glide shift or hydro

   / glide shift or hydro #1  

gamehunter

New member
Joined
Jul 7, 2001
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3
I'm lokiing at purchasing a 3010 with loader and am wondering if the added expense is worth the hydro.trans. Also was told by dealer that the best tire for sandy area are the turf tires, does this sound correct?
 
   / glide shift or hydro #2  
I don't think they should even make non-hydros. That is probably a bit too all encompassing a statement but gee I sure love mine.

Rogue
 
   / glide shift or hydro #3  
If you're going to use that front end loader very much, you'll do a lot of changing directions; forward and backward. Hydro is definitely worth the money.

Bird
 
   / glide shift or hydro #4  
I did a search on HST and advantage and here's some of what I came up with:

http://www.tractorbynet.com/cgi-bin/compact/showthreaded.pl?Cat=&Board=custom&Number=22295&Search=true&Forum=All_Forums&Words=HST advantage&Match=And&Searchpage=1&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=3472

http://www.tractorbynet.com/cgi-bin/compact/showflat.pl?Cat=&Board=buykubota&Number=52551&page=&view=&sb=&vc=1

http://www.tractorbynet.com/cgi-bin/compact/showflat.pl?Cat=&Board=buykubota&Number=27741&page=&view=&sb=&vc=1

http://www.tractorbynet.com/cgi-bin/compact/showflat.pl?Cat=&Board=owning&Number=892&page=&view=&sb=&vc=1 This is a really cool one because Gordon advocates GST in it, but has since purchased an HST... /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

http://www.tractorbynet.com/cgi-bin/compact/showflat.pl?Cat=&Board=owning&Number=2772&page=&view=&sb=&vc=1 And this one should've been titled "Gordon changes his mind". /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

MarkC
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   / glide shift or hydro #5  
Kinda odd,when I look at List Prices on Kubota tractors,the GST is more expensive than the HST.I think I would set your Dealer straight and ask him why the Hydro is going to cost you more.
 
   / glide shift or hydro #6  
Mike,

Are you sure you're not mistaken. On http://www.tractorsmart.com the 3010 GST is 16,650 and the 3010 HST is 17,150.

Yes, the HST is well worth the difference and a lot more. For myself, I wouldnt even consider anything else.
 
   / glide shift or hydro #7  
Glenn,you are right as usual,I stand corrected.I've been looking at list prices on the same site,but at the bigger L's.The L4310 and L4610.The price listed on these two machines,both with the GST is $100.00 higher than the HYDRO trans.I just "assumed" that the price difference was the same on ALL the L-Series tractors.Guess not...
 
   / glide shift or hydro #8  
Mike, I'm equally surprised that the price flips on the bigger tractors. I sort of assumed that hydro was always more expensive. Hmmmm, makes you wonder whether the price premium for hydro is cost driven or simply profit taking. (So what are you doing looking at prices of larger tractors. Visions of batwings?)
 
   / glide shift or hydro #9  
Yes,I hope to one day own an L-Series tractor to pull a Tri Deck finish mower.We finish mow a little over 10 acres every weekend,I would like to cut our mowing time down to around 2-3 hours.Have been told that on the bigger L's that pulling a P.T.O. driven mower of that size (11'-13') that I would be better off with the GST. because of the power loss.But,I hate the thought of giving up the ease of the Hydro.I was also kinda taken back by the cost difference of the two trans. I don't know if those prices have been listed wrong or what.I have'nt even got around to talking to a dealer about a trade yet,so I can't say for sure.
 
   / glide shift or hydro #10  
If it's true that you need so much PTO power that the HST would be overworked, I think you need to seriously consider going to a straight gear transmission (DT, in Kubota's model nomenclature), not a GST.

What many people don't realize is that there's more power loss between a DT and a GST than there is between a GST and an HST. Even most dealers make this mistake, because of the misconception that a GST is "just a DT with a hydraulic clutch", whereas the HST is a totally different kind of transmission, one which they generally don't understand. While the statement may be almost technically true, the inferences drawn from it are totally false. It's the hydraulic clutch pack that causes the loss. Here's why, primarily: The hydraulic clutch pack engages by means of pressure. If it were to disengage by means of pressure, the power loss would only occur when shifting gears, i.e. when the clutch was disengaged, but it would be difficult to get shifting to be as smooth and quick as it is in the current design. As it is, the power loss occurs when the clutch is engaged.

Anyone who doesn't believe this has got good company, because it's a very common misconception, but it's an misconception nonetheless. I posted the actual efficiency numbers I got from the Kubota service department once, but they're apparently in the old archive, which I can't seem to find anymore. I posted a message to Muhammad in another area asking him if they're still available anywhere.

Of course, while the above is all true, the case can still be made that HST incurs an incremental power loss when compared to the GST, which itself incurs power loss when compared to the DT, so there may be cases where the GST has barely enough power to do the job, therefore the HST has too little. In practice, in my opinion, if the HST won't do it (for hours on end without damaging it), the GST shouldn't be doing it.

Speaking of "in practice", though, my L4310HST will pull a 7' tiller with custom-added scarifier teeth through anything you can till with the the scarifiers fully extended and the tiller shaft buried 2" into the soil (so it's tilling over 10" deep). There's a picture of the tiller at http://www.tractorbynet.com/cgi-bin/compact/showthreaded.pl?Cat=&Board=custom&Number=56678&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&vc=1#Post56678.

Or, put another way, as far as tractive force is concerned, consider this: My tractor has 19.5" wide Michelin XM27 radials on the back aired down to 9 psi with about 50 gallons of ballast in each tire, 11" wide Michelin radials on the front, a double-weight 4-in-1 bucket on the loader, an overhead console, a 2,000 pound Bradco backhoe on the back, and all kinds of extra weight in accessories (and a cup... /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif). (You can also see pictures of the tires and other stuff at the above link.) Still, I can put the bucket against a tree and dig 4 holes in normal ground with the tires. What would I do with more power?

In all of this, we've only addressed one thing: power. I still contend that, given the safety, productivity, and ease-of-use advantages of HST, the vast majority of tractor purchasers would do well to think in terms of "How big an HST-equipped tractor do I need to buy to do the job?". You will be far happier, in the long run, than deciding to get a non-HST tractor in a particular size because it (possibly) has marginally enough more power than the HST to do the job.

Of course, I still haven't completely made up my mind as to which is better... /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

MarkC
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