First Tractor

[sciguy2902]

I am in the market for a tractor and would appreciate any advice or comments.
I recently purchased 13 acres with the following:

1 acre with the house that is fenced in, cut with riding mower
gravel driveway about 750 ft long
2.5 acres wooded that I would like to keep fairly clear of undergrowth
8 acres cleared pasture (previously had cattle)
1.5 acres cleared but low level, frequently holds water

My initial objective is to keep the pasture cut and maintain the gravel drive. Eventually I hope to do some farming- I'm thinking citrus, grapes, mayhaw, maybe a little corn. I expect I'll buy a horse in the next year or two and could possibly stable a few extras for some income which could involve growing a little hay.

The only local dealer sells Kubota which I have heard are good tractors but a little on the expensive side. They currently have 0% financing for 36 months which seems like a good way to go for me, a first time buyer. I can re-visit the dealer if I have any questions or problems and I could easily get burned on a used tractor since I don't know exactly what I'm looking at.

My questions:

1. How much tractor do I need? The dealers I've talked to suggested the L3240 or the L3540. The argument for the 32 HP is that it is just as good as the 35 and the difference is minimal and not worth an extra $1500. The case for the 35 is that 3 HP is a big difference (~10%) for a small tractor and every little bit helps. A friend of mine with 8 acres has a 42 HP but that seems like more than I need.

2. Are the more expensive transmissions worth the money? I don't consider a tractor a pleasure vehicle so I'd just as soon save the money and shift the darn thing, besides, how much shifting am I going to do? On the other hand, I'm not getting younger (doing pretty good for 50) and I don't won't to have to struggle in 10-15 years if I still want to keep at it. Still, I'm leaning toward the DT since I think I can handle any shifting required.

3. Should I get a front loader? This seems like my best chance to save some money as they are asking $3500 or more. I don't see any immediate use for one but how easy is it to add one later? I would eventually like to move some dirt and possibly fill some of the low areas and/or create a pond so I'll need something. Will a loader do the trick? The only use I can see for one immediately is to pick up trunk sections of a large pine tree that fell and move them to the wooded area but I don't expect to have trees fall very ofter. Are there other uses that would justify the cost? I'm also getting conflicting advice on the loader model, 514 vs. 724. Is the difference worth $600?

4. Is a box blade necessary to maintain the gravel drive? I know their not that expensive but the drive looks to be in decent shape and I can't imagine it will require a tremendous amount of work. I'm filling in a few low areas that puddle when it rains. That's going pretty well just hauling small loads in a van. Do gravel roads deteriorate quickly enough to buy the box?

5. Is there much difference in bush hogs? I figure 5 ft is good enough but some salesmen are pushing Woods while others say it doesn't really matter. It's not a huge expense so I'm inclined to go with a good new one. Don't most of them have pretty good longevity?


Lastly, if anyone wants to argue that I should get a used tractor or another brand I'll certainly listen. The more I hear the sooner I'll get up to speed and doing some positive things with my land.

Thanks for any help.

 

[RoyJackson]

With a manual gearbox, you select the gear you intend to work with and leave it in that gear. You don't shift up through the gears like you'd do with a manual tranny in a car. As an example, if you wanted to drive on the road, you put the tranny in top gear and drive away.

Selection of your working gear would depend upon conditions.
That 8 acres of pasture would be field mowing (brush cutting) with a rotary cutter. If the field is flat and rut free, you could move along at a fairly good clip (3-5 MPH) although I suggest you go very slow the first time you cut it (since you don't know what's under the growth).
The same would apply to that 1.5 acres of low level field.
Keeping the undergrowth down (in the wooded area) would require slow going and maybe a fair amount of shifting between a forward gear and reverse.

Other then the wooded area, the manual would be fine. The wooded area may require a substantial amount of shifting (depending on how thick the trees are) and would be the only reason I would consider a hydro (although I'd prefer a power reverser tranny before the hydro...but that's just a preference). With Deere's, low gear and reverse are in line, so shifting is quite easy and quick.

