Here we go another problem !

/ Here we go another problem ! #61  
Unfortunately there are a lot of tractor owners who have no idea what to do with them, but fortunately for those who pay attention on TBN there is a lot of good advise from those who do. It seems common sense is not prevalent in some tractor owners who use their tractors for swamp buggies, push with the box blades, ram their FELs into immovable objects and other not so smart things that help keep the tractor dealers in business with new parts sales.
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #62  
Unfortunately there are a lot of tractor owners who have no idea what to do with them, but fortunately for those who pay attention on TBN there is a lot of good advise from those who do. It seems common sense is not prevalent in some tractor owners who use their tractors for swamp buggies, push with the box blades, ram their FELs into immovable objects and other not so smart things that help keep the tractor dealers in business with new parts sales.

You can't push with with a box blade? I have witnessed a box blade spreading piles of topsoil and gravel "loads" =) of times. Why I wonder do you suppose they put a blade on heavier BB's in both directions?
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #63  
You can't push with with a box blade? I have witnessed a box blade spreading piles of topsoil and gravel "loads" =) of times. Why I wonder do you suppose they put a blade on heavier BB's in both directions?
The problem is when you hit something hard when going backward (ie: digging with it vs spreading with it) you will tend to pretzel the 3 point arms and generally make a mess.

Aaron Z
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #64  
The problem is when you hit something hard when going backward (ie: digging with it vs spreading with it) you will tend to pretzel the 3 point arms and generally make a mess.

Aaron Z

Agreed, but that's not how Gary phrased it. I recon if you bash anything WITH anything hard enough, it will break.
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #65  
Agreed, but that's not how Gary phrased it. I recon if you bash anything WITH anything hard enough, it will break.
But going in reverse you are putting a flat piece of steel in compression which is its weakest direction. Your 3 point arms will take a lot more beating pulling a boxblade than pushing one.

Aaron Z
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #66  
If three point hitches were made to push they would of put them up front.:laughing:
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #67  
If three point hitches were made to push they would of put them up front.:laughing:

So,,, the companies making box blades with blades for both directions are what? Crazy? Or is it that if you use the box blade within the limits of what it and the tractor were designed for, then you can get away with "Pushing Stuff".
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #68  
speaking of pushing with the box blade, it's usually not the intent that gets you, it the surprises! I've bent my stabilizer bars pushing loose dirt. No problem with the dirt, it was the hidden stump that got me! Whack! luckily all I bent were the stabilizers.
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #69  
So,,, the companies making box blades with blades for both directions are what? Crazy? Or is it that if you use the box blade within the limits of what it and the tractor were designed for, then you can get away with "Pushing Stuff".
If you stay withing the limits you should be fine, but the limits are much higher pulling (going forward) than pushing (going backward) and many people dont realize that.

Aaron Z
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #70  
If you stay withing the limits you should be fine, but the limits are much higher pulling (going forward) than pushing (going backward) and many people dont realize that.

Aaron Z

Lol,,, Thanks man.
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #71  
Just to get it right the oil, filter ect. Had been changed 3 X and the filter alone had been changed 6 just FYI, it was also months b4 any problems reared there ugly head,
I have read about that happening several times on ATV sites.
They sink an ATV in muddy water. They flush the motor and change the oil. Motor runs fine so they think they got away with it. 10 hours later they spin a bearing.
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #72  
I have read about that happening several times on ATV sites.
They sink an ATV in muddy water. They flush the motor and change the oil. Motor runs fine so they think they got away with it. 10 hours later they spin a bearing.

Is it usually main, or rod, bearings?
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #73  
Is it usually main, or rod, bearings?

I think rod bearings are more susceptible to water...


I suspect that the engine in question for this thread, had more damage than just one bearing though, if they were looking for a whole new engine....
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #75  
From what I have read, it seems most often rod bearings.


