Found two Volts in the spicket

   / Found two Volts in the spicket #11  
Several winters ago my wife kept telling me she got shocked every time she touched the shower head. I touched the shower head and never had a problem. I basically thought she was nuts until I happened to step on the drain while touching the shower head. I am a foot taller than her so when she was adjusting the showerhead she was always standing on the drain and I never was. I measured over 5 volts between the drain and the showerhead. We were living in an old farmhouse so I figured something was rubbing on something and started trouble shooting. We were on a well so I shut off the well pump, hot water heater etc. eventually turning the whole darn box off but found that I still had over 5 volts at the shower head. I had the electrician come out. He measured almost 5 volts with his better meter. He grounded everything (and I mean everything) with all copper rods, brass clamps and grounding cable he had on the truck and was only able to get down to around 3 volts. I called the power company several times telling them the problem. They had little interest in my plight instead telling me to call an electrician.
I really am a surgeon and often perform minor surgeries in the office under local anesthesia. Sitting still for 60 minutes is really boring so we try to have a relaxed OR with distracting conversation. We were just getting started when my wife calls the office and has the nurse relay to me that she put the trough heater in the new Rubbermaid trough (the old trough was galvanized metal) and now the horses will not drink at all. My wife had measured over three volts between the trough and the ground and wanted me to ask around and find another electrician. As the nurse is relaying this to me my patient starts to ask questions. I told him whole long tale. Turns out he is one of the senior inspectors for the power company. When I got home that night I had three power company trucks up by the barn. They finally found that I had a 50+ year old transformer that has essentially been forgotten by the power company. Om this transformer there was a bad ground wire on. They replaced the ground wire and the potential difference dropped to almost nothing. They said that when they replaced the transformer that it would be undetectable. The power company guys also told me that ground current is common and that it is a particular problem on farms. While it is rare to have enough voltage for humans to detect the problem comes from the fact that animals can detect very low voltages and will not drink from “hot” water.
 
   / Found two Volts in the spicket
  • Thread Starter
#12  
Thanks everybody for suggestions and stories - I will put it in good use and let you know what was the problem when I find it.

As always, if nobody on TBN has a solution to a problem - the problem either does not exist or is not worth solving. Amazing knowledge base we got here, truly amazing:)
 
   / Found two Volts in the spicket #13  
Boy are you right about that!

I thought about this last night; I believe that Shimon is right, this is an abnormal condition as you have current passing through ground. Surgeon's story, as well as the leg on the washing machine story both cement the thought.

Please let us know what you find.
 
   / Found two Volts in the spicket #14  
My ex-father-in-law had 3-phase power run to his barn shop to power up a lathe with a 3-phase motor. Since the cable only had three wires, the power company wired single-phase to ground using a grounding rod outside the barn. The nearest other ground rod was on a pole about 150' away.

My ex-FIL was distressed that when he ran his lathe, the fluorescent lights in the barn would dim or go off. Also, if the ground was dry, when he opened/closed his iron gate it would spark. His animals refused to go anywhere near the barn.

I didn't know how the barn was wired, but when I measured the gate to the fence, I got 45 volts with the lights turned "on" in the barn. With a little investigation, I discovered the ground wiring and started laughing so hard that I think it irritated my ex-FIL. I asked him if he had a roll of copper wire, and he did.

I rolled the copper out over the top of the ground between the barn ground rod and the power pole ground rod. All the while I was working, he was telling me about the three guys (electricians and one engineer) who had gone away scratching their heads. I hard wired the two ground rods together and told him to turn on his lights and run his lathe. Suddenly, everything worked perfectly. There was no more voltage on his gate and fence that ran from the barn past the power pole.

I think he buried the copper wire underground and it is probably still there today. I don't believe he ever got the barn wired correctly, so it is just sitting there waiting to happen again if the ground wire breaks.

This doesn't have much to do with your problem, Prokop, but it just demonstrates how things happen and are left for the next guy to figure out.:rolleyes:
 
   / Found two Volts in the spicket #15  
I experienced a situation similar to Surgeon's on a farn I worked on in the 60's. Owner noticed a sudden decrease in milk production. Being in northern NH the cows were in for the winter. Some one cleaning out a water bowl got a tingle & discovered all the bowls were energized. Cows being well grounded in their bare feed on damp concrete just stopped drinking. Had to water the 80 cows from buckets 3 times a day. Power company said call an electrician. He disconnected everything one at a time, installed recording equipment to track electrical usage, found nothing abnormal. Power Co continued to deny any fault. Problem suddenly went away after a couple of weeks with no return. One of the Power Co linemen later said they replaced a bad transformer ground nearly 1/2 mile away on the day the problem disappeared.
Today the biggest dairy farm in that town, with about 1300 head, refuses to tie into the Power Co's neutral, instead they had an electrical engineer design & install their own ground mat at significant expense for the above reason. MikeD74T
 
   / Found two Volts in the spicket #17  
I have worked on enough homes (of my own remodels) to have seen many times grounding done through the water pipes and anything else that could be found.

Especailyl if the home is old enough that it was all two plug outlets and someone went back and made them three wire by grounding them out, individualy. (ol 1960's house, had to be one of the most interesting things I have seen).

Fish Aquariums also can run into a similar problem. Any submerged electrical device can give off voltage. In most cases it's minimal, and just a bleed, and not a problem as the circuit is never "closed" (for example birds and power lines).

Since I (and most of us posters) don't know your home, the layout, etc. we just through random ideas out there. My point on the aquarium is if you have a Well a pump may be bleeding, if you have XYZ that is connected with the water that could be bleeding off.


I would suggest throwing the master breaker first.
 
   / Found two Volts in the spicket #18  
Reminds of a story in Massachusetts last year. This guy built a house that is extremely close to several high tension power lines (Like almost underneath them). Well, it appears everything in the house has a bit of voltage in it. Ends up he shouldn't have been able to build the house that close to the lines, but somehow the building inspector missed it. I guess all the workman had quite the time building it. Well, not it's up and he can't get an occupancy permit.
 
   / Found two Volts in the spicket #19  
A patient came into today for post op who was is a senior lineman for the power company. He is a sharp guy and exceptionally nice so I ask him about this exact problem. He called the problem "stray voltage." He said that he spent 1.5 years checking farms for this exact problem. Apparently humans need around 4-5 volts to be able to detect stray voltage but livestock can detect as little as .5 volts. (Four feet and a wet nose make them more sensitive ...which is what you simulated by drinking out of the spigot and thus you could detect the 2 volts:)) He said to call the power company and have them come out and check for "stray voltage." The solution is to for the power company to change over to a "Delta Configuration" at the transformer. They had to change 214 farms over to the delta configuration in those 1.5 years.
 
   / Found two Volts in the spicket #20  
ToadHill said:
I found in my old house that every time I touched the aluminum siding I got a shock. Took me 2 different electricians and about $150 to find that someone had attached the ground wire in the electrical box to the common leg. Put it back to the ground screw in the box and no more shocks. It also cut my electrical bill by 25%.

Guess you had a whole house "bug zapper". :D:D

Derek
 

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