Haywagon rebuild thread

[aczlan]

So, a few months back I found a haywagon frame that my FIL bought. The rack on it was "well worn" to say the least, but the running gear looked decent (made by Electric Wheel, nothing wose than surface rust on it).
We bought it and used it when cutting one of our fields (we had more hay than one wagon would fit) and when we finished with that, I pulled the rack off


Stuffed it with the brush that we had gathered


And lit it on fire


It burned quite well, as did then smaller brushpile that we burned at the same time


That was back in mid July, between now and then I have been getting the brackets that hold the frame to the running gear replaced (3/4 of them were made of 1/8" steel and had been welded several times, the new ones were made from 1/4" steel and had better not split.
Last week my brother started painting the running gear and got most of it done (he did not do the front beam which needed to be welded first as it had some holes rusted into it where the frame had been sitting on the running gear).

This morning we had a friend over with his Miller 180 (we need to get a welder), he welded in a 1x2 piece on the one side of the front beam (rusted through) and his son practiced his stringers on the other side of the beam (not rusted through, but pitted). After they left, I repacked the bearings on the wheels (side note, has anyone seen great that looked and felt like caramel? That is what the grease that was in there looked/felt like) and cleaned up the rims with a wire wheel in my angle grinder.

I then painted the wheels and hubs JD Yellow and the front beam JD green. So far, it looks good to me. Here is a picture of how the running gear looks so far:


The plan is to rebuild (or have rebuilt) the rack using the plans I found from the University of Wisconsin View attachment Haywagon Plans 6173_b.pdf

So far the only change from the plan that we are planning on making is to put a door on both sides (rather than just on the LH side)

The intended purpose for this haywagon is to have it be equally good as a haywagon hauling hay and as a haywagon doing hayrides. Does anyone have any suggestions on improvements that we can make now before we purchase the materials or start building?

I will be updating this thread as the project continues.

Thanks

Aaron Z

 

[aczlan]

Structural integrity question: The plans list the sills (going F to R and bolting to the rack) as being 4x8x16 boards, should a 4x6 board (or a 4x6 and a 2x6 sandwiched together) work for this purpose (assuming that there is clearance for the wheels)?
Having the wagon a little lower would be nice at times.

Anyone have any ideas on this?

Thanks

Aaron Z

 

[rambler]

I would build a laminated sill out of 4 2x6 or 3 3x8 and hope that would be strong enough. I won't say for sure tho - 2x6 is really only 5.5 inches, that could have some flex to it.... These days the wood is too poor, 4x6 or 4x8 are too poor, too crooked, etc. One knot & you have a bad piece of wood.

Laminataed is much stronger these days, gets the knots in different places, no warping.

A suggestion - gunk & moisture build up between the floor planks, and rot these sills. (Actually they are stringers.....) Forty years ago dad built a hay wagon, and he put tin over the top of the stringers, nailed through it to mount the planks.

Two years ago I had to rebuild the wagon, the planks were rotted out shot. The stringers were like new, I got 2 new pieces of tin (I got 16 foot white galvalume flashing 10 inches wide) and put it under the flooring. Should be good for another 40 years of stringer.

We do things a little different - we nail or screw the flooring to the 2 stringers, run a 2x6 down each side under the floor, and place 2 bent angle irons under the stringers & up to the 2x6 on the sides. This helps hold the sides up, and doesn't require the extra wood cross pieces and all. We use full 1 inch wood for the flooring.

--->Paul

 

[aczlan]

I would build a laminated sill out of 4 2x6 or 3 3x8 and hope that would be strong enough. I won't say for sure tho - 2x6 is really only 5.5 inches, that could have some flex to it.... These days the wood is too poor, 4x6 or 4x8 are too poor, too crooked, etc. One knot & you have a bad piece of wood.
Laminataed is much stronger these days, gets the knots in different places, no warping.

Will a laminated beam hold up to being "exposed to the elements"? I agree with you on the quality of todays lumber. I have been thinking of seeing if I can get rough cut oak or black locust for the stringers... Will have to think on it.

A suggestion - gunk & moisture build up between the floor planks, and rot these sills. (Actually they are stringers.....) Forty years ago dad built a hay wagon, and he put tin over the top of the stringers, nailed through it to mount the planks.
Two years ago I had to rebuild the wagon, the planks were rotted out shot. The stringers were like new, I got 2 new pieces of tin (I got 16 foot white galvalume flashing 10 inches wide) and put it under the flooring. Should be good for another 40 years of stringer.

I think that we will do that, it is cheap enough and it should help keep the junk off of the stringers. What did you use to preserve the old decking (and what was it made of)?

We do things a little different - we nail or screw the flooring to the 2 stringers, run a 2x6 down each side under the floor, and place 2 bent angle irons under the stringers & up to the 2x6 on the sides. This helps hold the sides up, and doesn't require the extra wood cross pieces and all. We use full 1 inch wood for the flooring.

How does that hold up? I saw something similar on a haywagon near here, but they had used 2x6s for the decking.

Thanks

Aaron Z

 

[rambler]

Well, dad built the hayrack with materials he had laying around about 40 years ago.

So, the decking was homesawn lumber - the back 3 planks were black walnut. Others were mostly elm, with other local hardwoods. All actual 1 inch thickness.

I kid you not. I probably had the most fancy hayrack.....

I redid it with 5/4 treated decking. Only been a couple years, don't know how well that will hold up.

We used to stack 120 bales on it, good load for a running gear made of welded old axles from cars, so it held up well.

