How does GM measure horsepower?

   / How does GM measure horsepower? #11  
They advertise at less than they are capable of. This way, when another manufacturer ups them by 5 HP, then can advertise 10 more HP the following model year without having to tweak them.

After a few years, they tweak the computer or adjust the cam to gain more HP.

It's all a marketing gimmick to say who has the most HP.
 
   / How does GM measure horsepower? #12  
Another issue is visual cues. Riding in my dads Corvette doing 80mph seems a lot faster than riding in my F-350 doing the same. I guess its being close to the ground. Same thing with a airplane. I fly at about 525mph at 38,000' and it seems like we are barley moving but when coming in to land at about 140mph it seems like we are screaming.

Chris
 
   / How does GM measure horsepower? #13  
When I bought my new silverado, i was told it had 315hp/335tq. The truck feels alot stronger than this. I drove a Titan that had similar hp numbers and it felt the same acceleration wise. Does GM measure these numbers at the rear wheels or flywheel? This trucks acceleration acts more like 350hp, which has me curious.

In direct response to your question, it is my understanding that all auto/truck manufacturers MUST use the same standards. Horsepower is measured at the flywheel with all accessories hooked up, not at the rear wheels.

By contrast all boat motors are measured at the propeller.
 
   / How does GM measure horsepower?
  • Thread Starter
#14  
In direct response to your question, it is my understanding that all auto/truck manufacturers MUST use the same standards. Horsepower is measured at the flywheel with all accessories hooked up, not at the rear wheels.

By contrast all boat motors are measured at the propeller.

That is what I was looking for. I figured that was where it was measured. I wonder if they test each and every engine??
 
   / How does GM measure horsepower? #15  
People talk about the muscle cars of the good ole days. The funny thing is both a new Honda Accord V6 and Toyota Camry V6 are faster 0 to 60 than most of the muscle cars. A 6 sec 0 to 60 was very rare years ago.

As for trucks the old carburated 350's, 454's, etc have nothing on the newer 5.7 to 6.2L V8's. The new vehicles really have great power. The old one's had plenty of grunt but were slow and ran out of breath quick...
 
   / How does GM measure horsepower? #16  
I worked in that area for quite a while at the GM Proving Grounds in Milford. The horsepower rating is the peak power at the max allowed rpm. When you draw a power or torque curve, the 'feel' you like is the rate of change of the horsepower (first derivative). Its the slope of the power curve that gets you the launch. In most cases in GM vehicles, power must be limited by computer management because of transmission or ring gear durability issues. When those issues are resolved, the fuel is often opened up if Marketting can swallow or buy into the CAFE loss. If they can't, then Engineering may investigate how to get into a lower Weight Class by use of aluminum structures or reduced content.

The EPA also has a hand in the power delivery because emissions is THE major player in power design. The motor's first 20 seconds of warmup during the EPA test cycle defines the performance allowed, because that's when the engine is dirtiest. Fuel economy goals have to be met too. In fact, extra raw fuel must be dumped into the motor to heat the converter ASAP to get the emissions requirements met. That extra fuel is expensed as a fuel economy penalty for the powertrain rating printed on the sticker.

I spent many hours in meetings and EPA test cells at the Emissions Lab watching this all go down.
 
   / How does GM measure horsepower? #17  
I worked in that area for quite a while at the GM Proving Grounds in Milford. The horsepower rating is the peak power at the max allowed rpm. When you draw a power or torque curve, the 'feel' you like is the rate of change of the horsepower (first derivative). Its the slope of the power curve that gets you the launch. In most cases in GM vehicles, power must be limited by computer management because of transmission or ring gear durability issues. When those issues are resolved, the fuel is often opened up if Marketting can swallow or buy into the CAFE loss. If they can't, then Engineering may investigate how to get into a lower Weight Class by use of aluminum structures or reduced content.

The EPA also has a hand in the power delivery because emissions is THE major player in power design. The motor's first 20 seconds of warmup during the EPA test cycle defines the performance allowed, because that's when the engine is dirtiest. Fuel economy goals have to be met too. In fact, extra raw fuel must be dumped into the motor to heat the converter ASAP to get the emissions requirements met. That extra fuel is expensed as a fuel economy penalty for the powertrain rating printed on the sticker.

I spent many hours in meetings and EPA test cells at the Emissions Lab watching this all go down.
Interesting facts from the Development dept.Personally I believe GM dropped the ball several years ago. I had been a totally loyal buyer for years. The product failed to perform. Now we are supposed to invest again at three times the past prices for a pick-up to drive to work.? Regardless of the HP ratings?? Jy.
 
   / How does GM measure horsepower? #18  
Nothing personal to Mr. Sweets, but 300 hp from the 60's can't hold a candle to todays 300 hp. The older ones were gross hp and todays are net hp. The rating method changed around 1972.

Now, some of those 60's engines rated at "300" were probably more as I think they were way conservative back then for insurance reasons.

Also, look how much vehicles weigh these days. They just keep getting heavier and heavier. A 300 hp truck from the 60's would probably need 450 hp in todays truck to feel the same.
 
   / How does GM measure horsepower? #19  
An another hp comparison. A couple of friends had a difference of opinion - one having a 1969 Chevelle SS 396 slightly built, the other with a 2006 Pontiac GTO with the 6.0L. Each thought he had the faster car - especially the guy with the 69 Chevelle as he initiated the challenge. From 20mph roll for approx. 1/8 mile. The GTO had him from the start and the lead grew the further they went. Pretty strong cars out there today.
 
   / How does GM measure horsepower? #20  
An another hp comparison. A couple of friends had a difference of opinion - one having a 1969 Chevelle SS 396 slightly built, the other with a 2006 Pontiac GTO with the 6.0L. Each thought he had the faster car - especially the guy with the 69 Chevelle as he initiated the challenge. From 20mph roll for approx. 1/8 mile. The GTO had him from the start and the lead grew the further they went. Pretty strong cars out there today.

My neighbor had a 351W in a early 70's Mustang. He did quite a bit of stuff to it to do 13sec 1/4 miles. His wife's 2005 Lincoln Aviator will beat it stock.

Chris
 

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