First impressions of AMSOIL 20W50

[KentT]

I spent about 2.5 hours with the minihoe today, after I'd changed the hydraulic oil to AMSOIL 20W50. My first impression is that there is a noticeable difference when its hot -- not an incredible difference, but still a significant one.

I was taking advantage of a very dry summer, digging a deeper drainage ditch in a mucky spot that typically has running water. The new ditch is 2.5ft - 3ft deep, and I'm hoping to lower the water table enough there so that the area will firm up. I was working in a thick muck that I'd churned up with the tires that was over 6" deep in spots -- so sticky/mucky that I had to stop several times and use a stick to clean out the bucket, since jarring it wouldn't dislodge it. Because I couldn't straddle the ditch line, I had to drive up to it, dig out a bucketfull, back out and dump it, then drive back up. All this driving in it churned up a mess...

I never had ANY torque problems at all, and could still occasionally spin a tire even after 2-plus hours of use. No PT waggle needed -- just find the correct treadle position and it would slowly pull itself out of any condition -- I was dragging the belly-pan of the tractor fairly often. In comparison, last weekend I worked in there briefly with the grapple bucket, skimming off the fallen limbs and leaves. Twice I was mired down -- not even to the belly-pan, like today -- and had to "waggle" my way out -- I was just about ready to get the come-along. The wheelmotors would just whine then -- no spinning -- and just sit there. Not today -- even dragging the belly-pan, I was never in a position that I had to waggle to get out of...

So, my first impression is that it was $200 well spent.... I certainly can't tell what cold-weather starting will be like, since the heat index was well over 100 degrees today. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[Dargo]

Thanks for the info. I am currently very displeased with the treadle pedal (sp?) that controls the hydro on my HST Kubota tractor. The pedal is entirely too sensitive and it is impossible to mow without using the cruise control. The slightest bump causes the my foot to tap down slightly on the hydro pedal and let off. This starts a series of violent revolutions that really doesn't stop until I completely let off of the hydro pedal or mash it to the floor. I'm wondering if a change to Amsoil like you did would help.

Basically, the hydro pedal on the HST Kubota tractors is a very, very poor design. I even get the lame excuse from Kubota that the jerking I get is "the nature of the beast". If I cannot get the issue under control, it will be the nature of someone else's beast. I won't keep it.

Please update on any other benefits or problems you notice.

 

[MuncyBob]

It has been posted that even the PT has a similar reaction when travelling over rough terrain...although probably not to the extreme you have indicated. Mr. 14 has a home made mod to the treadles that is very effective to help control the treadle better....I opted for the easy(lazy) out on this and had Power Trac send me a pair of heavy springs that fit under each treadle and they too have been effective..I'm actually surprised one has not popped out yet!

 

[MuncyBob]

Keep us informed on your experiences!! I plan to also change my hydro oil at the next 50 hour filter change......interesting as to what you have noticed so far, I would not have thought the oil change would have made that much of a difference. I will be changing primarily for the cold weather operations...I say this as the sweat has been dripping off me all day long!

 

[Gravy]

Kent,

Thanks for the info. I've had equivalent issues trying to climb steep grades with loose surfaces (crumbling slate). Once the fluid reaches equilibrium temperature, it can be virtually impossible to find a treadle position between "whines but doesn't move" and " spins or stalls, but still doesn't move".

I'll be really curious to see how the cold weather starting goes.
I've been tempted by the Amsoil "0"W50 (can any oil REALLY be 0 weight?), but I want more real-world info before I make that investment.

I know Fourteen endorses Amsoil hydraulic fluid, but he lives in flatter terrain in a warmer climate than I do. What works for him might not be right for me.

Keep us informed!

Gravy

 

[KentT]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( ......interesting as to what you have noticed so far, I would not have thought the oil change would have made that much of a difference. )</font>

I attribute this to:

1. The old oil was surprisingly dark and smelled slightly burnt -- surprising because there's no combustion going on here, and the oil temps should never get above 150 degrees or so. I think it was certainly time for a change... especially since I could see contaminants in the bottom of the drain pan that I caught it in. I had originally considered trying to "reuse" this oil as chain/bar oil for chainsaws, since we're going through a lot of bar oil clearing my property. So, I carefully washed my drain pain and two 5-gallon plastic buckets to catch and hold all of it. After seeing the condition of the oil, I decided "No Way!" and poured it into the 1-gallon AMSOIL jugs to take to recycling...

2. The new oil is not only thicker, it also has higher "shear resistance" and less foaming, according to AMSOIL. Wheel motors would seem to be very prone to "shearing" the oil, since they are essentially a large oil pump running in reverse. As previously described, any foaming would reduce the power transmitted to the wheel motors, because the tiny air bubbles can compress while liquids cannot...

So, I think the difference is because the old oil was worn out, while the new, fresh synthetic oil is thicker and handles the stress of the wheelmotors better. Just think -- 250 hours on a car engine going 50mph would be 12,500 miles... and while there's no combustion byproducts to contaminate the oil or raise its temperature, the wheelmotors are probably quite demanding...

 

[SnowRidge]

<font color="blue"> ( The wheelmotors would just whine then -- no spinning -- and just sit there. Not today -- even dragging the belly-pan, I was never in a position that I had to waggle to get out of...) </font>

Interesting. I have never experienced this, nor have I had to waggle to get out of anything. I wonder if this was part of the reason behind the change to the "high torque" wheel motors?

The dark, burned oil doesn't sound good. Do I understand correctly that your machine has just 250 hours on it? I wonder if there was an oil cooler failure at some point. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[KentT]

This 425 has the old-style wheelmotors with lower torque... I know that Rich had a couple of incidents with blown fuses on the fan for the hydraulic cooler. It now has 259 hours...

This used oil doesn't smell as strongly as what comes out of a car, but it still smellls burnt . Draining out of the tank, it looked dark brown, yet you could still see through it, though barely. However, it looks black when in large quantities, like in a pail or 1 gallon jug.

 

[BobRip]

I changed my PT422 to Mobil 1 15w 50 *synethetic oil) after around 100 hours. The old oil looked good, but I was not satisfied with the abilty to go up hills once the oil got hot. I felt that I noticed a substantial improvement in climbing ability when hot. My satisfaction with the 422 has definately improved with this change. I with I had a way to measure it.

Bob RIp

 

[duane]

Kent,

Did it take the full 10 gallons, or something slightly more or less.

Duane