Ford 4600 solenoid wiring

[geoffst]

Hi Dave

Here is the rest of the story.....the tractor hasn't started well for some time and a few months back it wouldn't start at all so I decided to replace the old parts since nothing had been touched for many years. I replaced the cables, battery and starter. Unfortunately the day I did it was very cold and since I was having trouble even feeling my fingers I managed to strip most of the copper studs when bolting on the wires and therefore didn't get a good connection. I took the starter off and then worked on the solenoid but couldn't get it apart to replace the studs so I bought a new solenoid on ebay. I normally take pictures before removing things but this time I didn't so I just did the best I could to rewire things...obviously incorrectly. Thanks for your help. View attachment 359416View attachment 359417View attachment 359418

The starter has no name on it anywhere....

 

[geoffst]

here is the link to the starter that I purchased......

New Starter Ford Tractor Farm 4330 4340 4400 4410 4500 4600 4610 5100 5200 | eBay

 

[geoffst]

Is there an easy way to bypass the solenoid and bench test the starter directly?

 

[Dave M7040]

Is there an easy way to bypass the solenoid and bench test the starter directly?

Geoff
Your Lucas style or clone starter is unusual in that there are two connections coming from the body of the starter. This makes me a little hesitant in just having you jump in.
Could you do this one test for me. Provide power to the main bat terminal on the starter and then put power to extend the starter gear as you had done previously.
While the gear is extended, using a light of some kind, either a test light or 12 volt bulb with leads, ground one lead and then touch the other lead to each of the lower terminals on the solenoid. The one with the copper bar going to the insulated stud and then to the terminal with the braided wire connected to it. If you get power to each of these terminals it would be useful to know.
This afternoon I am going to drop in to see a local guy whose business is starter repair and should him your picture to see if he has any wisdom to give me. I have to get him in a good mood to provide free advice
Sorry I cannot be more direct as this time but don't want to have you post that a large cloud of acrid smoke came out of the starter.
Where is Maple Ridge?
Dave M7040

 

[geoffst]

Thanks Dave. Maple Ridge is in New Brunswick

 

[geoffst]

I hooked it back up and tested both terminals (with the copper bar going to the insulated stud and with the braided wire connected to it) and I get power to each of them - used a light tester I just picked up at Canadian Tire.

 

[Dave M7040]

I hooked it back up and tested both terminals (with the copper bar going to the insulated stud and with the braided wire connected to it) and I get power to each of them - used a light tester I just picked up at Canadian Tire.

I took the picture of your starter to a guy who has a business repairing starters and alternators. He explained that your solenoid is a two stage one. For example, if the starter gear did not engage with the flywheel gear when you turned the key to start, the solenoid would apply power to the braided wire which supplies one field coil. This would cause the starter to rotate slightly so that the gears could mesh. The action of the gear extending fully allows the hardware inside the solenoid to complete the circuit to supply power to the insulated stud connected with the copper bar. This powers all the field coils and the starter rotates with full power.

The fact that you are finding power at both terminals with the test light makes me very suspicious that something is wrong inside the starter. However, there is a stud on the rear cover of the starter which should have a large ground wire connected to it. I don't think this is any different than grounding the case of the starter but it would be prudent to try it this way.
Dave M7040

 

[geoffst]

I tried grounding to the stud and got power the same as before......

 

[Dave M7040]

At this point all I can suggest is to try touching the positive battery cable to the insulated stud on the starter case with the ground cable connected to the case or the stud you just tried. If the starter does not spin then you need to find a starter repair shop. Sorry I cannot think of anything else to do.
Dave m7040

 

[geoffst]

Hi Dave

Well, it didn't spin....so I took the end off the starter and discovered that two of the four brushes had broken loose....the welds were broken.

So, I have purchased a new brush holder (with the two brushes attached) from Ebay for $16.

Thanks so much for your help! I learned a lot.

Geoff