Ford and General motors alliance/merger discussion.

[HGM]

Not sure of your experience but with over 80 F350-F550 chassis in our fleet and Ford reps with no solutions to the problems Navistar chassis don't have with the same blocks.... that's been our experience. Care to elaborate?

Techinically I cant go to deep into it..... But for the others reading I would clarify a bit... I can assure you that the electronics you speak of primarily caused programing issuesonly.... You are correct that the engine is essentially the same with a few small differences.... Both companies are seeing injector, turbo, hi pressure oil sytem, and head gasket issues.... Many of these issues are greatly magnified(or caused by) by customer perception and operation....

Check your PM...

 

[IH3444]

HGM, no one makes flawless cars, but why Oh why is Toyota out selling the US National brands. Toyota has also expanded by building a new pickup truck plant in Texas that will increase it's output 6 fold. Millions, and millions of consumers can't be snookered like that.

 

[HGM]

HGM, no one makes flawless cars, but why Oh why is Toyota out selling the US National brands. Toyota has also expanded by building a new pickup truck plant in Texas that will increase it's output 6 fold. Millions, and millions of consumers can't be snookered like that.

Personally I believe they already have....... A large portion of the population(from what I have seen) is so taken with a blind alegience to Toyota/Honda(in particular) due to their reputation I mentioned earlier... These people also, will not even look at American made cars because of an ingrained perception that the quality is not there... In some cases it may not be, but overall if you wanted to look into it, you would find that the quality is much closer(or with American cars exceding in some cases) than you may want to believe.. And, so now because they will be making trucks here, they must be supporting our economy, right?? Hope you dont actually believe that....

 

[_RaT_]

Personally I believe they already have....... A large portion of the population(from what I have seen) is so taken with a blind alegience to Toyota/Honda(in particular) due to their reputation I mentioned earlier... These people also, will not even look at American made cars because of an ingrained perception that the quality is not there... In some cases it may not be, but overall if you wanted to look into it, you would find that the quality is much closer(or with American cars exceding in some cases) than you may want to believe.. And, so now because they will be making trucks here, they must be supporting our economy, right?? Hope you dont actually believe that....

I thought jobs always supported an economy, some more then others. I would think anyway that if Toyota is going to build a vehicle here in the US that is better then building it in Canada, Mexico, etc. Whether it is accurate or not I do not know, but I have read that a Toyota Tundra has more manufactured and assembled parts in their trucks from the US then the trucks from GM, Ford or Chrysler. What ever the case, if the US automakers don't get on a streamlined track like the Japanese auto companies, they are doomed. Pensions, medical, R&D, and automation being areas where reform is needed to stay competitive. After 5 vehicles from US automakers, namely Ford, I know where their shortcomings are. I don't give blind allegiance to anyone and I certainly am not one to give Ford or GM a pat on the back when none is deserved. I'll buy what I find to be the best value.

 

[dmccarty]

Back in the 80's Chrysler made the Laser and Eagle Talon. Remember Eagle? Mitsubushi had Eclipse. At least the Laser and Exclipse where/are? made in Normal Ill. Consumer Reports had ratings on both car. Care to guess which car was better? Which car had lower reported problems?

It was not the "American" made car. It was the Japanese product made in the US at the same plant as the American car.

Some snookering was going on.

Later,
Dan

 

[HGM]

I thought jobs always supported an economy, some more then others. I would think anyway that if Toyota is going to build a vehicle here in the US that is better then building it in Canada, Mexico, etc. Whether it is accurate or not I do not know, but I have read that a Toyota Tundra has more manufactured and assembled parts in their trucks from the US then the trucks from GM, Ford or Chrysler. What ever the case, if the US automakers don't get on a streamlined track like the Japanese auto companies, they are doomed. Pensions, medical, R&D, and automation being areas where reform is needed to stay competitive. After 5 vehicles from US automakers, namely Ford, I know where their shortcomings are. I don't give blind allegiance to anyone and I certainly am not one to give Ford or GM a pat on the back when none is deserved. I'll buy what I find to be the best value.

Very true.... It will help to a degree by employing American workers.. The problem comes when it is broken down to figure out where the majority of the money is spent.. The majority of the money is spent in R&D and other areas(in other countries).. The actuall assembly of the parts is really quite small, so it does much less for the economy than some might think.. Unfortunatly, the American car companies are being forced overseas in order to compete because of labor costs...

Your last couple sentences are only fair... I completely respect that opinion and cannot blame you the least.. That is an educated purchase...

 

[kenmac]

I'am glad I read this info. I was looking to buy a ford with powerstroke. Guess I'll stay away from the powerstroke

 

[HGM]

I'am glad I read this info. I was looking to buy a ford with powerstroke. Guess I'll stay away from the powerstroke

Keep in mind if you read up on most high volume products, you will hear of failures....Everything can break, doing your homework is always a good idea.. I wouldnt hesitate to own one myself, but I also know how to run it...

 

[Dargo]

As many likely know, I have worked with the auto industry for quite a while now. This talk between Ford and GM has been going on since early this year. It was an intentional 'leak' to the press last week that we are hearing about. For numerous reasons, I hope both companies pull through.

On an interesting note, out of all the new vehicles I've purchased in my life, one was bought back by the manufacturer under the Lemon Law. Care to guess what manufacturer made the vehicle? Toyota. I bought a Toyota Avalon and it was positively the worst vehicle I've ever owned. As part of my negotiations with Toyota, I ended up buying another Avalon with most of the money I received from Toyota. I should have known better, it was an absolute POS as well.

 

[dooleysm]

I've seen several places, but have no sources to back this up, that American companies are severely handicapped by their pensions. The number I've seen are in the thousands of dollars per vehicle that go to paying pensions and other union benefits, whereas the foreign manufacturers pay less than $500/vehicle in employee benefits.

The blind alegience problem works both ways. My wife and her family consider it a sin of unforgivable proportions to own anything other than a Chevy. Me? I couldn't care less what name is on the vehicle I'm driving. As long as it's paid for, it suits me just fine.