Global Warming?

[rsewill]

HS and Crash may live long enough for the earth to prove how fuelish they are. Until then they can bury their heads in coal and crude. Some people enjoy sending money to Middle East despots (after Big Oil gets its cut.)

 

[houstonscott]

This is what I mean when I say they are part of the 10% who do the exact wrong thing.

Wind farms can cause climate change, finds new study - Telegraph

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203706604574376543308399048.html

These people shouldn't be able to get near energy policy.


HS

 

[Egon]

This is what I mean when I say they are part of the 10% who do the exact wrong thing.

Wind farms can cause climate change, finds new study - Telegraph

These people shouldn't be able to get near energy policy.

HS

Why???

 

[Redneck in training]

This is what I mean when I say they are part of the 10% who do the exact wrong thing.

Wind farms can cause climate change, finds new study - Telegraph

Robert Bryce: Windmills Are Killing Our Birds - WSJ.com

These people shouldn't be able to get near energy policy.


HS

That is total BS. It has nothing to do with climate or dead birds. Cars moving on road do the same thing. In fact the air downstream of the turbines is cooler because the turbine removes some of the energy from the moving air mass.

 

[Rob-D]

Go read your own article. USA is number two polluter just over taken by China only measuring CO2 and then having to convert the number to a per capita comparison, how convent and distorted. Anyway your article only measures CO2, which I don't consider a pollutant. USA is one of the cleanest and safest places to work and live in the world. Get real. No one believes your so called facts written by idiots. It's like the UN and Iran investigating USA for human rights violation right after they behead someone for converting to christianity, get real. You wouldn't last 5 minutes in a place like India, China, or Russia if you were worried about pollution. Those places are truly polluted, whole industries exist that couldn't happen in the USA. Check out the NGC special about ship breakers and you will begin to see how absurd you sound. Not sure just how smart you think you are but your arguments are laughable.

HS

The US is the SECOND biggest polluter, you said pollution was from "POOR countries."

And where are your facts, show me that the US is the cleanest, safest country. You can't simply make statements and say my sources are bad you have to post links to support you position. Your opinion doesn't establish anything. You thought the US was the healthiest until I posted data that shows we're not even in the top ten!

Facts not opinions.

Rob

 

[crash325]

HS and Crash may live long enough for the earth to prove how fuelish they are. Until then they can bury their heads in coal and crude. Some people enjoy sending money to Middle East despots (after Big Oil gets its cut.)

All Hail the Great One
That knows Almost Nothing about Almost Everything.
3 Cheers for Being Wrong once again.
One should keep his mouth Shut when He does Not Know what he is talking about.

 

[Rob-D]

The Greenies & Warmies don't or will not look at all the facts or story. Always pick out just the part they like and that's it. They seem to think if the pollution is happening some where else (because of what they are doing) it does not count.

I posted several links to look at, if they even looked or responded everything was taken out of context.

Phony's are phony's and Expert Phony's are the worst.

Rob D did not say anything about what it takes to keep his mess of "Clean" energy working. If he has everything he says, he's busier than a 1 legged man in a but kicking contest.

Completely wrong!

This shows how little you know about PV. The only thing I do is check my computer every couple of days to see how much energy I'm selling to the grid, my off grid system idles along and I check my batteries every month or two. That's it!

It's always the people without any PV or alternate energy that have these misinformed ideas. I could go away for a month and my systems would be fine.

What do you think, Nuclear and coal electricity producing plants don't require daily maintenance? Try to walk away from a coal plant for a month and tell me what happens.

Rob

 

[Rob-D]

One should keep his mouth Shut when He does Not Know what he is talking about.

Now that's the pot calling the kettle black!

 

[Dan Hunter]

In fact the air downstream of the turbines is cooler because the turbine removes some of the energy from the moving air mass.

The article below would suggest otherwise:

Wind farms may have warming effect - research | Reuters

I'm just waiting for the articles of faith for environmentalism to be completed.

 

[Rob-D]

The Greenies

What's a greenie? Is that someone who thinks we should leave more to future generations than the WV coal slurries? Is that someone who thinks if we don't conserve we won't have land to grow healthy food and air to breath?

Maybe you might want to actually read about the conservation movement in this country that took place at the turn of the last century.

