Gelled Fuel?

[ragkar]

That sounds like paraffin problems.
Last year I started a thread called - What does diesel gelling look like?
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/owning-operating/193618-what-does-diesel-gelling-look.html

On the bottom of the separator bowl on my 2320 there's a red fiber washer that floats upward on the meniscus of any water in the bowl.

This year I had similar problems due to water in the fuel freezing in the feed line.

 

[GreatWhitehunter]

I'm happy to report the green monster rides again. It wasn't easy getting her breathing again but after a few attempts she roared to life. I'm pretty sure this cold finished off the battery though. But it's the original and 7 years old. I only have 350 hrs on the machine so I'd say the battery doesn't get enough charging from the alternator.

Matt

 

[greg_g]

I'd say 7 years is a reasonable service life from an OE battery. Your charging system is likely just fine. Put a voltmeter on your battery posts before you start the battery next time. A good battery should show about 12.2 volts DC. Then start the engine and note the voltage again. A good alternator will initially throw about 14.5 volts at the battery - to replenish what was used up cranking the starter. As the battery accepts the recharge, the voltage will visibly drop back to about 12.2 volts. If you can reproduce these numbers, your charging system is working normally.

//greg//

 

[sunnyside360]

I'm happy to report the green monster rides again. It wasn't easy getting her breathing again but after a few attempts she roared to life. I'm pretty sure this cold finished off the battery though. But it's the original and 7 years old. I only have 350 hrs on the machine so I'd say the battery doesn't get enough charging from the alternator.

Matt

Good news......... now you are ready for the next snow storm. Keep mixing fuel additive and you should be good to go from here on out. Some diesel fuel additives also help prevent algae growth in the tank which is especially important when the tractor only gets used about 50 hrs a year like yours.
Seven years battery life is pretty good for original Deere battery.

 

[GreatWhitehunter]

Thanks for all the replies, I'm and electrician so I have access to a load tester. And the battery is spent(no suprize). I searched all the past post on battery replacement, but say nothing too current. I looked on jdparts and it looks like a sealed battery to the tune of $120. I'd rather stick with an optima if I can find one that fits. I've been using them on my other stuff with real good results. Anyone go through that process lately? I'm going to add some K1 to my fuel supply during the winter months from now on for sure.

Matt

 

[greg_g]

if I can find one that fits.

That's half the equation. Look for minimum 750CCA batteries that fit. And if you have the luxury of choice, the shorter the better. The taller the battery, the less airflow through the radiator. Plus fewer seeds and less chaff collect behind shorter batteries.

//greg//

 

[GreatWhitehunter]

I ended up just getting the Deere Strong Box. It's a sealed unit now, I tried to locate an optima replace but couldn't find one locally and they were quite abit more than the OEM Unit. The deere replacement is 500cca, the closest size optima was only 450. So that really swayed my decision.

Matt

 

[sunnyside360]

I ended up just getting the Deere Strong Box. It's a sealed unit now, I tried to locate an optima replace but couldn't find one locally and they were quite abit more than the OEM Unit. The deere replacement is 500cca, the closest size optima was only 450. So that really swayed my decision.

Matt

You should be good to go for several years. My 5 year old 3720 with original JD battery (not sealed) started right off this morning at zero degrees outside. Cranked over just like it did when new which surprised me. BTW, Advance Auto Parts stores carry the Optima batteries. A lot of folks on other forums prefer the Odyssey battery over the Optima but I think both are good.

ODYSSEY Batteries - Automotive Specifications

 

[greg_g]

The deere replacement is 500cca, the closest size optima was only 450.

I've been runnin' diesels since about '85 (7 tractors, 4 cars), and personally think the OE battery is undersized - hence my 750CCA recommendation. If you searched the Interstate Battery website for "diesel engine battery" for example, it will bring back nothing smaller than 660 CCA. But of the two you mentioned, another OE was the better choice. That 450 CCA Optima is a car battery for low compression gasoline engines. You'd have been disappointed. Even if it's a bit on the small side, the 500 CCA JDOE battery at least is designed for high compression diesels.