Oh, I would think the laminated beam would hold up fine if you cover it as I mentioned with tin. You may want to brush on a bit of a preseravtive as you assemble - used motor oil or a sealer, whichever you prefer.

--->Paul

 

[aczlan]

We do things a little different - we nail or screw the flooring to the 2 stringers, run a 2x6 down each side under the floor, and place 2 bent angle irons under the stringers & up to the 2x6 on the sides. This helps hold the sides up, and doesn't require the extra wood cross pieces and all. We use full 1 inch wood for the flooring

Did this wagon have sides or is it a flatbed wagon? If it has sides, could I trouble you to explain or post a picture of how the sides attach to the floor?


Thanks

Aaron Z

 

[aczlan]

Well, it is painted and the wheels are back on, next we will need to paint/install the brackets and build the frame.

Here is how it currently looks:


Aaron Z

 

[radioman]

very nice job so far.

 

[rambler]

Did this wagon have sides or is it a flatbed wagon? If it has sides, could I trouble you to explain or post a picture of how the sides attach to the floor?


Thanks

Aaron Z

Just a hayrack, no sides.

An old hayrack had 'wobbly' sides, only a foot or so high. Just 3 flat irons on each side, twisted, so it made 3 loops on each side to drop a 1x12 with 3 pegs on it into. Today, one would use a square pocket bracket. This would not make a tight seal unless you really worked at it.

--->Paul

 

[aczlan]

Just a hayrack, no sides.
An old hayrack had 'wobbly' sides, only a foot or so high. Just 3 flat irons on each side, twisted, so it made 3 loops on each side to drop a 1x12 with 3 pegs on it into. Today, one would use a square pocket bracket. This would not make a tight seal unless you really worked at it.

Ok, looks like we will be going with the "traditional" deck as I need to have sides (we have a kicker on our baler). Perhaps a laminate beam will still work.....

Aaron Z

 

[Robert_in_NY]

Ok, looks like we will be going with the "traditional" deck as I need to have sides (we have a kicker on our baler). Perhaps a laminate beam will still work.....

Aaron Z

The beam will work fine. Just seal each piece first before assembling then top it with a metal cap and don't worry. I just replaced my one beam that rotted by laminating 3- 2"x8"x18'. Stained them all first then glued and screwed then bolted them together. Topped them with an aluminum cap and put it in. I also had to double up the 4x4 joists as most of them were cracked where the beam rotted. As soon as I was done I took it to the field and put 200 bales on it without any issues. I am not worried about the beam rotting away anytime soon either. Good luck with your build.

 

[aczlan]

First off, sorry about the picture size, my brother took the pictures on his fancy schmancy phone and they are too small to show much detail.

I started on the rack yesterday. We had a friend who is a carpenter come over. He and I started building at about 8:30am.

First I found that he had ordered 4x6s for the runners, I didnt think they would be strong enough, so we called the lumberyard and they didnt have 4x8s, but they had 9.5x1.5 laminated beams. We ordered four 16 foot ones and they delivered two 16 foot ones and two 18 foot ones for the price of four 16 footers (they ran out of 16 footers)


Then he screwed the pairs of laminated beams together while I went back to the lumberyard to get a few other things we had missed (like flashing)


When I got back we installed the flashing over the runners (so that when the hay falls down it will not rot the beams) and bolted them to the frame


And installed the "strong tie" brackets



Once they were installed we installed the 4x4 joists


And I started on the deck boards while he started notching the 4x4 uprights


I finished screwing down the deck boards


And we started installing the uprights (details on how we fastened them to follow once they are fully fastened, they are currently a work in progress)


Then we started installing the side boards


However we ran out of screws before we finished, being as it was 3pm, we called it a day and I will work more on it later in the week.


More pictures and details to follow

To be completed:
Connecting uprights to the joists in a more secure fashion
Finishing boxing the top of the walls
Front gate
Chains on the side doors
Steps for the side doors (this will be fun)
Finishing installing the boards in the back
Straightening the upright that got screwed in on the wrong side of the mark (a 4" oops)
Spring assist lift for the tongue?
Replacing the nails in the "strong tie" brackets with 1.5" deck screws
Painting the runners JD green
Staining the rest of the wagon (probably next year when the wood has dried) with an opaque stain

If there are any questions/suggestions feel free to make them known

Aaron Z

 

[aczlan]

Some finished pictures at long last:


Clearance from the tires, thinking of notching the beam a little to make it ride ~6" lower, but that hasn't happened yet:


Drop down gate on the front and front braces:


Safety chains go through the tongue, then are independently bolted around the axle (this is the wagon that we use for hayrides):


Aaron Z

 

[KTM Ranch]

Aaron,

Thank you for taking the time to send me the pics, that is exactly what I was looking for. Nice looking job!!

Kenny

 

[joewilshire]

Wonderful rebuild. I just bought an old hay wagon and plan on rebuilding myself.
One question...would it be advisable to put 2 x material spanning the width in between the runners? Like at least one in front and one in the rear?
Any other suggestions you may have put into your plan now that it is finished?

Thanks.

 

[aczlan]

Wonderful rebuild. I just bought an old hay wagon and plan on rebuilding myself.
One question...would it be advisable to put 2 x material spanning the width in between the runners? Like at least one in front and one in the rear?
Any other suggestions you may have put into your plan now that it is finished?
Thanks.

All 4 corners of the runners are bolted to the running gear and there are brackets holding every 4x4 crossbeam to the runners, so it shouldn't be needed, but that's not a bad idea.

If I were to do it again, I would have gone with a single beam on each side for the runners and I would have notched it to make it sit ~4" lower (will probbaly still notch it).

Aaron Z