If there's a choice between the transmission type and getting a loader, I'd definitely go for the loader first. The justification is the loader might be essential to help you out of a soggy area of the low lying pasture. It'll be handy for filling in that area too, but that's probably a better job to contract out to a professional with a bull dozer.
And, the loader would be available for a lot of other tasks. When I'm field mowing, I always have the loader on to counterbalance the weight of the rotary cutter (commonly referred to as a bush hog) and to push over or give me warning of any hidden obstacles under the growth.

I do suggest you go with a 72" rotary cutter if possible. The limiting factor would the the wooded areas. That cutter has to go between those trees.

With a 72" cutter, I think 25 PTO HP would be in order.

As far as buying a box blade...nope, I wouldn't buy any implement until I've lived on the property for a while. You can better assess your needs then. Those low areas on the drive can be filled with the loader and a pile of gravel.

As far as buying used equpment...definitely, if you can find what you're looking for. Try Used Farm Equipment & Agricultural Equipment - John Deere MachineFinder.com. Even though that's got Deere on it, you can select which brand you're interested in.
If you buy used (and that's all I ever do), I'd stick with the local dealer brand.

Since Kubota is the only local dealer, it's probably advisable to go with that brand. If there are other brand dealers within 25 miles, I'd suggest you look there too. Personally, I'll stick with the better known brands (Deere, Kubota, New Holland), but there's a number of folks on TBN that will disagree with that limitation.

However, when it comes to recommending which Kubotas would suit your needs, I'll defer to those with more experience in that brand.

In conclusion:
25 PTO HP or a bit more.
4 Wheel Drive (aka MFWD or Mechanical Front Wheel Drive)
Manual Transmission (or power reverser, if available)
R-1 Ag tires for the best traction in the wooded area and the low lying field. Suggest you get them filled too.
Front End Loader with a Ballast Box (dealer should throw this in as part of the deal)

72" rotary cutter (if it'll fit between the trees in the wooded area)

Those would be my priorities. Good luck in your selection!

 

[jbrumberg]

sciguy2902:

Welcome to TBN ! I agree with RoyJackson on everything except the size of the tractor. You could get by with a slightly smaller tractor (high 20's HP/ low 20's PTO HP) if you want to stay with 60" attachments which would obviously increase your mowing time etc. A smaller frame tractor would be more manuverable in your woods along with a smaller rotary cutter. I would recommend a FEL especially if you anticipate acquiring a
4WD manure maker. FEL's are incredibly useful for tasks you can not even imagine yet. I would also recommend HST for its ease of operation especially if you get a FEL. There are many competitive rotary cutters in the market and most your major brands come in light, medium, and heavy duty models. The differences between models include thickness of construction (weight), gearbox ratings, PTO HP requirements, blade speed, etc. When comparing RC's make sure you are comparing similar units (ie LD to LD). The difference between models is a HD RC (in theory) can smash a 2'' diameter sapling (@5HP/Foot Rule) whereas a LD RC could smash a ~1" diameter sapling. Good luck on your research and aquisition activities and keep the posts coming . Jay

PS: I maintain ~12.5 acres (~7A's open/~5A's wooded) with what is identified in my signature.

 

[ToadHill]

One more comment on the loader, I "tractored" for over 20 years without a loader, it can be done. Now that I have a loader, I don't know how I did it.

 

[Z-Michigan]

I pretty much agree with Roy's comments, and mostly with Jay's comments except that I think a FEL is optional if you don't have significant, immediate uses for one. They are easy to add later to any common brand (including Kubota).

I don't think you need to get a box blade right away for your driveway. I have a 1300' gravel driveway (900' from road to house) and have not improved it in any way since getting a tractor. With very light traffic, even though some of it is large trucks, it doesn't seem to require much maintenance. However, the box blade might be useful for some of your other tasks.

