boomer1025
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Try over at NewAgTalk.com
Farming for profit
- Thread starter kthompson
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Try over at NewAgTalk.com
RickB
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The best Internet forum site for production Agriculture, bar none.
CADplans
Elite Member
Progressive Farmer sent me their magazine for the year 2016,,,
EVERY issue,,, EVERY!! stated the gloom and doom
Farm crops selling for 20% below production costs,,,
AND,, no relief in sight.
If you think $3 bushel corn is cheap,,, wait 'til we quit using ethanol,,,,
That alone will suppress the entire farm product market.
EVERY issue,,, EVERY!! stated the gloom and doom
Farm crops selling for 20% below production costs,,,
AND,, no relief in sight.
If you think $3 bushel corn is cheap,,, wait 'til we quit using ethanol,,,,
That alone will suppress the entire farm product market.
MAN IN BLACK
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I have 16896 layers.
OP
kthompson
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I have been in and out of small farming for several years but last few really into it. Not making enough to fully cover all cost but since the land is family land, land cost is not a issue. Might make more clear to rent the 38 acres of crop land have been planting for about 7 years for about 10 years before that was planting about 25. I know on the acreage we have row crops will not make any real money but at least at present if I can make enough to keep the IRS happy I am also.
Have a good friend who has suggested I move to horse hay and may yet move a few acres for he does and he is willing to do the cutting and baling for me. Issue I have there is no shelter and horse hay needs to be protected.
Know the most productive crop to raise is produce but with my full time job just do not have the time to. Nearing retirement and have given thought to even looking at
green houses for winter crops for local market.
Here boiled peanuts are very popular which needs green peanuts and have done a little of that but that was my big learning crop,,,the one where you learn you must read the labels, do not totally depend on the person selling the chemicals to know what they are talking about and YOU read the labels also, when the labels says to spray before 4 inches tall they mean that... Even bought digger and peanut combine (both were older used machines but worked good for the few acres I planted.
The last two years have been tough farming here, in October 2015 in one weekend we have something around 20 inches maybe more of rain and was said to be the largest rain fall in record keeping. Hay soybeans and they were mush before fields were dry enough to put combine in and then be able to drive it back out. Then last Oct we had Hurricane that dropped a lot of rain on us but friend who does my combing cut my corn just about two days before it hit. Had a very good corn crop for me (best crop ever for me in corn or beans) which was just under 150 bushels per acre. Yes corn around $3 is tough but the input cost had gone down so was positive cash flow.
Still believe the only way make money of any real amount is with produce and maybe as has been suggested not your typical crop but organic or something not typically found. Know a lady who has small dairy who sells straight from the cow milk and makes very decent money and she only uses organic feed for those cows either her grass or what she buys.
Do understand the impact ethanol has had on corn but the price of crude is low enough they can not pay much for the corn to make the ethanol. My believe is if corn stays around $3 you will see some very large farms bust as they went heavy into debt when prices were crazy for corn and not are in real bind. Also if corn remains there production cost will also drop some more for it just will not be sold by the amounts it was. At same time no idea if our corn will be low enough to affect the world market to the point of possibly affecting the amount planted in other countries.
It amazes me how much the population has increased in my lifetime and yet our crop yields have more than kept up with the demand. One thing that has hurt our area of the US is the decrease in demand for tobacco which is not the best crop for the consumer but many farmer here made very good livings with 90% coming from their tobacco and if they planted anything else it was just to fill in around tobacco often for crop rotation reasons.
It will be a sad day if we loss farming in this country to even just the large corporations. There is not better life to grow up in than on a family farm.
Have a good friend who has suggested I move to horse hay and may yet move a few acres for he does and he is willing to do the cutting and baling for me. Issue I have there is no shelter and horse hay needs to be protected.
Know the most productive crop to raise is produce but with my full time job just do not have the time to. Nearing retirement and have given thought to even looking at
green houses for winter crops for local market.