//greg//

 

[GreatWhitehunter]

You should be good to go for several years. My 5 year old 3720 with original JD battery (not sealed) started right off this morning at zero degrees outside. Cranked over just like it did when new which surprised me. BTW, Advance Auto Parts stores carry the Optima batteries. A lot of folks on other forums prefer the Odyssey battery over the Optima but I think both are good.

ODYSSEY Batteries - Automotive Specifications

Advance was my first stop. They didn't have many yellow tops in stock. I really didn't want to order one and with the snow coming I just couldn't wait. The local deere dealer had one in stock. So after charging I wire brushed the terminal, I replaced the hardware since it was $2.00 for the bolts and nuts. I also put a good coat of CRC terminal protectant on. We use it alot on power station service batteries with good results.

She cranked stong and fired right up after install, and I ran it for about 30 min without issue and temps in the mid teens. I ended up adding 2 gal of K1 for good measure. Hopefully this was my first and last fuel issue. Thanks for all the helpful replies.

Matt

 

[LBrown59]

Re: Gelled Fuel?
Seems like I read about several issues concerning this subject every winter.
It's nearly always about it happening to tractors but almost never concerns trucks and cars .
Are tractors more prone to the effects of gelled fuel than are trucks and cars ?

 

[GreatWhitehunter]

Re: Gelled Fuel?
Seems like I read about several issues concerning this subject every winter.
It's nearly always about it happening to tractors but almost never concerns trucks and cars .
Are tractors more prone to the effects of gelled fuel than are trucks and cars ?

In my case it was really related to low fuel consumption from this summer. I've finished alot of my tractor related projects so this summer I used the tractor abit less than normal. So if I had used the tractor more I would've had a cold weather diesel mix in the tank rather than left over summer blend.

Car's and trucks don't usually sit like tractors so I suspect that maybe the reason you hear about this alot more with tractors .

Matt

 

[MyJoBota]

Re: Gelled Fuel?
Seems like I read about several issues concerning this subject every winter.
It's nearly always about it happening to tractors but almost never concerns trucks and cars .
Are tractors more prone to the effects of gelled fuel than are trucks and cars ?

I know the big three truck manufacturers have been running fuel heators in their trucks for several years now. I am not sure it's common practice on tractors especially CUTS.

 

[Gizmo2]

Re: Gelled Fuel?
Seems like I read about several issues concerning this subject every winter.
It's nearly always about it happening to tractors but almost never concerns trucks and cars .
Are tractors more prone to the effects of gelled fuel than are trucks and cars ?

I know my tractor sits in the cold for days on end and maybe weeks. Where as most cars and trucks are use more often. I don't think it's the one cold shot that does it so much as the prolonged cold and not being used, just sitting and not mixing.

 

[greg_g]

I don't think it's the one cold shot that does it so much as the prolonged cold and not being used, just sitting and not mixing.

Nope. One cold shot will do it. Soon as it warms up, it will "un-gel". Next time there's a real cold snap, the cycle starts again. It's not outside the realm of possibility that - if your tractor sits idle over a nasty winter - it could actually gel several times. Come spring when you next start the, you will likely be unaware that it even happened.

Here's a short primer and some links regarding diesel gelling.

Water in the fuel also contributes to gelling, because it raises the cloud point. Water typically gets into your fuel two ways; already contaminated at the point of sale, or condensation in a partially full fuel tank. Condensation is a natural occurrence caused by the day/night heat/cool cycle. It forms on the inside tank walls that are exposed to the air. As such, I try to top up my tractor after each use - year round - so that condensation is given no place to form. Another measure is to regularly check for water in the sediment bowl (or separator). If you see it there, you can be pretty dang sure it came from the tank.

