to go up. I think you have to go up too.

Eddie

Do like Eddie says, and add a larger culvert under the road so that water will flow from one side to the other without it getting plugged up through that little itty bitty 4" pipe. That way it can't flow into the road, both because the road is higher, and it will drain to the other side before it's that deep. And your ditches will still be nice and shallow for mowing when it is dry.

I can pretty much guarantee you that deepening your ditches will only amount to having deeper ponds that will be harder to mow, etc. They will still fill up with water and come up to the edge of the road unless you raise the level of the road. That is unless you make them so deep that the ditches will be hard to mow, and that will only work if the existing drainage ditch is deep enough to allow you to dig your other ditches deep enough and still flow to the drainage ditch. Based on how flat it looks, I don't think you have that much fall to the normal water level in the main drainage ditch. And you don't want to dig it so deep that the water will back flow from the main ditch into your road ditches when the water rises in the main ditch. Doing this would guarantee that you always have standing water in your roadside ditches when it's rainy/wet.