Going to look at a 4300 this week

[Tim640]

Hi folks,

Well, I can't stand it anymore and I'll be looking to move from the X500 to a 30-35hp CUT pretty soon.

I'm going to look at a 4300 with about 1500 hours this week.

I'm looking for any advice on particular things I should check out on this tractor. It's a dealer, um, deal - a trade-in by a customer. It's got the 430 FEL and a 72" MMM. I've got a Woods 5' rotary cutter already, left over from a previous tractor buy that didn't quite work out.

I've got about two acres of mowing around the house to do, and another 6 acres of brush that's gradually coming around to pasture. And a bunch of little projects to get done like setting about a half mile of fencing and building a pond. (Gonna hire the pond digging out.)

Tim

 

[RoyJackson]

Good for you!!!

IMHO, the 4300 is one of the best mid sized CUTs Deere ever offered.

Just make sure everything works. Not much electronics on those machines...mostly mechanical and linkages.
The tractor should pull strongly in A and B ranges. C range is more for transport. I'm a gear (reverser, actually) guy...the gear and range selectors are spongy (like an old VW shift lever)...nature of the beast. But you should be able to shift easily. You can shift gears on the fly, but you need to stop to shift ranges.
The intake heater (cold weather device) is actuated by turning the key to "On" (clockwise, first detent) and pushing in (there be an indicator light on the instrument cluster). Hold it for a count of 20, then crank the engine. Yanmar engines start very quickly. You might see a bit of smoke initially...should clear up in a minute or so.
The 430 loader should lift the front end of the tractor just by using the curl function...even at low idle. This is a pretty strong loader, but at 1500 hours, it might be getting a bit loose...only you can determine if you can live with it (or dicker with the dealer for a trade up to the 300cx loader!).
The MFWD lever (on the panel just below and to the left of the operator's seat) should shift into 4 wheel assist easily when in motion with no clunks or other noises. Shifting out can be more difficult..I lift the front end (with the loader...I have a 4400, BTW) and it'll shift out easily.
That's about it...as long as you're comfortable with the tractor, it's probably a good purchase.

If you do buy it, pick up a can or two of Fluid Film and spray the gear (if a gear or reverser) and range (all models) linkage where they enter the transmission case...lube everything per the manual too, of course.

Good luck and post pictures if you buy it!

 

[Verticaltrx]

IMHO, the 4300 is one of the best mid sized CUTs Deere ever offered.

Honestly, I'd say the 4x00 series were some of the worst Deere ever made, but that's just my opinion.

To the OP, the 4400 and 4300 are the same tractor with different hp. Here is a blurb I wrote in another thread about the troubles we've had:

If it is an early model 4400 they had LOTS of known issues. We had one, a '98 model, and in the 1700hrs we had it the following failed:

-front axle seals (twice)
-rear axle seal and bearing
-rear axle housing (3pt mounting tab broke off, twice)
-hydraulic cooler
-seat suspension
-mid-pto engagement arm
-battery cables
-PTO clutch

There are probably some other things I am forgetting, this was by far the worst JD product we ever owned. The tractor wasn't abused, but was used on the farm almost daily for either loader work or bush hogging. These tractors were the first compacts JD built in the US and IMO they rushed them into production without enough R&D. Most of the issues we had are well documented ones and midway through the 4000-series run they changed a lot of parts to correct them. There are a lot of parts for the 4400 that are different based on early or late S/N. Not sure when the S/N break is however. Not trying to scare you, just letting you know some things to be aware of.

 

[RoyJackson]

Honestly, I'd say the 4x00 series were some of the worst Deere ever made, but that's just my opinion.

You're entitled to your opinion, of course...but it is very much of a minority opinion...one of the few I've read on TBN in the last 10 years or so...
That doesn't mean there haven't been trashed 4x00 series tractors...there has been, just as any machine can be trashed.

 

[dfkrug]

I'm looking for any advice on particular things I should check out on this tractor.

I have some of the same concerns as VERTICAL's, but I do like the
ergonomics of the 4300. I really like the easy-start, reliable, economical
engine, too.

The 430 loader is better than the 420 loaders I have, but watch out
for sloppy pin holes in the QA brackets.

The rear plastic fenders are durable, but the hood and engine covers
are fragile, and very expensive. Very expensive.

JD could not quite figure out how to do the front axles, so there were
several interations. I hope your unit is a later model.

Check the rear axle housings closely....the "ears" where the 3-pt hitch
connects.

What does the dealer want for his unit?

I sold my project 4300 this past summer for $15.8K with FEL and hoe.

I am keeping my other running 4300 for a while.

 

[Cidertom]

I had a 4300 that I put over 1K hours on. Good tractor, just not enough HP for current use.

Issues with 4300: Drop- recover on 3pt. The valve used on this series was subject to a leakdown to the point that the valve would recover - with a jerk. The fix was a high pressure filter installed behind the seat. Make certain the fix was done.

