Frozen Water Line, Will this do any good?

[Industrial Toys]

I have a 3/4" Plastic Water line that runs about 300' from an underground pump house to the house. Several factors have caused it to freeze:

The pipes were only installed at a moderate depth of 3-4 feet.

I lowered the grade in spots three years ago to level out my parking lot and removed maybe a foot of cover.

The area is heavily compacted.

There is a concrete pad very close to the line in one spot.

The area is scraped clear of snow. (Figures, other snow covered areas are not frozen at all and I am still ripping up turf!)

I have been using very little water lately, as I have been kind of hibernating and have not had my usual weekend visitors.

Then, unprecidented COLD for long periods. Supposedly one of the coldest February's on record, minus 35C in the mornings!

So, volla! No more water. No surprise, given the above. Just this has never happened in fifty years! I kind of worried about it the first winter after lowereing the grade and then forgot about it.

It probably was never more then twelve or so hours from when I had water to when I didn't. I proceeded to pile snow on the route of the line maybe as much as a heap four feet high.

And here is my question. Does anybody have experience with this? Will the pipe thaw in any kind of a timely fashion or is this just wishfull thinking?

My next step would be to take some 3/8" pex, go in the pump house, start inserting the pex into the 3/4" line and continuously pump warm water into the blockage. I REALLY don't want to do this! It's a nasty place, unsuited for the slightly clastrophobic and I imagine I will get soaked in the process.

Thanks

 

[RetiredCarGuy]

How about first a suction of all water in the line, then reverse pumping warm/hot water into the pipe to your pump house from inside your house?

When it is thawed and to keep it from refreezing, remove the snow cover, and pile fresh manure on the line run until spring.
.

 

[Fred Barbour]

Industrial Toys;

You have a water line between 3-4 feet in Ontario and it hasn't frozen in 50 years! Wow, you are lucky. My guess is your frost line must be at least 5 feet. I would consider putting in a new line at an appropriate depth. You can check the frost line depth in your area on the internet.

As for your frozen line, I'm afraid you are hooped until the frost comes out of the ground. Check with your city/municipality to ascertain how they thaw lines. Poly is quite forgiving but having said that you could very well have a break, will find out when it thaws.

Sorry I have no good news for you on this situation.

 

[nybirdman]

It's not going to thaw that way;if fact you have insulated it by piling snow on it.You are going to have to thaw with heat some way.Clear the snow off and tarp(saw horses and 2x4' lumber) and add heat with a salamander type heater or what ever you can access.It will take quite a while.
In good weather I would dig up and insulate the line and add an "internal"heat tape.
I had the same happen a couple years ago and this is what I had to do.

 

[Industrial Toys]

Thanks for the replies.

I have considered putting in a deeper line but I have so many projects, and so many buried services going in every direction that it is a big undertaking. Plus, with this stoney ground, clean up is always a bigger job then the excavating!

As far as insulating the pipe, THAT is my question. This FROST thing is such a mystery to me. What is frost? Just another name for temperature below freezing? Or, frozen water contained in whatever material?

I figured, aways hearing this talk about ground heat, that it would thaw my pipes. There must have been enough ground heat, up to this point to keep the pipe from freezing. And I alwo wondered, if the line was just at the verge of freezing, and then did so with a lack of water running, is the line frozen solid or is it possible that it is just mildy frozen and having added the snow blanket, that I might have avoided damage to the pipe?

It does make me wonder which train of thought is accurate. I can envision the ground source heat coming from below, but at the same time it seems to me, that whenever you pile up snow, you end up with ICE! Getting more frozen, right down to the ground. Why does this not melt from ground source heat? Or does it?

 

[murphy1244]

Cover your line in hay. As it decomposes it will thaw out your line in a few days.

 

[woodchipper]

Frost is reffered to ground moisture retention freezing potential. As Soil conditions change by the meter, it is difficult to know verry precisely where your frost line will be at. Generaly speaking, in Ontario, in the South it will be near three feet, while in Northern Ontario, it will hover around five feet.
Now, this is true for bare ground. The deeper the snow cover, the shallower your frost line will be.
At this point, putting a good snow cover on top of your frozen ground will not help enough, as it will take much time for the ground to thaw. But, YES, by all means, do it. It will at least prevent further cold to seep in the ground. If you could wait a week or two, it should start to seep out.
Make sure your snow cover will extend at least three to four feet of both sides of the water line.
Best of luck!

 

[deerseeker001]

In Wisconsin we bury our Water lines between 6/8 feet deep.

Industrial Toys;

You have a water line between 3-4 feet in Ontario and it hasn't frozen in 50 years! Wow, you are lucky. My guess is your frost line must be at least 5 feet. I would consider putting in a new line at an appropriate depth. You can check the frost line depth in your area on the internet.

As for your frozen line, I'm afraid you are hooped until the frost comes out of the ground. Check with your city/municipality to ascertain how they thaw lines. Poly is quite forgiving but having said that you could very well have a break, will find out when it thaws.

Sorry I have no good news for you on this situation.

 

[Industrial Toys]

A pic of my attempts to provide some sort of a "warm" snow blankie! A picture may help to set the scene better. It's the mound that runs in front of the garage. I guess the concrete pad extending out from the garage does not help, and I wonder how much of that I should cover. This mound, now denies me use or even easy pedestrian traffic to the garage.

If I knew it would work in a couple of weeks, I could live with that. I might get a garden hose to run from the pump house frost free tap to the house frost free tap, over top of the snow, just to take showers or do laundry, then blow out the hose with air.

The outside temperatures are STILL unusually bitter, and I wonder how much effect that will actually have with the line now covered.

 

[nybirdman]

Your snow cover is working against you now;helping to keep it frozen.Only way is with heat;I would tent the area and put some heat on it ;after it thaws a blanket of hay/straw will help insulate the ground.