How self sufficient are you ? Honestly ?

[Pharm]

I take no meds to stay alive or any other reason, neither do any of us in our group.

We both have tractors, we both have an interest in being prepared, we both believe in God, etc.

Life is a choice, I've held dying loved ones in my arms, I know a lot about dying, I know about meds and dying with dignity. The medical profession has nothing to do with dignity, the medical profession is about profit just like the pharmaceutical industry. Who here thinks the pharmaceutical industry wants you to get well and stop taking drugs?

"Create your own system or be enslaved by another's."

William Blake

Well... Ahem...

I've got to say that's a pretty cynical view of the medical profession, and while I agree that often any business can be motivated by greed and profits - the broad brush you paint the medical profession with is just not in touch with history or reality.

Diabetes was a death sentence before 1920 ... until insulin could be produced.

My mother in law was saved by the advent of Penicillin - wouldn't have married the wife I have or had the great children I have if she hadn't got it - and it had just become readily available in the nick of time.

I have a coworker who was diagnosed with Rheumatoid arthritis who was pretty much wheel chair bound until a successful diagnosis was made and a drug regimen was prescribed - you wouldn't know she had a problem now.

Many health professional have put themselves in harms way as well, whether working with polio victims in the past, helping wounded soldiers on the battlefield, or working with ebola victims in Africa.

It's easy to take pot shots when your relatively healthy and things are going great - but as soon as your bit by the first rabid animal, or contract tetanus through an infected wound, or even get a need a root canal - the medical profession all the sudden takes on great importance.

But for the grace of God go I.

 

[tungularafishcamp]

Anytime you paint with a broad brush you get paint where it doesnt belong. The doctor in town that delivered both my daughters, (well he let me catch the 2nd one is a traditional licensed md yet he helps folks look at ALL the options and is not afraid of saying "I dont know" when he doesnt.

"Modern medicine" definitely needs a seat at the table as well as homeopathic and eastern medicine. It is up to us (or more likely our wives to figure out the best course of action for ourselves. Nice to have choices and the best choice for us might not be the best choice for another.

One of my best friends has it in his mind he wants to make it to 100 no matter what and I go more along your lines Rob, I wanna be around only as long as I can do what I want and have fun doing it. Neither of us would dream of telling the other that he should do it our way!

Something in our human makeup makes many of us want everyone to be/live like us, I guess to justify our choices, but that is what they are is choices and I for one am glad that everyone doesnt make the same choices I have or there wouldnt be any elbow room here and I would have to live somewhere else!

 

[EE_Bota]

Mac,
That's a good question. The reason I go is not to get medical attention but to be diagnosed. Healing myself is my responsibility but I have nothing against diagnostic tools, Lipids,cholesteroll, stress tests, etc. I use the info to modify my diet. By the way, I took a stress test a few years ago and my pulse went up to 170, the doctor told me I lasted longer on the treadmill than anyone he ever sent for a stress test. I don't do anymore stress tests!

But remember, health and fitness are two entirely different things. Fit people die everyday (the runner Jim Fixx, for example) and while I have no symptoms and am very healthy I will still use the system to my advantage. I used to get a prostate exam but the doctor told me not to come back anymore obviously I have no problems.
As far as butter, I wouldn't go over board with it, while each of us has a different genetic make up, eating a lot of butter is asking for trouble.

As far as people getting hot here, I personally don't understand it. I'm happy to disagree with people but give me logic, heck I'm not angry at anyone! My life works great and the reason it does is because I'm honest with myself and the people around me but I think you're right, the US is a hot headed country. If someone says something to me and it makes sense, I change, what's the problem but if someone thinks they are going to get meds when things get tough, well I hope they do but I think if you're in that boat, you're already well behind the eight ball!

Many of your comments sound like you crossed Scientology and Survivalism. That tends to make people get a little hot under the collar, though I've mostly ignored you in some cases, and reworded your comments to be what you must have meant to say since I know you are a good person.

 

[EE_Bota]

You don't want to go down this road, read some history. Manifest Destiny, The Spanish American War, and yes, WWII, etc., etc.

You know what Ike's Sec of State said?

"America doesn't have friends, America has interests." He was known for his exploitation of Latin America.

America is a country, it's got good and its got bad just like most other countries in the world. We're not out to save the world, FDR went into WWII for two reasons, one because his New Deal wasn't bringing us out of the depression fast enough and he knew a war would change that and two, Winston told him they could beat the German's without us. It had nothing to do with saving a people anymore than Kuwait did. If we cared about saving a people we would have gone into Tibet when China was slaughtering Buddhists... we gave China favorite trade status. Wars are only fought for two reasons, God and money.

There are no great countries only great people.

That does not account for the people in America who sent their personal weapons to help out the Brits in one of the world wars. Also, I think you are claiming more about the motivation for the war than you actually know and can prove.

 

[EE_Bota]

Well... Ahem...

I've got to say that's a pretty cynical view of the medical profession, and while I agree that often any business can be motivated by greed and profits - the broad brush you paint the medical profession with is just not in touch with history or reality.

Diabetes was a death sentence before 1920 ... until insulin could be produced.