Here boiled peanuts are very popular which needs green peanuts and have done a little of that but that was my big learning crop,,,the one where you learn you must read the labels, do not totally depend on the person selling the chemicals to know what they are talking about and YOU read the labels also, when the labels says to spray before 4 inches tall they mean that... Even bought digger and peanut combine (both were older used machines but worked good for the few acres I planted.
The last two years have been tough farming here, in October 2015 in one weekend we have something around 20 inches maybe more of rain and was said to be the largest rain fall in record keeping. Hay soybeans and they were mush before fields were dry enough to put combine in and then be able to drive it back out. Then last Oct we had Hurricane that dropped a lot of rain on us but friend who does my combing cut my corn just about two days before it hit. Had a very good corn crop for me (best crop ever for me in corn or beans) which was just under 150 bushels per acre. Yes corn around $3 is tough but the input cost had gone down so was positive cash flow.
Still believe the only way make money of any real amount is with produce and maybe as has been suggested not your typical crop but organic or something not typically found. Know a lady who has small dairy who sells straight from the cow milk and makes very decent money and she only uses organic feed for those cows either her grass or what she buys.
Do understand the impact ethanol has had on corn but the price of crude is low enough they can not pay much for the corn to make the ethanol. My believe is if corn stays around $3 you will see some very large farms bust as they went heavy into debt when prices were crazy for corn and not are in real bind. Also if corn remains there production cost will also drop some more for it just will not be sold by the amounts it was. At same time no idea if our corn will be low enough to affect the world market to the point of possibly affecting the amount planted in other countries.
It amazes me how much the population has increased in my lifetime and yet our crop yields have more than kept up with the demand. One thing that has hurt our area of the US is the decrease in demand for tobacco which is not the best crop for the consumer but many farmer here made very good livings with 90% coming from their tobacco and if they planted anything else it was just to fill in around tobacco often for crop rotation reasons.
It will be a sad day if we loss farming in this country to even just the large corporations. There is not better life to grow up in than on a family farm.
ArlyA
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Maybe we need to get you on a family farm.... I came from the ag business and about 1/2 of my family does that today. These might large operations, yet they are still a family farms.
ProjectKing
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Horse hay is a good crop. I'm working to start my operation after losing land we leased out for dairy cattle hay.
Farming is not easy and not much money in it. But it's good for the country to keep it going.
Farming is not easy and not much money in it. But it's good for the country to keep it going.
ovrszd
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Yep. My friend's operation of 26K acres is a family farm. He's third generation. Has two Sons and a Son-In-Law in it now. So they are fourth generation family farm operation.
David P
Silver Member
I work full time in the financial field so I suppose I should know better 
but we have been increasing our little farm operation over the past several years. We got started with one product and it's just grown (pun intended) from there. I think what's worked well for us has been trying to stay away from trying to place a square peg in a round hole and simply working with what we have, paying cash as much as possible and reinvesting revenues back into the business.
Here's a little history of our foray into farming:
2010 Purchased 68 acres of vacant land and found approximately 300 mature and very overgrown blueberry bushes (highbush) growing on the land. Invited friends and family over to pick them free and started charging in 2012. Added more bushes in two later years. We're trying to stay organic and chemical free which is difficult as the bushes are growing in a peat bog which allows the wetlands grasses to grow like wildfire. Lots of work leading up to the season keeping the lanes mowed and the bushes weedwacked. Pruning is a must and really stimulates the bushes.
2011 County assessment department assessed our property at $90,000 more than we paid which we had to fight (and win) but this got me looking to other ways to reduce our property taxes. In Michigan, you can get an agricultural exemption or have the property re-classified as agricultural real property, either of which saves you 18 mills on your property taxes. Maple syrup operations qualify for this and despite our land being in aptly-named Oakland County, MI, we tapped 200 trees our first year. Found someone to boil the sap into syrup and we split the proceeds. We are now boiling for ourselves and tap around 800 trees at four locations.
