Ductless heat pumps- Any experience out there?

[Phils]

I installed a Sanyo in June 2009 and it is one of the best things I've bought. It was an easy install.

We live off-grid and have never had 'real' a/c, only swamp coolers. And those only got turned on when we got home, so if it was 100 outside, it was 102 inside when we started the coolers and it'd take an hour to make it somewhat cooler and more humid (older mobilehome). Now we get home to 76 degrees even if it's over 100 outside.

There is an extensive thread at a forum I frequent (almost as much as TBN) for people living off-grid. Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed) - Solar Electric Power Discussion Forum by Northern Arizona Wind & Sun

The unit I installed costs more because it is "inverter technology". That is, the fan and compressor and indoor air handler only run as fast as is necessary to keep the proper temp. I leave ours on "low" and it doesn't use more than 300 watts to keep the home comfortable.

I have no insight on how they perform in zero degree weather since we never get below 30, but we do use the heat (it was a worthwhile option) to take the chill off the air before the woodstove gets up to speed.

The Sanyo I bought is here: 12KHS71 - Sanyo 11,900 BTU Wall Mount Heat Pump Air Conditioner Kit

There are now some even more efficient mini-splits avalilable. Mine doesn't have a high enough SEER number to qualify it for the tax credit, tho the next model smaller does. I understand these Mitsubishi units have higher SEER numbers Indoor Unit Item # MSZ-FE09NA, Inverter Heat Pumps on Mitsubishi Electric & Electronics - HVAC Advanced Products Div.

Apparently the rest of the world has been using these for many years. A friend in Pakistan has three. I understand it's the predominent a/c type across Asia.

Phil

 

[jinjimbob]

A ductless heat pump can work down to 0 deg F.

YouTube - Daikin Cold weather test

My regular force air heat pump can work down to about 20 deg F, after that its efficient to use the heat pump part, and just use the electric strips. (+ wood stove). Way way way way cheaper than propane.

 

[DaveOmak]

jinjimbob,
That Daikin you-tube video is impressive! Thanks!
I am about 6-8 months out from doing something.
I use 6 tons of pellets to heat my home for the winter. That is my only heat source.(except for the elec furn in the attic. costs too much!)
I'm thinkin' I need another source in the event something happens. The wife can't handle the pellets etc.

The more info you all provide really helps. I appreciate it.
Dave

 

[jinjimbob]

These units here you can install yourself. You could use them in combination with your stove, thats what we do with our furnace when it gets really cold. You are on the other side of the cascades than us, so we don't get it as cold as you. But one of these would help in the Summer for you with the A/C on that bad days.

Ductless Mini-Split Air Conditioning (and Heating) Systems

If you install one before the end of the year, you get 33% tax rebate on your total cost up to $1500.

 

[Phils]

These units here you can install yourself.

They are very easy to install. Drill a 3" hole in the wall and hang the air handler inside over the hole after running two copper pipes and one electrical cable through the hole. You can buy a piece to cover the outside cable/pipes but it's less expensive to just modify and use a rain gutter downspout. I made my installation more difficult by putting the cable/pipes inside the wall.

Mount the compressor outside and connect the pipes and cable(mine came with some mounting pedestals in additon to the copper tubes and cable and outside disconnect).

Run power wires to the outside disconnect from the compressor. Use a dedicated circuit breaker to supply power to the disconnect.

The freon (R410a) is contained in the compressor. Evacuate the lines if you want (it's not required but certainly must contribute some to the efficiency ... I spent an extra $100 for a new vacuum pump because I didn't want any cross contamination from the one used for my auto a/c). Open the valves as instructed and it's up and running.

My Pakistani friend had his three installed for $10USD each, tho none were evacuated.

If you ever need to replace or service something that requires opening up the system, you just close one valve and the compressor sucks all the freon back into itself. Then close the other valve and you can open the system without releasing any freon.

Shortly AFTER I installed the Sanyo, Consumer Reports had a small article on mini-splits, mentioning only three brands. They said Sanyo was the best for "brownouts". That's because the "brains" are all in the remote control, which I mounted on the wall but it just clips into a holder.

Phil

 

[Sigarms]

These units here you can install yourself. You could use them in combination with your stove, thats what we do with our furnace when it gets really cold. You are on the other side of the cascades than us, so we don't get it as cold as you. But one of these would help in the Summer for you with the A/C on that bad days.

Ductless Mini-Split Air Conditioning (and Heating) Systems

If you install one before the end of the year, you get 33% tax rebate on your total cost up to $1500.

1. Read the fine print from the manufacturer, most will void the warranty via internet sales.

2. It's not a tax rebate, but a tax credit, there is a difference.

3. It's 30% up to a $5,000 (install) invoice, which equates to a max of a $1,500 credit.

 

[Leweys Haeting]

Hello Dave I see you posted questions concerning Heat Pumps in 10/17/10 Have I live in the State of Maine. We get very extremely cold weather here in the winter months. I'm located in the downeast area of Maine. I'm a Heating contractor which i'm in the process of installing FUJITSU Ductless heat pumps, they are designed to operate at -15 degree weather which we can get that some winters,of course they still produce heat at that temperature but enough too still keep running some heat. I'm preparing to install some heat pumps in Fema trailers which has the air to air heat/AC with the main trunk line up in the attic, going to the desired rooms coming off the main trunk line. Were experiencing the costly electricity these units consumes.

 

[forgeblast]

We were also looking at the fujitsu halcyon series. Before you buy compare the warranties there is a lot of difference between the different manufacturers.

 

[DaveOmak]

Thanks for the reply..... the units I have looked at have very efficient motors.... Extremely low amp draw.... That is the first thing I look at.... temps to -15 deg.... not much heat to draw from.... I'm thinking of installing one myself... I have had no luck and have no faith in the backwoods contractors here..
I have one question about installation... I think I will need a vacuum pump to draw down the system.... do I need a pump and gauge to measure the system vacuum / Torr/mm Hg or can I go with a vacuum pump designed for HVAC.... What would be the mm Hg I need to draw the tubing section down to so as to not have moisture in the system.... Or is there a web page I can look at to learn this stuff.... I am not adverse to purchasing a pump if I knew what pressure I had to attain in the tubing....
If I forgot something, let me know where I am going astray...
Thanks, Dave

 

[murphy1244]

Hello Dave I see you posted questions concerning Heat Pumps in 10/17/10 Have I live in the State of Maine. We get very extremely cold weather here in the winter months. I'm located in the downeast area of Maine. I'm a Heating contractor which i'm in the process of installing FUJITSU Ductless heat pumps, they are designed to operate at -15 degree weather which we can get that some winters,of course they still produce heat at that temperature but enough too still keep running some heat. I'm preparing to install some heat pumps in Fema trailers which has the air to air heat/AC with the main trunk line up in the attic, going to the desired rooms coming off the main trunk line. Were experiencing the costly electricity these units consumes.

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