My mother in law was saved by the advent of Penicillin - wouldn't have married the wife I have or had the great children I have if she hadn't got it - and it had just become readily available in the nick of time.

I have a coworker who was diagnosed with Rheumatoid arthritis who was pretty much wheel chair bound until a successful diagnosis was made and a drug regimen was prescribed - you wouldn't know she had a problem now.

Many health professional have put themselves in harms way as well, whether working with polio victims in the past, helping wounded soldiers on the battlefield, or working with ebola victims in Africa.

It's easy to take pot shots when your relatively healthy and things are going great - but as soon as your bit by the first rabid animal, or contract tetanus through an infected wound, or even get a need a root canal - the medical profession all the sudden takes on great importance.

But for the grace of God go I.

Anyone who can judge entire countries can judge professions, and with a broad brush paint both very quickly. But his comments don't sound like the medical professionals in my family either.

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

Get ready because here it comes ,NBC uses halftime to promote GUN CONTROL ? Why do these people think that by restricting our rights to gun ownership they will reduce crime ? When I can go to any local gun show and buy whatever I want "from private dealers " with barely flashing a photo id ? When has the rights of the city dweller become more important than mine ? Why has Obama ordered all his civil offices to purchase millions and millions of bullets ? Why when anyone can buy any type of gun they want with no paperwork or id do they think that restricting legal gun sales to legal gun buyers will turn the tide of illegal acts ? Who do the government intend on shooting when the social ad min is buying 174,000 bullets and sending them to 41 major cities , check for yourself the gov is buying bullets thru many civil administration offices and sending them to stockpiles in major cities ? Why ?

 

[Soundguy]

You folks in the US of A really are an angry lot.

there's been fighting in t he mid east since time began.. people fighting over sand and killing each other dialy.. bombing themselves .. car bombs..e tc.. and we are angry? right.. open your eyes..

Calm down, leave your gun in the cabinet.

unfortunately.. not how it works. when you bend over.. bad things happen... carrying a big stick never hurts.

You do know that most of the world considers you, as a country, to be ill-tempered and warmongers. This thread confirms it.

I really could care less what most of the world thinks.

lets see.. whould that be greece and spain.. thee ones that have one of the worst economies in the world.. if you discount that african country where inflation is about 1million%

would tyhat be isreal and palestine.. still fighting?

would that be afghanistan, iraq, iran.... where a body can be drug down a street if they suspect you are in the wrong party?

what about syra.. where you can just wipe out anybody not aligned to the govt?

egypt? why not call him a king? what's the differenc ein a king and a president who grabs unlimited power?

the list goes on buddy....

You will all blow each other to bits in a very short time..

our history albiet, short compaired to some other countries, disproves this. we've already been thru a 'at throat' war with our civil war... and have been past the 'shotout in the street' western justice system.

neither did us in.. just made us stronger as a people.

soundguy

 

[Rob-D]

Many of your comments sound like you crossed Scientology and Survivalism. That tends to make people get a little hot under the collar, though I've mostly ignored you in some cases, and reworded your comments to be what you must have meant to say since I know you are a good person.

Believe me I'm not a Scientologist!

You're making statements that don't reflect a alternative opinion that can be questioned with logic, if you think my views are inaccurate or wrong than please offer a logical rebuttal and not simply an overall opinion.

As far as making people hot under the collar, it is not my intention, I call it like I see it, if someone is getting hot then they have to ask them self why. I'm not insulting anyone but I am challenging traditional views. You or anyone else has the right to offer your counter views like Jesse, Rick and Mac just did and I think very well. We are all learning, and one's ability to change when confronted with reason defines his ability to survive through adaptation in a changing world.

 

[Barry 1]

Get ready because here it comes ,NBC uses halftime to promote GUN CONTROL ? Why do these people think that by restricting our rights to gun ownership they will reduce crime ? When I can go to any local gun show and buy whatever I want "from private dealers " with barely flashing a photo id ? When has the rights of the city dweller become more important than mine ? Why has Obama ordered all his civil offices to purchase millions and millions of bullets ? Why when anyone can buy any type of gun they want with no paperwork or id do they think that restricting legal gun sales to legal gun buyers will turn the tide of illegal acts ? Who do the government intend on shooting when the social ad min is buying 174,000 bullets and sending them to 41 major cities , check for yourself the gov is buying bullets thru many civil administration offices and sending them to stockpiles in major cities ? Why ?

"Agenda 21 !!!"

 

[Rob-D]

That does not account for the people in America who sent their personal weapons to help out the Brits in one of the world wars. Also, I think you are claiming more about the motivation for the war than you actually know and can prove.

I held the highest clearance this country offers. I saw things very few of you have ever seen and I was sitting in by a teletype when the Pueblo got captured.
If you want to read a book read "The American People's History of the United States" by Howard Zinn. He said things in there that we knew 50 and 60 years ago but have just now been released to the public sector.

The constitution of this country was drafted by some truly brilliant men. Franklin said, "It's a Republic, if you can keep it", when we gave corporations the rights of individuals we took away individual rights... we couldn't keep it. Capitalism in the form of greed (read lobby money) has changed the face of this country.