1 acre with the house that is fenced in, cut with riding mower
gravel driveway about 750 ft long
2.5 acres wooded that I would like to keep fairly clear of undergrowth
8 acres cleared pasture (previously had cattle)
1.5 acres cleared but low level, frequently holds water

My initial objective is to keep the pasture cut and maintain the gravel drive. Eventually I hope to do some farming- I'm thinking citrus, grapes, mayhaw, maybe a little corn. I expect I'll buy a horse in the next year or two and could possibly stable a few extras for some income which could involve growing a little hay.

With your amount of land I think you have a choice of having either pasture OR hayfield. A meaningful pasture (enough grass growing for one or more horses to eat) will be 2+ acres, preferably 2 acres per horse. If you want to board 3 horses and own one, there goes your 8 acres. Nice thing is that 8 acres is already fenced in. A hayfield of 8 acres or less will not produce huge amounts of hay - it will be enough to feed 3-8 horses for the winter (depending how productive it is and how long your winters are), maybe slightly more, but far from commercial scale. Shrink it to maybe 4 acres because you're using 4 as pasture, and it becomes pretty small. You also would have a hard time justifying cost of hay tools for 8 acres or less (actually, hay tools probably don't make sense til you have 20-30+ acres). Best bet would be getting a local farmer to do hay work for you, but if you want to board horses I would likely do all pasture, splitting the 8 acres into 2-4 parcels to allow rotational grazing, and plan to buy hay for winter needs.

 

[jbrumberg]

One more comment on the loader, I "tractored" for over 20 years without a loader, it can be done. Now that I have a loader, I don't know how I did it.

ToadHill: I can relate to you perfectly. My old Ford 1100 did not have a FEL either. jay

 

[Erik_in_Hoyt]

I have a shuttle shift on my machine and like it a lot. Hydrostat makes me nervous - too many ways for it to go wrong, but that's just my prejudice talking and there are a lot of happy folks out there who love it.
Loader is a very good thing - you will be amazed at the number of things you use it for.
I have a 35 hp tractor with mfwd, shuttle shift, loader, a 5' brush hog I picked up used for cheap, and 66" box blade. I don't mow enough to justify a 6' mower, and this one is small enough to fit between trees in my rough pasture. the 35 HP is overkill for the type of things I do on the land, but I wanted the extra loader capacity as I'm using it as a construction tool on my house. (95 tons of native limestone makes for a unique retaining wall, but I don't know many smaller tractors that can pick up 1000 pound rocks)
I use my box blade as a counterweight, too - I made a bracket to stack buckets of concrete on it instead of having a dedicated counterweight.

I'd suggest buying the loader now - because you can roll the extra cost into the loan and spread it out over those 36 interest free months rather than having to come up with a spare $3500 or so in a lump in the future. (keep in mind hayburners are really just a pretty way to convert grass into fertilizer at a rate of 30-50 pounds a day per head, and a loader is a good way to save your back!)
I'd also look at purchasing any implements you think you might need (within reason) at the same time for that reason and also a lot of dealers will cut you a pretty decent deal on attachments purchased with the tractor. (I got my pallet forks and box blade pretty close to cost which saved me about $500 over buying them separately)

happy hunting/shopping and good luck!

 

[texasjohn]

A FEL about doubles the uses that I put my tractor to..... very worthwhile, I recommend getting it when you get the tractor... plan for a way to put extra weight on rear so you remain balanced.

 

[3RRL]

Boy,
The other guys sure gave you some great input, especially Roy's post. It's great that TBN'ers take the time to post this information.
I would go with the loader too. It will become an integral part of your tractor work for sure. My only addition is to also consider getting the boxblade. That too IMO, will become a valuable asset for a number of chores.

 

[VABlue]

IMO, all tractors should come with a loader. The option should be to remove it! Keep in mind that, in addition to everything the bucket can do, it can be removed for even more uses. Think forks, bale spear, blade, sweeper... It is the implement you'll get the most use out of by far...