Key switch gets hot: Key switch can get very very hot. Never had a failure, but worried about it.

Front axle seal: I had to replace one of the big seals.

Battery tray: Original battery had overflow that caused heavy rusting. Didn't get to radiator but it was close. Some have reported this issue with damage, take a good look

CT

 

[Verticaltrx]

You're entitled to your opinion, of course...but it is very much of a minority opinion...one of the few I've read on TBN in the last 10 years or so...
That doesn't mean there haven't been trashed 4x00 series tractors...there has been, just as any machine can be trashed.

My opinion may be in the minority, but many of the problems we had were not. It was a very functional, easy to use and hard working tractor, when it was working...

I have some of the same concerns as VERTICAL's, but I do like the
ergonomics of the 4300. I really like the easy-start, reliable, economical
engine, too.

The 430 loader is better than the 420 loaders I have, but watch out
for sloppy pin holes in the QA brackets.

The rear plastic fenders are durable, but the hood and engine covers
are fragile, and very expensive. Very expensive.

I'll agree they had a good engine, never a bit of trouble with it. We also had the same issues with the hood, cowl and grill area cracking, had to replace all that before we traded it in, I think it was over $1000 for all the pieces.

One other thing to look out for on the loader is where the loader masts connect to the square tube mount. They can develop major wear here and make the whole loader feel 'rickety' with lots of side to side sway.

 

[RoyJackson]

The rear plastic fenders are durable, but the hood and engine covers
are fragile, and very expensive. Very expensive.

JD could not quite figure out how to do the front axles, so there were
several interations. I hope your unit is a later model.

Check the rear axle housings closely....the "ears" where the 3-pt hitch
connects.

I'm glad you responded, DF...after rebuilding 2 (or is it 3?) 4300's, you're one of the most knowledgable TBNers...
I knew about that early axle problem (scuffing, not a durability problem IIRC) and that was resolved in '99 or 2000...weren't any others to the best of my knowledge... That was one of the things I checked for when I bought my 4400.

I'm seen both the hoods and side panel on eBay fairly often...the hood (less any hinges or mounting hardware) go for just under $300. Don't recall the side panel prices.

Since I mentioned trashed 4x00 tractors...there was a TBNer (can't recall his screen name) who bought a 4300 from a company in western NYS. The mixed tires (turfs on the rear, industrials up front) should have been the giveaway...had problems ever since. I recall this since I as going to look at that same tractor (I was doing some work travel to the area).
So, for Tim...if it looks like a piece of crap, it probably is...

However, I still think the 4x00 series machines are great! Just wish I'd bought a low hour model in 2004 when I had the chance (bought a 790 instead).

 

[Tim640]

Thanks for all the great feedback. That gives me some things to look for.

The 4300 is a '99 model. VERTICAL, if you have any more thoughts on the serial number break, I'd welcome the input. Not sure if this one is new enough to have the right updates.

I know that quite a few folks haven't been happy with the plastic bits. Not to minimize that, but I'm much more concerned about the mechanicals -- axles/tranny/PTO, etc. So I'm looking for all the advice I can get about how to detect any issues or potential issues in advance.

I'm also eyeing the 4310s, the 4400s, and the 4410s. Trying to find a 4400 or 4410 with a mid PTO is tough, but it's what I'd prefer if I can find one for the right price. The extra HP in the same size chassis would be nice to have.

 

[Tim640]

I
Issues with 4300: Drop- recover on 3pt. The valve used on this series was subject to a leakdown to the point that the valve would recover - with a jerk. The fix was a high pressure filter installed behind the seat. Make certain the fix was done.

CT

Tom - Is this an additional part, or a change to a filter that's already there? In other words, if I don't have access to the original owner or service records, how would I detect if this has been done?

Although the fix doesn't sound too $$ if it wasn't done?

 

[Tim640]

What does the dealer want for his unit?

Asking $13k w/ 72" MMM and 430 FEL. 1500 hours or so. And turf tires, which I'm a little worried about given the hills I've got. I may have to hold out for something with R4s. I got to a take a ride down one of my hills on a rented 3520 one dewey morning - I'd been up and down that hill several times the previous afternoon but with the dew it was just a little too slippery and the 3520 slid to the bottom. Scary, with my wife driving past on the driveway at the foot of the hill!

 

[mjncad]

Tim:

I have a 2001 4200 with about 675 hours, and it's been a good rig for me.

DFKRUG is the absolute expert in my opinion on the 4200 - 4400 series tractors.

I learned from Dave that the rear axle housings are cast aluminum, so take a look at the 3PH mounting ears.

I had the battery issue with acid corroding the hydraulic system radiator to the point of failure, which was fixed under warranty on mine. The biggest problem was the Deere batteries of the time leaking acid. Newer Deere batteries are sealed units...finally. The battery is an odd size which means you go to Deere for a battery, or you fabricate new mounting brackets for a common size unit.

