Gasohol and Small Engines

[clemsonfor]

I use either 32:1 or 40:1 in all my two stroke stuff even the modern stuff and use Non E 87 octane. You get more power out of the 87 as you get a more complete burn of the fuel in the cylider as it has a lower octane. You will not get detination like Stihl says to avoid in the manual. How can you have preignition in an engine that is going 14,000 rpms? An there are many guys running ported saws more powerfull than most have here fine on 87.

The reason for more oil is that 50:1 is lean and no room for mistake and can be lean. Stihl 15 years ago use to reccomend 40:1 then went to 50:1 for what i think is no other reason than EPA. The fuel is the same as is the oil. I use non E gas today just like fuel 10+ years ago. Stihl oil is the same oil that they had in recent history so why the change. Good syn oil or syn blend oil will not sludge or carbon up or do anything that will hurt your saws. I have everything from 32cc-84cc saws of anything from stihl to china cheap saws. They all get it.

 

[clemsonfor]

I use either 32:1 or 40:1 in all my two stroke stuff even the modern stuff and use Non E 87 octane. You get more power out of the 87 as you get a more complete burn of the fuel in the cylider as it has a lower octane. You will not get detination like Stihl says to avoid in the manual. How can you have preignition in an engine that is going 14,000 rpms? An there are many guys running ported saws more powerfull than most have here fine on 87.

The reason for more oil is that 50:1 is lean and no room for mistake and can be lean. Stihl 15 years ago use to reccomend 40:1 then went to 50:1 for what i think is no other reason than EPA. The fuel is the same as is the oil. I use non E gas today just like fuel 10+ years ago. Stihl oil is the same oil that they had in recent history so why the change. Good syn oil or syn blend oil will not sludge or carbon up or do anything that will hurt your saws. I have everything from 32cc-84cc saws of anything from stihl to china cheap saws. They all get it.

 

[davesl708]

Interesting read on Wikipedia regarding ethanol in gasoline.

Found this label that will be required with the new increase in ethanol allowed in gasoline.

View attachment 442322

 

[Copperhead]

Yeah, that label is on the E15 pumps around me now. I have filled up with it quite a bit. Might be a push on, but the station near me is offering it at a guaranteed 10 cent discount compare to E10. And E10 is about 20 cents less than regular ethanol free. Pretty decent value. I don't think anyone will have to worry about being force fed E15. They will still have to have E10 or E0 around for older vehicles and small motors.

 

[Copperhead]

The answer was in question to someone thinking that ethanol could not have different mixes and be called 10% for general road use. He was correct of course. The attempt was to explain why some areas have more trouble with ethanol than others possibly dependent on how well the ethanol dump mixes within the tanker truck.
I'd love to buy non ethanol gas for small engines for only 20 cents more per gallon. Here, non ethanol gas comes in 5 gallon containers and the cost is $60.

that is probably correct. I will take it a step further also.... 10% is the maximum authorized by fed regs for E10 at a pump. To maintain the they do not exceed 10% I would bet that most E10 at a pump is less than 10% to some extent. Something like 8% at most. Similar to the ULSD thing, where diesel cannot exceed 15 ppm of sulfur. When I have seen testing done on ULSD diesel fuel, it almost always is less than 15 ppm to make sure they do not exceed the 15 ppm limit.

 

[ultrarunner]

^^^ Unless you are in an area where it is simply not available... like the 9 million that live around the San Francisco Bay Area.

 

[oldpilgrim]

^^^ Unless you are in an area where it is simply not available... like the 9 million that live around the San Francisco Bay Area.

or complete states like MA.

 

[3930dave]

The personal impression I've built up is that fuel pump failures track with E concentration.

I don't have the funds to do a real lab test, but the folks that do seem to agree.

http://www.crcao.com/reports/recentstudies2013/CRC%20664%20%5BAVFL-15a%5D/AVFL%2015a%20%5BCRC%20664%5D%20Final%20Report%20only.pdf

See Figure 10.

I drive my vehicles longer/further than many people do, so this matters to me. I get that somebody who leases or otherwise turns their vehicle ownership over quickly probably doesn't care.

Rgds, D.

 

[Copperhead]

Could be. I really don't worry about it. I have used ethanol in various concentrations since the late 70's / early 80's and have never had a fuel pump failure, nor any other fuel system related issue. Carburetor, throttle body injection, or port injection. All the same. Everything did just fine for all the time I had them. One, a '74 Pontiac Catalina with a 400 carbureted small block started getting fed E10 in the late 70's and lasted 250,000 miles, the car died before the engine did. Probably a fluke. Even with straight gasoline, fuel pumps can fail. Now how many can be definitively determined that E10, E15, E20, E30, or E85 was the cause, still remains to be seen. And unbiased analysis out here in the real world is very difficult to come by. Whenever something goes wrong with a fuel system, it is almost always the fault of ethanol, at least according to the owner.

 

[Sodo]

Thats funny, in the old days we used to change fuel pumps all the time. If the OEM pump failed at 50, 80,000 it was no surprise. Some people kept spares. If an aftermarket pump failed at 25k, then everyone said "you get what you pay for; go to the dealer for that item". Now if a pump fails - it was the ethanol. Carburetors had to be cleaned from time to time, always have, always will. Now it's the ethanol. Hogwash. Its short memories and effective petrol .vs. bio marketing. Petrol industry wants that 10% back.