 

[sciguy2902]

I couldn't agree more! This is the best, most efficient, most helpful web posting I've ever made. Thanks for the great info. My thinking at the moment is to get the FEL but hold off on the box. That way I can feel like I'm being prudent and saving a little money.

Are there any real differences in different loaders or are they all pretty much the same?

There wasn't much discussion on the tractor size/HP. I get the impression the 32 HP should be enough for my small place.

Can a 32 HP tractor handle a 6 ft cutter or should I stick with the 5 ft? I'm a high school teacher in my other life so I have plenty of time during the summer to cut the pastures. It doesn't seem like an extra 12 inches would make a big difference cutting 8 acres. The wooded acres don't have a lot of trees but the maneuverability would still be nice with a smaller cutter.

Thanks again for the advice, y'all have been quite helpful.

 

[VABlue]

Whatever loader comes with the machine you choose will be correctly sized for that machine. I don't believe there are many options to choose from in that regard other than bucket width. Get the biggest bucket available. For the RC size, I'll let someone with experience field that...

 

[Z-Michigan]

I think 32 PTO hp will be enough for a 6' mower in most conditions. Basically, unless you have extremely thick, tough grass, it should be enough.

Mowing 8 acres will take a while even with a 6' mower. I think the 6' will save enough time relative to a 5' to be worth it. I for one don't enjoy my mowing time very much.

As for loaders, I generally recommend whatever the manufacturer of the tractor offers. There are significant differences in lift capacity, height, and operating speed, but unless you have specific loader tasks (e.g. round bales of X weight) this probably won't affect your choice of machine much. There are also aftermarket loaders, some of which are very good (IMHO, Woods) but I would still lean towards the tractor maker's loader.

 

[DonWorrell]

When buying a mower, (rotary cutter), try to get one as wide as your rear wheels at least. Size of tractor needed? Here is a formula, 5 horsepower for each 1 foot of cutter/mower. Even in tough grass this will work. All you need to do is work in a lower gear. Don't allow engine to bog down. Keep engine RPMs at 2000 or so at all times. It helps the cutter and the tractor.

Don

 

[3RRL]

Yeah, I would go with the 6 footer cutter.
It might not seem a lot at first, but with 8 acres + to cut, it will make quite a difference in time and money. 20% to be exact ... assuming you get full cut with each. Although not directly proportional, you can apply that towards savings in fuel and wear and tear on the tractor, or other "must do" chores.

It would be great to get a quick attach fel so you can switch your bucket to other things like has been mentioned.

 

[sandman2234]

I have two tractors and went next door and borrowed a little bitty one that has a loader. Wanted to take one of mine back instead of his, but I thought he might notice the difference.
A loader has many, many uses. Definitely on my dream list...
A boxblade makes nice work out of a dirt or gravel road. The amount of hp you have pulling it matters a little, but the strength of it matters more.
I sometimes maintain the road going back to my inlaws house. The other day I was doing it and one of the wives from further down the road wanted to know if I would go to the end, and how about some gas money? I did it and two days later it rained cats and dogs, so it needs doing again. Your maintance frequency will depend on location, which should be listed in your profile. Snow bound people seem to like loaders also.
David from jax

 

[Grrrr]

Can a 32 HP tractor handle a 6 ft cutter or should I stick with the 5 ft? I'm a high school teacher in my other life so I have plenty of time during the summer to cut the pastures. It doesn't seem like an extra 12 inches would make a big difference cutting 8 acres. The wooded acres don't have a lot of trees but the maneuverability would still be nice with a smaller cutter.

Thanks again for the advice, y'all have been quite helpful.

There are two schools of thought in mower size relative to tractor size. If you went with the 5' mower i heavy going you will be able to keep going at a reasnable speed without bogging the mower down.

When the going wasn't so tough you would be able to go virtually as fast as you can sit on the seat.

When the going was easy you will wish you had the bigger cutter.

With a six foot mower in heavy going you will be crawling along pretty slowly to avoid bogging the engine down to much. You will wish you had the smaller cutter as you would be going faster and probably covering more ground than you would with the 6'.

