How agriculture works thread

[Creamer]

Great video of a commercial made in the 1950's for Allis Chamlers. Some years ago we meet a fellow of worked in that tractor plant in Milwaukee WI. Most of implments I'd seen but most were parked by the time I seen them. One i never saw was that disk plow. Has anyone seen one?? What were they for?

The Disc plow was supposed to be a replacement of the standard plow. Ford/Dearborn made one as well. The reason for the change was that since the disc rotated instead of dragging through the soil they pulled easier. Although I never use done those I have talked to said that in a lot of residual - or trash in Ag talk - they did not get the trash turned over as well as a moldboard plow and the field did not look as clean. Remember, one of the primary reasons for plowing was to get the weed seeds turned under so that they would not grow and so there was concern that they didn't do as good of job at the primary purpose for plowing.

 

[Creamer]

I find it very interesting that Dr. Beck said that tillage means weeds when that was the primary purpose for all tillage to start with except to loosen the ground to plant which needs very little ground disturbance. The corn cultivator that the video starts with is obsolete on all but 'organic' farms. Dr. Beck also has a problem with the 'organic' people because they are so focused on no chemicals that they are actually continuing the soil destruction which is exactly opposite of most of their goals.

Dr. Beck's ability to grow corn year after year on the same ground with no fertilizer or chemicals is the ideal that most organic people are going after but they have a mindset that does not allow them to get there. (The other problem is that most organics are too small to have buffer zones to keep their neighbors' weed seeds from invading.) Instead Dr. Beck uses minimal chemical to help with the transition back to organic.

 

[ArlyA]

Corn stubble becomes an excellent place to hunt pheasant in that part of the country. I miss it.

This is what corn stubble looks like for those who might not know. How do you get close enough to birds who see you coming X feet away? They run or fly, long before you are close enough for a shot. Tall grass, reeds unharvested corn yes, but not stubble..

 

[Jstpssng]

I'm all too familiar with corn stubble, that's why I was questioning how you can do no-till. Common lore has also been that if you leave the trash on the field you are more prone to get borers... not necessarily a concern with feed corn.

Generally hunting the edges of the fields works well. Also remember that birds are a lot lower to the ground than we are, so can't see as far out across the field.

 

[Torvy]

This is what corn stubble looks like for those who might not know. How do you get close enough to birds who see you coming X feet away? They run or fly, long before you are close enough for a shot. Tall grass, reeds unharvested corn yes, but not stubble.. View attachment 711518

Dogs and blockers. I've done quite well walking stubble. You are right though, they run. Unharvested corn is good, but not if you have any short hunters. They hit the corn swinging on the birds.

 

[sixdogs]

I find it very interesting that Dr. Beck said that tillage means weeds when that was the primary purpose for all tillage to start with except to loosen the ground to plant which needs very little ground disturbance. The corn cultivator that the video starts with is obsolete on all but 'organic' farms. Dr. Beck also has a problem with the 'organic' people because they are so focused on no chemicals that they are actually continuing the soil destruction which is exactly opposite of most of their goals.

Dr. Beck's ability to grow corn year after year on the same ground with no fertilizer or chemicals is the ideal that most organic people are going after but they have a mindset that does not allow them to get there. (The other problem is that most organics are too small to have buffer zones to keep their neighbors' weed seeds from invading.) Instead Dr. Beck uses minimal chemical to help with the transition back to organic.

It's interesting to read all of this on zero-tillage. For years around here the trend has been to minimum tillage with only a few trips over the ground per year. Lately, it's evolved further and my farm ground hasn't had any tillage for the past five years and yields are fine. This year, right after planting, we had a month-long drought but the beans looked OK. With rainfall after that, the crop now looks great and plants are 3'-4' tall and full of pods. There is a reduced need for fertilizer but I can't imagine growing corn over corn over corn without fertilizer because corn takes so much out of the ground.