Sunk my Honda Rincon in 2 times, once it floated to the surface and went belly up :) Both times I drained as much water as I could and rode it home. Once home I change the oil and the oil filter three times, air filter once, axle fluids twice and the radiator fluid was purged. Still going strong and its a 2004 (bought in 2003)-trust it with my life. Doesnt burn oil and transmission (has a torque converter like a car) isnt slipping at all even under load, plowing snow.
I dont thnk diesels are as forgiving.
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #76  
I would have been surprised to hear its normally main bearings, but you never know. Mains are usually significantly tighter, and that should help prevent anything big from being able to contaminate the soft bearing face, leading to heat, scoring, spinning, etc. Regardless, it's an ugly topic!
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #77  
Agreed, but that's not how Gary phrased it. I recon if you bash anything WITH anything hard enough, it will break.

The way I phrased it is correct. You don't push with a box blade using a CUT. The lift arms are too fragile and will bend or break as the current post with the JD lift arm shows. The problem is not that you cant use the back of the blade to spread loose dirt and rocks but hitting an immovable object while going in reverse puts severe strain on the lift arms. Most of them on CUT wont stand that strain. The box blade, even the super light duty ones, are stronger that a CUT lift arms so they are the weak link.
PUSH WITH IT IF YOU LIKE, AND AS YOU READ MY POST, PHRASE THEM HOWEVER YOU WANT. You likely wont get too many people to agree with you. If you have a FEL on your tractor, there is no need to ever push backward with the back blade.
While on the subject, back dragging or even going forward with the FEL bucket is not suppose to be done with the bucket blade curled down at much more than 10 degrees for the same reason, hitting something like a stump might bend the bucket or break the hydraulic cylinders if they are fully extended.
NOW do I do any of these things, heck yes but I don't recommend them to others due to the potential for mishap. I have a slight bow in the LS 7010 FEL bucket blade due to doing just what I have said not to do. Back dragging with the bucket tilted more than 10 degrees (more like 45) and hit a small stump that I didn't know was there and going too fast when I did it. A lot of my advise that I share is because I have been there, done that and paid for the consequences. Some times I get lucky when breaking the rules and don't damage the equipment but that doesn't mean that I would recommend to others to do it. Before I got my backhoe, I used the FEL to dig up huge rocks and point loaded the bucket heavily which should never be done and I would never recommend to others to do it. Sometimes we have to do with what we have, weigh the consequences of our actions with our ability to pay for them and then either proceed or decline. That is why we have free choices in life.
Many times I may post advice as to not do some particular thing, all the while doing this myself, but I have years and year of tractor operation experience and pretty much know what "I" can do but not necessarily what a NOOB can do and not hurt either himself or his equipment. For example, I use my tractor with FEL to punch up a burning brush pile, pushing well into the flames to bunch the wood together, but I don't recommend this to others for reasons of safety. I guess you can say I am like the old preacher who was caught fooling around with one of the wifes, "Don't do as I DUZ, do as I say DUZ."
 
/ Here we go another problem ! #78  
Gary:

I didn't want to have to get into fine granularity on something like this. But what you and I are talking about is a matter of perspective.

I don't disagree with anything you have said here. It's all perfectly logical. But it is still missing the point.

There is a "Right Way" and a "Wrong Way" for everything. Or at least there are always "Better Ways" of doing something if not necessarily "Right".

I have watched countless loads of topsoil and gavel spread with no ill effect whatsoever with box blades on small Cut Sized tractors. Maybe you would not Recommend ever pushing with a box blade because that is the only way to ensure that you never damage your tractor. Although even dragging a box blade into a stump at speed could do so. But my point is, and a valid one I believe, is that used properly, you absolutely can push with a box blade.

So what does properly mean? Well, if you are laying gravel in your new driveway, or spreading topsoil on your lawn, propely would mean making certain that there are no stumps or rocks large enough and close enough to the surface that would cause a potential problem. It also would mean not driving at breakneck speeds, and having enough control over you tractor to be able to sense and stop when there is something going wrong. There is a reason box blades, even ones for SCUT's have double blades for pushing and pulling. And used correctly, a box blade is probably one of the most useful implements a person can own. If you are using it in a manner that could cause damage, then that is totally on the operator. You and I simply have a different perspective on this particular issue. And I think that a blanket statement saying that you can not, or should not push with a box blade discounts a whole lot of work that can actually be done safely with them. I think the manufacturers of these implements would agree. But that is my view on it, and now we have both had the opportunity to make our arguments.

Thanks
 

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