Check out the linkages for smooth operation. If this is a HST unit, finding neutral can be tough, and is the nature of the beast.

I like the plastic hood and fenders because they won't rust.

The rockshaft filter mentioned earlier is under the seat on early models and above the PTO guard on later models. It's a sintered bronze unit in a black metal housing about 3" - 4" long by about 1.5" in diameter. If you buy the rig, take it apart, clean it, and assemble it back in the right direction per the manual.

As others have said, the loader masts can get wobbly with age at the mounting tube attached to the frame. DFKRUG shows how to remedy that in his 4300 rebuild. Do a search, and you'll learn more about this series of tractors than you imagine.

If you buy it, buy the shop manual on CD from JD online or via your dealer. It's half the cost of the paper version and you can print out what you need.

 

[Verticaltrx]

The 4300 is a '99 model. VERTICAL, if you have any more thoughts on the serial number break, I'd welcome the input. Not sure if this one is new enough to have the right updates.

I don't know exactly what the break was, in fact I think they redesigned the front axle at least twice in the first few years. You can learn a lot by looking at the JD parts website, the diagrams will show the seals and which axles they fit. There are at least three 'models' of axles they tried: A20BZ103-1, S20BZ105-1, S20BZ109-1. Not sure which is the newest.

Once they got to the 4x10 series they had worked out a few of these bugs, but also introduced E-hydro, which is a whole 'nother ball of wax.

 

[Tim640]

Well, I really appreciate everyone's input. I thought I had it all figured out but there is always more to learn.

I thought hard about some of the issues that folks have mentioned with the 4300s -- the ones that I was looking at were all '99s and I got concerned about whether they had the right updates or not. Any new version of a machine is going to have some teething problems in the first couple years, whether it's cars, trucks, or tractors.... I decided I'd be better off going to the next iteration of JD's mid-size CUT, to a 4310 or 4410.

I also thought harder about the tires and loader and so on, and figured that with my hills and tree work I'd better find something with R4s rather than turf tires, and a heavier 430 loader rather than a 420.

So, I just arranged to buy an '03 4310 with the 430 FEL, a 60" 7-iron deck, and an MX-5 cutter, subject to my final look-see. The tractor's got about 700 hours and looks like it's in great shape, at least from the pictures. I'll go pick up it up next week.

Tim

 

[dfkrug]

So, I just arranged to buy an '03 4310 with the 430 FEL, a 60" 7-iron deck, and an MX-5 cutter, subject to my final look-see. The tractor's got about 700 hours and looks like it's in great shape, at least from the pictures.

Sounds like a good one....I hope the price is good, too. Condition is
everything.

The turf tires on the other unit are a non-starter for your conditions.
Changing to AGs or INDs will require a wheel change, too.

My 2000 4300 not only had the early front axle, the HST control pedals
were totally different from my 2001.

 

[dfkrug]

Once they got to the 4x10 series they had worked out a few of these bugs, but also introduced E-hydro, which is a whole 'nother ball of wax.

Agreed. The E-hydro also went to an electrical, vs mechanical control of
the PTO. There have been some issues with the E-hydro....the owner
will need to stay on top of electrical gremlins, and certainly get the
service manual.

 

[RoyJackson]

So, I just arranged to buy an '03 4310 with the 430 FEL, a 60" 7-iron deck, and an MX-5 cutter, subject to my final look-see. The tractor's got about 700 hours and looks like it's in great shape, at least from the pictures. I'll go pick up it up next week.

Tim

Good luck, Tim!!!
You should be somewhere in the neighborhood of $15K with that tractor.
This one has R-4's?

 

[dfkrug]

As others have said, the loader masts can get wobbly with age at the mounting tube attached to the frame. DFKRUG shows how to remedy that in his 4300 rebuild.

Yeah, I forgot about that. I am very happy with how tight that FEL was
after my repairs. My 2001 FEL is sitting here now, and it is much worse
than the other one. The good news is it is easily fixable. I will do
a thread when I get to it. In the photo you can see how the locator
tab is worn almost halfway thru. This as well as the surface wear on the
square tubing makes the FEL extra wobbly.

The 420 FEL has wimpy cylinder rods (25mm) that bend easily, too. The
430's are thicker, as I recall.

 

[Tim640]

Good luck, Tim!!!
You should be somewhere in the neighborhood of $15K with that tractor.
This one has R-4's?

Thanks! And yes, it has the R4's with a lot of tread. It looks like it's in great shape and according to the owner (original owner) it's been very well maintained and stored. I guess I'll find out for sure tomorrow. We agreed on $12k.

 

[Tim640]

Agreed. The E-hydro also went to an electrical, vs mechanical control of
the PTO. There have been some issues with the E-hydro....the owner
will need to stay on top of electrical gremlins, and certainly get the
service manual.

Yeah, I'm actually not a big fan of electronics in any vehicle. I'm wondering whether these e-Hydro systems will still be working in 20 years.

The deal does include the Service manual on CD, which is a welcome extra.