F150 Diesel

/ F150 Diesel #21  
Apparently is no rumor. I just got a message on my FordPass app on the phone about the introduction of the diesel F150.
 
/ F150 Diesel #22  
I would lean against it for my uses. I love my Dodge/Cummins, but at least here in California diesel is more expensive, and now has even more tax. Gas motors have gotten a lot better; I don't think the average user gets the advantage we used to get from diesel.
 
/ F150 Diesel #23  
You sure about that? We paid ~28k for our crew cab EcoDiesel, last I looked at the 2500 they were in the 40k range before adding a diesel.

Yes, absolutely sure. My 17 Ram msrp was $48,000, but I got it for less.

Cummins has a better track record than the VM Motori Eco Diesel.
 
/ F150 Diesel #24  
Has anyone driven or herd info about the Nissan Cummin's diesel - curious to here any real world stories.

The Nissan gets poor fuel economy and does not tow more than any other 1/2 ton gasser. The gas Titan blew the doors off of the diesel Titan on the Ike Gauntlet by The Fast Lane Truck in a head to head towing competition.
 
/ F150 Diesel #25  
Has anyone driven or herd info about the Nissan Cummin's diesel - curious to here any real world stories.

I watched a video from a PowerStoke specialty shop that pretty much scared me off of any desire to own a 2008- and newer diesel. I did not know a failed urea pump can shell a diesel engine among other issues. They claimed the 6.4L designed by International is at best a 150K engine and is largely not rebuildable.

I need to find a Dodge or GM special shop to confirm the scary stuff happening to diesels through the emissions systems.
 
/ F150 Diesel #26  
Well for one GM did not use urea until 2011. They still used diesel injection in dpf on LMM engines. Urea started with LML engines, and frankly I have not heard of a single urea pump failure. Does not mean it did not happen. Would be interesting to see why they think a pump that injects into the exhaust stream could ruin an engine. Cause it to go into limp mode maybe.

You might be right about the V8's gs the 3.5 going away. Kinda sad to see an icon of engine design going away.

Diesel in CA went up because this stupid state is so in love with electric cars they want diesels off the road. I will rrive a diesel until I cannot drive any more. If I stop towing I will buy a diesel car of 1/2 ton truck.

There are a number of diesel engines in ag use that meet tier 4 levels without urea, I am waiting for them to figure it out for road engines. Diesel emmissions are now where gas engines were in the late 80's and early 90's.

The power these truck engines produce and still run clean is nothing short of amazing. Much to dismay of the greenies they are not going away, just getting cleaner and stronger. The EPA's hope was to force them out of existance IMHO so so places like France and UK are now resorting to legislation to ban them.
 
/ F150 Diesel #27  
I watched a video from a PowerStoke specialty shop that pretty much scared me off of any desire to own a 2008- and newer diesel. I did not know a failed urea pump can shell a diesel engine among other issues. They claimed the 6.4L designed by International is at best a 150K engine and is largely not rebuildable.

I need to find a Dodge or GM special shop to confirm the scary stuff happening to diesels through the emissions systems.

Bill at powerstroke help.com is despised on the powerstroke forums. He sells doom and gloom, so people will come crawling on their hands and knees so he can fix their truck. But after that truck leaves his shop, never a worry again.

I have had every single motor they have put in powerstrokes. My favorite is the 6.0, the 6.4 was a monster deleted and tuned, the 7.3 was reliable as a clock, and the 6.7 is the best of them all. If you don't understand what you're driving, a diesel will cost you money.

I've never had a problem and the 6.7 is pretty reliable now with all the emissions. The oem's are figuring it out.
 
/ F150 Diesel #28  
Everybody's engine has flaws, thankfully the big three are figuring it out. Cummins got it's reputation before emmisions were an issue. The one advantahe they still have is realitive simplicity and maintenance. Other than that I believe Ford and GM sre quickly closing that reliability gap.
 
/ F150 Diesel #29  
I watched a video from a PowerStoke specialty shop that pretty much scared me off of any desire to own a 2008- and newer diesel. I did not know a failed urea pump can shell a diesel engine among other issues. They claimed the 6.4L designed by International is at best a 150K engine and is largely not rebuildable.

I need to find a Dodge or GM special shop to confirm the scary stuff happening to diesels through the emissions systems.

I would run from that shop. The 6.4 never had DEF (urea). So I guess they are all going to fail at some point. DEF started on powerstrokes in 2011 with the Ford built 6.7L.
 