Look up a guy named Gifford Pinchot who was the head of the forest services under Teddy Roosevelt. Pinchot wasn't an environmentalist like Leopold he worked with industry and showed them that if they don't conserve resources they won't have an economy.

How long do you think we can keep blowing off the tops of mountains in WV and Ky before all we have is a leaking coal slurry? What will we have then? No coal and a devastated landscape. So what should we do?

We should use these resources to make alternative renewables that will sustain us when there is no coal. If we wait until we have nothing we won't have any energy or are one of those people who thinks we can keep using coal and oil at the rate we are forever?

Rob

 

[Rob-D]

The article below would suggest otherwise:

Wind farms may have warming effect - research | Reuters

I'm just waiting for the articles of faith for environmentalism to be completed.

From your link:

"But the researchers said more studies were needed, at different locations and for longer periods, before any firm conclusions could be drawn."

"Previous research in 2010 by other U.S. scientists found wind farms could make the nights warmer and days cooler in their immediate vicinity, but those effects could be minimized by changing turbines' rotor design or by building the farms in areas with high natural turbulence."

So we may have to change turbine blade geometry to resolve the issue IF further research shows our observations are accurate.

I've said this before but I will say it again, renewables are a new field with new discoveries and technology coming out everyday. What is the future of coal? What is the future of oil? We made the last great oil discovery in 1969 in the North Sea, how long do you think oil will last?

52% of our electricity comes from coal, how much of the air "in their immediate vicinity" is heated from those stacks? How much energy is used bringing coal to the plant, how much of the environment is destroyed from the coal waste from those plants?

Rob

 

[_RaT_]

I think out West here very little of our electrical power comes from coal. I know when I flew out to Washington DC I could see a lot of electrical generating plants. A significant comes from hydro, NG and biomass and two nulclear power plants. There is headway and advancement in technology, it is coming.

 

[Egon]

That is total BS. It has nothing to do with climate or dead birds. Cars moving on road do the same thing. In fact the air downstream of the turbines is cooler because the turbine removes some of the energy from the moving air mass.

Facts, where are your facts??:thumbsup:

 

[criz067]

I think out West here very little of our electrical power comes from coal. I know when I flew out to Washington DC I could see a lot of electrical generating plants. A significant comes from hydro, NG and biomass and two nulclear power plants. There is headway and advancement in technology, it is coming.

Maybe in California, Oregon and Washington, but in Utah 93% of electrical power comes from coal. In New Mexico, 86% of electrical power comes from coal. In Colorado, 86%. In Montana, 64%. In Nevada and Arizona, about 50%.

See: http://apps1.eere.energy.gov/states/state_information.cfm

 

[Rob-D]

I think out West here very little of our electrical power comes from coal. I know when I flew out to Washington DC I could see a lot of electrical generating plants. A significant comes from hydro, NG and biomass and two nulclear power plants. There is headway and advancement in technology, it is coming.

Coal has to travel further to get to you.

Coal generates 54% of our electricity, and is the single biggest air polluter in the U.S. | Union of Concerned Scientists


"Coal generates 54% of our electricity, and is the single biggest air polluter in the U.S."



Air pollution: Burning coal causes smog, soot, acid rain, global warming, and toxic air emissions. Click on its photo to learn more.

Wastes generated: Ash, sludge, toxic chemicals, and waste heat create more environmental problems. Click on its photo to learn more.

Fuel supply: Mining, transporting, and storing coal levels mountains and pollutes the land, water, and air. Click on its photo to learn more.

Water use: Coal plants need billions of gallons of cooling water and harm wildlife. Click on its photo to learn more.

Advancement?

Mountain Justice - What is Mountain Top Removal Mining?

"Mountaintop removal / valley fill coal mining (MTR) has been called strip mining on steroids. One author says the process should be more accurately named: mountain range removal. Mountaintop removal /valley fill mining annihilates ecosystems, transforming some of the most biologically diverse temperate forests in the world into biologically barren moonscapes."

Advancements?

A typical-sized 500 megawatt coal-fired electricity plant in the United States puts out each year:

1. 3.7 million tons of carbon dioxide. Carbon dioxide (CO2) is the main greenhouse gas, and is the leading cause of global warming. There are no regulations limiting carbon dioxide emissions in the U.S.