Our focus for the first few years was on building our retail sales of our syrup. The blueberry orchard was a natural market for this and several of our customers began buying syrup from us throughout the year. We also started wholesaling to two local businesses and set up a table at a local festival annually.
2014 Purchased a home adjacent to our farm property with 10 acres. Wife wanted to start doing chickens so we bought a used coop and bought a number of laying chickens as well as around 40 meat birds. She sold some of the eggs which was also a natural market for the syrup and blueberry sales in the summer.
2015 Contacted by a local couple asking if we would like to purchase their honey business. Started with 3 hives but will need to be somewhere around 75-100 by the time we take over next year.
2016 Purchased three Dexter cattle; one bull, one steer and one heifer. The heifer is pregnant, the bull is happy and 1/4 of the steer is in my freezer. We sold the other 3/4 to our syrup/blueberry/honey customers. In fact, demand was so good that we located three Scottish Highlanders for sale and had them sold before we bought them. One heifer that's likely pregnant, one steer and one bull. I think we're going to keep the heifer and the other two are sold. All grass fed.
I think farming, as any other business startup, requires an enormous amount of patience as equipment costs can be quite high, there is always work to be done, something going wrong, equipment breaking at the worst possible time and cash flows can be very trying to say the least. My cpa, who is a college buddy, asked me "why are you doing this again?" lol I showed him our projected cash flows and it made more sense. That being said, we are still a few years away from making a profit and that could easily go awry because of any number of things going haywire.
I think many businesses fail because people have a pie-in-the-sky approach to forecasting revenues/profits, that their product will fly off the shelves, they don't have the patience/financial ability/discipline to persevere through the incredibly trying times. Being disciplined with purchases is also important. I think most of us are tempted by a bright, shiny new tractor but it's often best to find something used with low hours so you can spend the savings on another important aspect of your business.
I'm looking forward to what 2017 has in store for us. Hopefully cash flows improve this year as we have some tremendous outlays coming up.
but we have been increasing our little farm operation over the past several years. We got started with one product and it's just grown (pun intended) from there. I think what's worked well for us has been trying to stay away from trying to place a square peg in a round hole and simply working with what we have, paying cash as much as possible and reinvesting revenues back into the business.Here's a little history of our foray into farming:
2010 Purchased 68 acres of vacant land and found approximately 300 mature and very overgrown blueberry bushes (highbush) growing on the land. Invited friends and family over to pick them free and started charging in 2012. Added more bushes in two later years. We're trying to stay organic and chemical free which is difficult as the bushes are growing in a peat bog which allows the wetlands grasses to grow like wildfire. Lots of work leading up to the season keeping the lanes mowed and the bushes weedwacked. Pruning is a must and really stimulates the bushes.
2011 County assessment department assessed our property at $90,000 more than we paid which we had to fight (and win) but this got me looking to other ways to reduce our property taxes. In Michigan, you can get an agricultural exemption or have the property re-classified as agricultural real property, either of which saves you 18 mills on your property taxes. Maple syrup operations qualify for this and despite our land being in aptly-named Oakland County, MI, we tapped 200 trees our first year. Found someone to boil the sap into syrup and we split the proceeds. We are now boiling for ourselves and tap around 800 trees at four locations.
Our focus for the first few years was on building our retail sales of our syrup. The blueberry orchard was a natural market for this and several of our customers began buying syrup from us throughout the year. We also started wholesaling to two local businesses and set up a table at a local festival annually.
2014 Purchased a home adjacent to our farm property with 10 acres. Wife wanted to start doing chickens so we bought a used coop and bought a number of laying chickens as well as around 40 meat birds. She sold some of the eggs which was also a natural market for the syrup and blueberry sales in the summer.
2015 Contacted by a local couple asking if we would like to purchase their honey business. Started with 3 hives but will need to be somewhere around 75-100 by the time we take over next year.