/ F150 Diesel #30  
I am not really a Ford fan, but I highly doubt the 3.5 ecoboost gasser will be phased out anytime soon. Ford just totally clean slate redesigned the 3.5 eco in 2017 so much so that it shares very little in common with the 1st generation 3.5 eco other than the 3.5 liter displacement size. If they were thinking about phasing it out they would have likely kept the previous version of it around 2 more years more instead of totally redoing it. More articles and rumors about Ford eventually dropping the V8 gasser in trucks than anything else. I think that is more likely than dropping the 3.5 eco IMOP and also think that it would be a mistake by Ford to ever drop the V8,

Why did they redesigned the 3.5? Makes me suspicious. I have to get a new truck in April, and I have the 5 L V8 now, and was thinking about getting one of the eco-boost engines next time. But now…
 
/ F150 Diesel #31  
They redesigned it to have a CGI block and a new direct and port injected fuel system. The CGI block can handle some insane pressures that will allow Ford to turn up the horsepower as the HP wars continue. It is much stronger than the aluminum block, but the aluminum is fine for the designed HP on the older trucks. This is carry over knowledge from the powerstoke and how to keep the motors together with big turbos.

The new fuel system was put in place to prevent direct injected related carbon build up. The port injection system keeps the system clean while the direct injection kicks in when the power is needed. Ford was pretty quick to fix this problem structurally, but it was really only a problem if you did a lot of short trips that didn't allow the moisture in the crank case to get hot and evaporate.
 
/ F150 Diesel #32  
Why did they redesigned the 3.5? Makes me suspicious. I have to get a new truck in April, and I have the 5 L V8 now, and was thinking about getting one of the eco-boost engines next time. But now…

I do not really know as again I am not really a true Ford fan so I rarely follow most of the Ford happenings. I do know the generation (1) 3.5 ecoboost did suffer from some rather serious design flaws of which some are easily remedied and others maybe not so much.

I would not be afraid of a generation (2) 3.5 eco boost at all as I believe Ford likely fixed most of the flaws of the previous generation. I also like the 2.7 eco boost, but its towing capabilities are not enough of what I need in a truck but it will serve many well.

I can only say that within the past 2 years I have driven several new trucks as I was looking at buying either a 1/2 ton with a max tow or enhanced towing package so a 1/2 capable of towing 10K minimum but 11K or 12K even better. I was also looking at 3/4 ton gassers. I have zero interest in a diesel for my needs.

The trucks that I would have been willing to spend my hard earned money on were:
a) 2017 Ram 1500 with 5.7 and 8 speed tranny. (Loved this truck, but its capabilities for heavy towing are not really all that much more than what I have now. I had a deal in the works to buy one but dealer would not honor their advertised price on selling it. I could have pushed the issue but did not since I loved the truck but it was gonna be pushing its towing capabilities like I am now with my ole 2003 GMC 1500. In other words it was a lot of money for me to spend and not really gain much over what I already own).
b) 2017 Ram 2500 with 6.4 gasser. (Liked this truck very well. It would easily serve my needs well. Only complaint against it is that it sits so darned tall in the air but 3/4 tons from all mfg's do. I actually use my bed to load heavy stuff into using only manpower doing the loading and trucks with high beds simply suck for this and a man's back. Otherwise this would be a great tow rig for my trailers and serve me well).
c) 2017 Ford F-150 with 5.0 gasser and 6 speed tranny (Truck was nothing earth shattering special but I certainly could have lived with it and been happy. I never drove the gen (2) 3.5 eco but it would likely serve me well too. 2.7 tops out about 7K on towing so did not fit my towing needs at all so never drove).

Trucks that totally missed the cut for Me:
a) 2017 Ford F-250 and 6.2 gasser. (I waited special to drive one of these. Its rock wagon ride and even worse yet ungainly steering were so bad I could not believe this was a fresh from the ground up redesign. What a letdown. I drove trucks form the 1970's better than this. Like the powertrain well enough though. No way I spend my money on one of these).
b) 2017 Nissan Titan and 5.6 gasser and 7 speed tranny. (Thought this pseudo 5/8 ton truck would be exactly what I was looking for. Enhanced capability over a standard 1/2 ton yet not full blown 3/4 ton either. Another big letdown. That gasser is a slug till the rpm's hit 3500 or more. I pulled out trying to merge into traffic and it had nothing. trans shifting was clumsy too. Did not really like the feel of the truck either. I did not fit in it well ergonomically).
c) 2017 Silverado 2500 gasser. Would be a contender for me if Chevy had not of cut the roofline such that a tall person like me no longer fits in their cabs comfortably. The claw-hammer like reliability of the 6.0 gasser is legendary which is a plus for a guy like me who keeps trucks 15 to 25 years or more....Looking forward to seeing if I fit in the 2019 redesign....
d) 2017 Silverado 6.2 gasser (Did not drive as I do not fit in heir current cabs and it sucks that the 6.2 is only available on topline trims making truck big $).
d) Toyota Tundra (Did not drive one but I simply figured if my gas mileage was gonna be as bad as these trucks are notorious for then why not opt for the 3/4 ton for that level of bad mpg. Otherwise this is a fine truck as I have a couple friends with them).
 