In eaasier going you will be able to work quite quickly but not driving along as fast as you could be with a 5' cutter.

When the going was very light you would be glad you had the bigger cutter as you would be able to go pretty fast.

If you were mowing on a slope where you would want to be going slow anyway, the bigger mower would be better as you would get more ground covered.

A bigger mower is also going to put more weight behind the tractor so carrying it when transporting from one field to another is more difficult / dangerous.

Where we live in England we have a six foot cutter behind a MF135 (38 engine pto) It is a physically larger tractor that a CUT but doesnn't have a lot more power than your tractor. We are mainly cutting grass and weeds with it but also use it on heavier stuff like bracken and goarse. I find in use I can go as fast as is comfortable to sit on. There is very little that will slow this combination down. If it had a bigger cutter I would have to go slower and probably wouldn't get as much cut. It is also much easier in confined space.

We also have a bigger tractor (meant to be about 70 pto hp, doubt it puts that out now) which we sometimes put a 10ft cutter behind. This gets used a lot less than the smaller combination becuase the you have to go pretty slow not to bog the tractor down. Even with a much wider cut it is not faster than the little Massey and is a lot hard to manouver around our small fields.

As you can see, it depends on your ground conditions and what you are going to be cutting as to how big a cutter you get.

Enough of my ramblings now

Happy Tractoring

 

[PA hayseed]

I cut 8 acres all the time, if it helps, I am looking at a bigger tractor and a bigger cutter. Mine cuts 5' now. On a nice day, with the ground softened by a previous rain, I don't mind spending a couple hours on the tractor. On a hot scorcher, with the ground hard as cement, I want off that tractor fast. When I have something to do, and I have to cut grass, it really makes me curse how long I am on it.

My current tractor has a FEL and a rear blade, is 28hp, and can't do enough for me. It is HST, but no cruise control. The HST is nice when I get by the woodline and dodge in and out, as the HST allows me to go slow, fast, forward and back all on one foot pedal.

The other nice feature about the HST is that my kid likes to ride on the tractor with me (yes I know how wrong I am) and I dont have to worry about shifting with her in the way. But when I was hauling shale and gravel for my drive, and digging into the 42 tons of stuff laying there, I kinda lost alot of love for the HST.

As far as what other people said, you can't go wrong with the FEL. If your driveway is that big you will definetly use it for so many things. I don't see FEL loosing to much of their value over time either. I would like to have a bigger FEL, as hauling a triaxle worth of shale from the dump site to the designated area (700 ft) took forever with the small FEL. When I say forever, I mean I was at it for several days after work until the sun went down.

Well I wish you luck, just don't do what I did and buy too small of a tractor or you will be shopping for a new one like I am.

 

[putt_putt_green]

I would also suggest getting rear SCV with the tractor. This gives you the option to get a hydraulic top link. Makes using a boxblade about 10 times more useful.

As far as bucket width, I'd get one about the width of the tractor. Easier to manuever and takes up less spaces for parking.

 

[Erik_in_Hoyt]

I have a 6' "easy dump" bucket on my loader, a 66" wide box blade which cuts just wider than my rear wheels, and a 5' HD brush cutter - which I can pull through about anything the tractor will drive through at whatever speed the tractor feels safe at. 6' would be nice, but the price was right on this one and it works fine in the small spaces I "get" to work in doing odd bits for the neighbors here and there.
Loader uses a skid steer type QA system, so it takes less than 5 minutes to dismount the bucket and hook up my pallet forks -- this is a good thing!
Hydraulic top link is geting very tempting. (and yes, I have a set of rear remotes that were standard on the machine when I got it, which was one of the selling points)
no HST on mine, but I'm very fond of the shuttle shift as I've said before - and the column/hand throttle works like a cruise control.
betweeen the loader and the box blade it only took me 1 1/2 hours to spread out 23 tons of 3" gravel for a parking pad - and the box blade does good double duty as a counterweight.