2016 Purchased three Dexter cattle; one bull, one steer and one heifer. The heifer is pregnant, the bull is happy and 1/4 of the steer is in my freezer. We sold the other 3/4 to our syrup/blueberry/honey customers. In fact, demand was so good that we located three Scottish Highlanders for sale and had them sold before we bought them. One heifer that's likely pregnant, one steer and one bull. I think we're going to keep the heifer and the other two are sold. All grass fed.
I think farming, as any other business startup, requires an enormous amount of patience as equipment costs can be quite high, there is always work to be done, something going wrong, equipment breaking at the worst possible time and cash flows can be very trying to say the least. My cpa, who is a college buddy, asked me "why are you doing this again?" lol I showed him our projected cash flows and it made more sense. That being said, we are still a few years away from making a profit and that could easily go awry because of any number of things going haywire.
I think many businesses fail because people have a pie-in-the-sky approach to forecasting revenues/profits, that their product will fly off the shelves, they don't have the patience/financial ability/discipline to persevere through the incredibly trying times. Being disciplined with purchases is also important. I think most of us are tempted by a bright, shiny new tractor but it's often best to find something used with low hours so you can spend the savings on another important aspect of your business.
I'm looking forward to what 2017 has in store for us. Hopefully cash flows improve this year as we have some tremendous outlays coming up.
OP
kthompson
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- Kubotas B2710, M6800, L6060 cab, Volvo EC excavator, 2 ZTRs and various implements.
I am farming my wife's family farm. I am at least the fourth generation. But tobacco was the cash crop till about 12 years back and that is not an option. Funny how varied farming operations can be. I grew up on small farm also but we raised hogs and few cows. We did little crop raising crops while my wife's family raised crops and no animals.
David, my wife has a first cousin who had taken a product line and done a very good job developing the brand and has my guessing about 6 people working for him with milling corn products and selling both in wholesale and direct. Said he is running at full capacity. Has been at it a few years. Like your business diversacation. Have you found any nature or organic treatment for the grass? Years ago geese were used in certain crops in the South as they eat grass. You can even hear them called "grassers" by some still.
A crop big here is deer corn. A bag of corn sells for around $8. That price seems to be the same if sold by a store or the farmer direct. I did this one year and if you will deliever will help the size of the sale. That is on the cob. Shelled corn sells for about the same and some hunters perfer one over the other. Do suggest a grain trailer if you use a picker. I have sold shelled corn to a hunter. He paid a little over what the grain company was paying and left it in storage with them to pickup as he wanted it.
Stumbled onto there are produce processing plants who will come in with crew and gather the crop if you have suggifient acreage.What surprised me they would come for four acres. Now that company is about a hour from me. I need to find them again and find out what their requirements are now.
Thanks for the suggestion of the web site.
David, my wife has a first cousin who had taken a product line and done a very good job developing the brand and has my guessing about 6 people working for him with milling corn products and selling both in wholesale and direct. Said he is running at full capacity. Has been at it a few years. Like your business diversacation. Have you found any nature or organic treatment for the grass? Years ago geese were used in certain crops in the South as they eat grass. You can even hear them called "grassers" by some still.
A crop big here is deer corn. A bag of corn sells for around $8. That price seems to be the same if sold by a store or the farmer direct. I did this one year and if you will deliever will help the size of the sale. That is on the cob. Shelled corn sells for about the same and some hunters perfer one over the other. Do suggest a grain trailer if you use a picker. I have sold shelled corn to a hunter. He paid a little over what the grain company was paying and left it in storage with them to pickup as he wanted it.
Stumbled onto there are produce processing plants who will come in with crew and gather the crop if you have suggifient acreage.What surprised me they would come for four acres. Now that company is about a hour from me. I need to find them again and find out what their requirements are now.
Thanks for the suggestion of the web site.