/ F150 Diesel #33  
In other words, they all suck for you and you're better off with nothing rather than worry about something? AmIright?
 
/ F150 Diesel #34  
They redesigned it to have a CGI block and a new direct and port injected fuel system. The CGI block can handle some insane pressures that will allow Ford to turn up the horsepower as the HP wars continue. It is much stronger than the aluminum block, but the aluminum is fine for the designed HP on the older trucks. This is carry over knowledge from the powerstoke and how to keep the motors together with big turbos.

The new fuel system was put in place to prevent direct injected related carbon build up. The port injection system keeps the system clean while the direct injection kicks in when the power is needed. Ford was pretty quick to fix this problem structurally, but it was really only a problem if you did a lot of short trips that didn't allow the moisture in the crank case to get hot and evaporate.

Umm only the 2.7 has the CGI block. The 3.5 Gen (2) does not. It was a total redesign using same materials.
 
/ F150 Diesel #35  
Correct - the 2.7 used a CGI block from day one, the 3.5 does not nor has it ever.

The addition of dual injection was to eliminate carbon build up on the intake valves - that is a serious common problem with DI, dual solves it.
 
/ F150 Diesel #36  
In other words, they all suck for you and you're better off with nothing rather than worry about something? AmIright?

If this quote is directed for me, I never said they all suck. Apparently I said one of them sucks that is your brand of choice. Sorry if I hurt your delicate feelings. I picked 3 that I would be willing to spend my money on, but I simply chose not too at this time. That all said, none of them are perfect and I own 3 trucks at present so I do not exactly fall into "the owning nothing" category. Since I own 3 trucks I am not forced to buy any at all if I choose not to. If I did not have any trucks at all right now I would buy the Ram 2500 with 6.4 for my needs slam dunk.

I keep my rigs 15 to 25 years so I want a good dependable one of whatever I buy as a vehicle for me does nothing for me but lose value over time as I do not make money with it. As such vehicles are a very poor investment for me and keeping them long term is better for me fiscally than loosing money in depreciation and paying high sales taxes on top that if I attempted to trade often.
 
/ F150 Diesel #37  
If this quote is directed for me, I never said they all suck. Apparently I said one of them sucks that is your brand of choice. Sorry if I hurt your delicate feelings. I picked 3 that I would be willing to spend my money on, but I simply chose not too at this time. That all said, none of them are perfect and I own 3 trucks at present so I do not exactly fall into "the owning nothing" category. Since I own 3 trucks I am not forced to buy any at all if I choose not to. If I did not have any trucks at all right now I would buy the Ram 2500 with 6.4 for my needs slam dunk.

I keep my rigs 15 to 25 years so I want a good dependable one of whatever I buy as a vehicle for me does nothing for me but lose value over time as I do not make money with it. As such vehicles are a very poor investment for me and keeping them long term is better for me fiscally than loosing money in depreciation and paying high sales taxes on top that if I attempted to trade often.
Love my 2016 Ram 2500 with the 6.4 hemi so far been problem free..
 

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/ F150 Diesel #38  
Correct - the 2.7 used a CGI block from day one, the 3.5 does not nor has it ever.

That is what I thought. I had not heard of a CGI 3.5 other than rumor/drawing board although I think it should be CGI
 
/ F150 Diesel #40  
Rankrank1
I lke your logic. I too keep vehicles a long time. Our main car is a 2005 Accord with over 217k on it. We bought it new. Out truck is a 2006 GMC Duramax with 137k. The truck is going nowhere anytime soon as it fills our needs perfectly.

The Accord might get replaced in a year or so, but it runs and look near new, so I am in now hurry for that either. I see ads that say 30mpg on new one and that is what I am getting now, so why trade up?

My truck pulls our 34ft 5th wheel outstandingly and gives me 12-13 while doing it, with 18-22 empty so why trade up? I have no plans for a bigger 5th wheel and even with an overhaul of engine or tranny this one is cheeper to keep.

Amenities are the thing lacking from mine to new and they are not worth $50k to me. Being retired puts a lot of things into perspective.
 

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