Ground Breaking Advice

[super55]

What is a 6 1/2 disc? Spacing between pans?

I got the medium duty 6 1/2' Countyline disc from TSC. It's got 20 18" disc blades and I got it set up on the most aggressive setting.

I got 6 80# bags of quickcrete from HD for free that got wet and couldn't sell and rachet strapped them on the disc for extra weight. On the second pass I will hook up a drag I made out of an 8' gate fence to help level the clods and smooth it out and my tilling is done.

My soil doesn't have a lot of clay in it so it breaks up pretty easily.

I wish I had originally bought the 7 footer because it weighs more and a little more heavy duty. But my kubota is only a 25 hp gear drive and I thought it would be too much for it but with the condition of soil I have the 4wd L2500 could have handled it easily.

 

[R W]

Assuming you only go 3-4 inches deep (which would be adequate for a food plot) then yes 90hp would be good for 11 shanks. To pull a chisel like they are designed to do at around 8" 90 hp is not going to cut it. To run a chisel properly you want to go 5-6mph. .

Are you going 8" deep at the first working, much of the country I've chisel ploughed , you would be lucky if you got 4" first time over, second time over after good rain, may get 8" if you wanted to, but mostly aimed from 4"to 6"
As for speed, usually worked between 3.5 and 5.25 mph.

 

[Chilly807]

I guess it depends on what you want for a finished state. Smooth means a turning plow and a disc, rougher ground will be fine with a chisel. If you ever decide you want to turn it into pasture in the future, I'd aim for smooth now and save some work then.

Sean

 

[sqdqo]

Thanks Super, not too many people around here proud of the below zero record. Enough is enough! I am planning on doing a fall plant with no summer plant this year. The fields I have to prepare have been grass for longer than I have been alive.
I plan on turning and or spraying until there is no more grass. Hopefully by mid July, if the snow is gone!, I can plant the plots.
I don't think there are any rental sources in this area so I will probably buy an older used chisel.

QUOTE=super55;3693862]SQDQO,

You planning on mostly putting in fall plots such as brassicas, cereal rye or winter wheat?

I wouldn't recommend planting a summer annual this year such as corn. You'll have way too many weeds to deal with, probably have to ammend the soil, and with the 20' of snow you guys got this year it will be a late plant. Congrats on having the most consecutive below zero days anywhere in the US this year :thumbsup:

If you end up plowing either with moldboard or chisel I would look seriously look at renting one out of having the plowing done versus buying one. Reason being: 1) It sounds stupid I know but you can seriously mess up a field if your good with a plow. If the furrows aren't spaced perfectly than there are hips and dips all over the field and becomes a P.I.T.A to plant seed if using a drill or leveling it out. It's not such an issue with a moldboard. 2) Once the soil is broken up odds are you will rarely use the plow at all and 3) If you soil is like my Michigan soil in the NWLP you might only have about 6 inches of good topsoil. Running a plow could very well take your best soil and bury it under leaving
sand. Plus rocks really like bare soil because as soon you till they seem to sprout up out of the ground everywhere.

I have about 5-6 acres that I do in food plot rotation and I have a plow, disc and a tiller. 90% of my tillage for my food plots is done with my 6 1/2 disc. It's a little light but 500# of weight got it to the point where I can get the soil worked up enough in two passes on virgin ground to be ready to plant. The good thing about 90% of the seeds used for food plots are extremely competitive against weeds and for the most part very forgiving planting.[/QUOTE]

 

[R W]

Appears to becoming a big deal to get 13 acres busted up. Not sure what older machinery is available in your area, but as you are only going over a small area size is not going to matter that much.
First up I'd get a chisel plough, use it when there is moisture in the ground. Cross work it (diagonally) on the next rain, this may not be necessary if the chisel does a good job first time. Depends on your ground.
Depending on the weed and rubbish situation, offset discs or a scarifier with a good set of harrows behind it should do a good job, next time over.
A moldboard may be ok for the first or second working providing you have a good depth of topsoil. I avoid spraying if at all possible.
Usually found it took at least 3 workings to get new ground in order for sowing.. In lighter type soil often got away with 2 workings. Rainfall is also a big factor in regard to the number of workings.

 

[AGRIMAN]

Assuming you only go 3-4 inches deep (which would be adequate for a food plot) then yes 90hp would be good for 11 shanks. To pull a chisel like they are designed to do at around 8" 90 hp is not going to cut it. I pull a 11 shank chisel (see my avatar picture) with a 135hp 16,000 lb tractor with dual wheels and it will stop the tractor in hard spots when running 8" deep. To run a chisel properly you want to go 5-6mph. If you are barely able to creep along it is not going to fracture the
ground and throw dirt like it is supposed to do. Again this probably doesn't matter on a food plot but is just some info.