//greg//

 

[sunnyside360]

Nope. One cold shot will do it. Soon as it warms up, it will "un-gel". Next time there's a real cold snap, the cycle starts again. It's not outside the realm of possibility that - if your tractor sits idle over a nasty winter - it could actually gel several times. Come spring when you next start the, you will likely be unaware that it even happened.

Here's a short primer and some links regarding diesel gelling.

Water in the fuel also contributes to gelling, because it raises the cloud point. Water typically gets into your fuel two ways; already contaminated at the point of sale, or condensation in a partially full fuel tank. Condensation is a natural occurrence caused by the day/night heat/cool cycle. It forms on the inside tank walls that are exposed to the air. As such, I try to top up my tractor after each use - year round - so that condensation is given no place to form. Another measure is to regularly check for water in the sediment bowl (or separator). If you see it there, you can be pretty dang sure it came from the tank.

//greg//

Greg, good explanation of diesel fuel gelling. This is why it is important to use additives in cold climates and to keep the fuel tank filled. Fuel additive in the summer also will help to prevent algae forming in diesel fuel. Learned all this years ago the hard way. :thumbsup:

 

[Gizmo2]

Nope. One cold shot will do it. Soon as it warms up, it will "un-gel". Next time there's a real cold snap, the cycle starts again. It's not outside the realm of possibility that - if your tractor sits idle over a nasty winter - it could actually gel several times. Come spring when you next start the, you will likely be unaware that it even happened.

Here's a short primer and some links regarding diesel gelling.

Water in the fuel also contributes to gelling, because it raises the cloud point. Water typically gets into your fuel two ways; already contaminated at the point of sale, or condensation in a partially full fuel tank. Condensation is a natural occurrence caused by the day/night heat/cool cycle. It forms on the inside tank walls that are exposed to the air. As such, I try to top up my tractor after each use - year round - so that condensation is given no place to form. Another measure is to regularly check for water in the sediment bowl (or separator). If you see it there, you can be pretty dang sure it came from the tank.

//greg//

:thumbsup: Thanks

 

[LBrown59]

In my case it was really related to low fuel consumption from this summer. I've finished alot of my tractor related projects so this summer I used the tractor a bit less than normal.
2* So if I had used the tractor more I would've had a cold weather diesel mix in the tank rather than left over summer blend.
4*Car's and trucks don't usually sit like tractors so I suspect that maybe the reason you hear about this alot more with tractors .

2*I ran summer diesel in all 3 of these last winter .

It never got down to 14 degrees so all 3 tractors ran fine.
I still have summer fuel in them and no problem this winter either but then it's never been down to 14 degrees this year either.
Since we have few if any 14 degree days per year
I just use what ever fuel I have in this fueling station when ever i fill up a tractor. .


4*Probably so .
Makes sense to me.

 

[JordanFTW]

Glad you got her back up and running! I wanted to add that Optima batteries are complete JUNK and they have been for some time (since the company was sold years ago). DO NOT waste your money. I, along with many other pros recommend East Penn/Deka manufactured batteries. Odyssey's full under that category, and are manufactured by East Penn.

 

[Optima Bill]

Hi Matt,
I am late to the thread, and realize you have already replaced your battery, but did want to post something in case someone else was searching for an Optima option. While I don't have the dimension requirements for your application, this link shows our RedTop specs and this one our YellowTop specs. There are several that have at least 750cca. So I know they would work as long as you have the right size physically.
I think 7 years on your original battery is a good length of service and with only 350 hours, really good since it probably sits for long periods at the time.
I have to disagree with JordanFTW about the quality of our batteries. We don't use recycled lead in any of our batteries and I have had no trouble with the one that's been in my International tractor for years. It starts when everything else is dead, even if it has been sitting all winter. Thankfully, I am in Tennessee so don't have to worry about gelling here.
Feel free to ask any questions you may have about our products,
Thanks,
Bill Howell
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries, Inc.