2. 10,000 tons of sulfur dioxide. Sulfur dioxide (SOx) is the main cause of acid rain, which damages forests, lakes and buildings.

3. 10,200 tons of nitrogen oxide. Nitrogen oxide (NOx) is a major cause of smog, and also a cause of acid rain.

4. 500 tons of small particles. Small particulates are a health hazard, causing lung damage. Particulates smaller than 10 microns are not regulated, but may be soon.

5. 220 tons of hydrocarbons. Fossil fuels are made of hydrocarbons; when they don稚 burn completely, they are released into the air. They are a cause of smog.

6. 720 tons of carbon monoxide. Carbon monoxide (CO) is a poisonous gas and contributor to global warming.

7. 125,000 tons of ash and 193,000 tons of sludge from the smokestack scrubber. A scrubber uses powdered limestone and water to remove pollution from the plant痴 exhaust. Instead of going into the air, the pollution goes into a landfill or into products like concrete and drywall. This ash and sludge consists of coal ash, limestone, and many pollutants, such as toxic metals like lead and mercury.

8. 225 pounds of arsenic, 114 pounds of lead, 4 pounds of cadmium, and many other toxic heavy metals. Mercury emissions from coal plants are suspected of contaminating lakes and rivers in northern and northeast states and Canada. In Wisconsin alone, more than 200 lakes and rivers are contaminated with mercury. Health officials warn against eating fish caught in these waters, since mercury can cause birth defects, brain damage and other ailments.

9. Trace elements of uranium. All but 16 of the 92 naturally occurring elements have been detected in coal, mostly as trace elements below 0.1 percent (1,000 parts per million, or ppm). A study by DOE痴 Oak Ridge National Lab found that radioactive emissions from coal combustion are greater than those from nuclear power production.

10. A 500 megawatt coal-fired electrical plant burns 1,430,000 tons of coal, uses 2.2 billion gallons of water and 146,000 tons of limestone a year.

Energy producers using coal pay fines instead of installing scrubbers on coal stacks.

I'd like to know when those "advancements" are getting here, I hope it's before we run out of planet!

Rob

 

[criz067]

CO2 doesn't warm the climate! So, there is no need to cut CO2 emissions.

HS

How did you come to this conclusion?

I am just trying to develop a well-informed opinion and would like to hear an intelligent response since it appears as though you have no doubts.

 

[Rob-D]

How did you come to this conclusion?

I am just trying to develop a well-informed opinion and would like to hear an intelligent response since it appears as though you have no doubts.

He stayed in a Holiday Inn last night.

 

[criz067]

I'd like to know when those "advancements" are getting here, I hope it's before we run out of planet!

Rob

"Advancements" happen all the time. They are happening right now by researchers all over the world. It is the rate at which we advance that needs to pick up. What needs to be addressed is what is hindering the rate at which we advance.

 

[houstonscott]

How did you come to this conclusion?

I am just trying to develop a well-informed opinion and would like to hear an intelligent response since it appears as though you have no doubts.

Climate Change Dispatch - Carbon Dioxide Not a Well Mixed Gas and Can?t Cause Global Warming

There are thousands of articles. The earth has warmed and cooled over millions of years. The trend however can only be towards cooler. Durning times of higher CO2 levels the earth was cooler and during lower CO2 levels the earth was warmer. The two are not concurrent or dependent. There are really only two things that can heat or cool the earth and don't believe anything else. If the sun warms the earth warms if the earth and sun get closer the earth warms. Now you know it all.

HS

 

[newbury]

Climate Change Dispatch - Carbon Dioxide Not a Well Mixed Gas and Can?t Cause Global Warming

Ah, another totally unbiassed source.

Climate Change Dispatch (CCD) is dedicated to debunking, reviewing, and responding to the shrill cries of the media and the global warming zealots who have embraced anthropogenic global warming (AGW) as an eco-religion and not as a scientific endeavor for answers. This site does not dispute that global temperatures have increased, on average less than 1ｰC, over the past 100 years. What CCD does seek to do is repudiate the consensus that the cause is man-made and the principal culprit is CO2, through facts, articles, and other sources not readily available by the mainstream media. One goal is to deconstruct the AGW myth propagated by ex-VP-turned-green activist Al Gore and the highly political IPCC.