Yeah, I'm with you, but you now some folks call a S tine cultivator a chisel plow.

 

[AGRIMAN]

I think the aeration of the chisel plow is better than overturning all the sod with a bottom plow,.

I have to respectfully disagree with you on that one. I strip till/rip during the spring and chisel some in the fall, but I still like to break a portion of my row crop land every year and try not to go over five years.

 

[OldMcDonald]

AGRIMAN, I respectfully suggest you can both be right, given the old "it all depends".

sqdqo, One thing that mouldboard ploughs need is nice long fields with ideally exactly straight boundaries - and you need to have the ability (as already pointed out) of setting your plough correctly and maintaining the correct furrow widths. All this is not easy to achieve.

You still have not said what you propose to use to sow the 13 acres.

 

[super55]

I'm sorry I wasn't more clear on the rental part. What I meant was hire a farmer or ask if you could rent his implement for a day. Don't count on the rental part though and even hiring it might be a reach if there's a lot of rocks. Farmers aren't too keen on breaking their equipment.

Have you taken a shovel to test how easily the soil will break up and how much topsoil you have to work with? The UP's soil is vastly different from place to place. I don't know about Marquette but I looked at a couple pieces of land for hunting a couple years ago and was amazed. I looked at parcel in Luce county and it was practically all sand and very loose and another in Baraga and it had pretty good dirt with about a foot of topsoil.

What your dirt is composed of is going to have a huge effect on how you will and how deep you will till.

 

[Deerherd]

For my property a chisel plow wins hands down. With the moldboard, the residue ends up in a band between each standard and makes for poor water and air management. With the chisel that turns you get good fracturing and the residue gets mixed and incorporated into the soil.

Most people I know use the chisel plow.

 

[bdog]

I also prefer a chisel. Moldboard's have their place but they are tricky to use. You have to really pay attention and have them set right or you can screw things up in a hurry. They are directional and you also have a dead furrow to deal with. Not that they are rocket science but they are not like a chisel where you just hook it on and go. With a chisel it is not a big deal if you make overlaps or go different directions or whatever.

 

[AGRIMAN]

For my property a chisel plow wins hands down. With the moldboard, the residue ends up in a band between each standard and makes for poor water and air management. With the chisel that turns you get good fracturing and the residue gets mixed and incorporated into the soil.

Most people I know use the chisel plow.

There nothing wrong with using a chisel. I still run mine in the fall ahead of wheat. It's cheaper and faster than a bottom plow, with less loss of moisture, but I would not say it's better. I'm not suggesting that any one break every year, but I do try and do it every five years.

Since the OP said his field has been in grass for many years, I would break it, as it will help keep the grass/weeds from coming back. I do agree that if he doesn't already own one OR know how to set it, then use the chisel.

 

[AGRIMAN]

I also prefer a chisel. Moldboard's have their place but they are tricky to use. You have to really pay attention and have them set right or you can screw things up in a hurry. They are directional and you also have a dead furrow to deal with. Not that they are rocket science but they are not like a chisel where you just hook it on and go. With a chisel it is not a big deal if you make overlaps or go different directions or whatever.

I agree, setting a bottom plow is not rocket science, but some people do have a hard time with it and if you don't know what your doing you can make a mess. I learned to set one at a early age and once it's set, it's easy to run.

I also agree that furrows are not fun to deal with, but I now run a 5 bottom switch plow which makes life's lot easier.

 

[Gary Fowler]

I guess a lot depends on where you are as to what type of ground breaking you do. Most farms are now no till or minimal till. I haven't seen a moldboard plow used anywhere around me in 40 years. They are good for turning under cover crops but no one does that anymore, just pour on more commercial fertilizer to replace the old fashioned winter cover crop like vetch that provided lots of nitrogen.
TRUE chisel plows are good for breaking up the hard pan that forms in many areas, allowing for water to penetrate deeper into the soil, and they aerate the soil to allow the microbes to do their job better.
For just reseeding, a chisel plow pulled 4-6" deep should break up the ground well enough to seed followed by a light disking to cover the seed.

 

[Tractorrr]

Where can you get a chisel plow?

 

[sqdqo]

I plan on planting annuals not sure just what type yet. Is only want to kill the grass off and loosen the ground for seeding. Am sure I will be adding lime and fertilizer to the mix.

 

[super55]

Everything attachments is one of the few carriers I've seen that carry a chisel plow for a typical CUT. Tractor Ripper, Field Cultivator, Tillage Tool

If your looking at putting in fall annuals you have sometime to work with. First thing I would do is what ever you plan to knock down is to nail it with glyphosate to kill all the vegetation. It will be much easier to break up if everything is dead.

If you can disc than give a couple days to die off and disc again it will break up much easier.

 

[OldMcDonald]

super55, I would call those implements scarifiers. I have been using my 7 tine one today.