From what I've learned of zero tillage, I no longer "rip" my vegetable garden 12" down but just cultivate each fall and then plant in the spring. Other factors enter into things but we're having the highest tomato yield ever this year. We normally get 175 lb to 200 lb and this year are already at 235 lbs and maybe 100 lbs are still left to ripen.

With most of the corn belt having some element of clay compaction, I think you'll still need to vertical tillage rip the ground every x number of years--maybe 5. This barely ruffles the surface. Gravel type ground such as New England would likely never need tillage and most rocks could stay hidden.

With some yield forecasts doubling going out 25 years, guys wondered how this could be possible. More fertilizer? Coated seeds that you could plant in the fall for the next year? Genetic improvement in seed? Probably all these things but zero tillage will likely have a huge impact as well.

 

[ArlyA]

Another classic 1950's Allis Chalmers video on cutting with there forage harvester.

 

[ArlyA]

It's interesting to read all of this on zero-tillage. For years around here the trend has been to minimum tillage with only a few trips over the ground per year. Lately, it's evolved further and my farm ground hasn't had any tillage for the past five years and yields are fine. This year, right after planting, we had a month-long drought but the beans looked OK. With rainfall after that, the crop now looks great and plants are 3'-4' tall and full of pods. There is a reduced need for fertilizer but I can't imagine growing corn over corn over corn without fertilizer because corn takes so much out of the ground.


From what I've learned of zero tillage, I no longer "rip" my vegetable garden 12" down but just cultivate each fall and then plant in the spring. Other factors enter into things but we're having the highest tomato yield ever this year. We normally get 175 lb to 200 lb and this year are already at 235 lbs and maybe 100 lbs are still left to ripen.

With most of the corn belt having some element of clay compaction, I think you'll still need to vertical tillage rip the ground every x number of years--maybe 5. This barely ruffles the surface. Gravel type ground such as New England would likely never need tillage and most rocks could stay hidden.

With some yield forecasts doubling going out 25 years, guys wondered how this could be possible. More fertilizer? Coated seeds that you could plant in the fall for the next year? Genetic improvement in seed? Probably all these things but zero tillage will likely have a huge impact as well.

We're going home to central SD for Thanks giving and I'll try asking my family members which tillage they do. I thought it was minimal type.

 

[mx1alex]

I'm all too familiar with corn stubble, that's why I was questioning how you can do no-till. Common lore has also been that if you leave the trash on the field you are more prone to get borers... not necessarily a concern with feed corn.

Generally hunting the edges of the fields works well. Also remember that birds are a lot lower to the ground than we are, so can't see as far out across the field.

Before BT corn, the stalks would rot down fairly fast on their own and you could run a planter through them just fine. Now most corn is BT. So you don't need to worry about corn borer anymore..... but now the stalks are healthier and they take longer to break down. Enter Precision farming. With the accuracy of today's GPS driven tractors they can plant directly between the rows of stalks and not have to deal with the planter bouncing over them. Or they just plant on a slight angle as the previous year's corn so that each year's current row only passes last years row every 20 ft or so.

 

[sixdogs]

Here's a tale of picking potatoes in Maine sixty years apart.

This first video is from 1961. It shows potatoes on the ground, having been dug by a tractor-pulled digger that dug under the plant and lifts the potatoes out of the ground, shakes most of the dirt off of them and then drops them back in the row.
From there, pickers (mostly kids) would put the potatoes in a woven ash basket and then dump the potatoes into a barrel. The barrel is tagged with the picker's number and then a truck comes along to hoist the full barrels onto the truck and then on to the potato house for storage. Whew. What back breaking work for peanuts in pay. Here's that video.

Fast forward to today. Below is a modern potato harvester working at speeds unthinkable to the boys of 1961. Automatically dug, dirt shaken and brushed off, converered past workers that pick out rocks and bad spuds and then dumped in a cart traveling alongside the harvester. Then off for storage or to a processing plant. These machines are very expensive and where a 60 acre farm could feed a family, it now takes multiples of that to pay the bills and equipment. A lot of Maine potatoes are processed into frozen things like tater tots or chips and chip-looking snacks. Here you go...