Hydro power loss? 20%, not on it's worst day!

KNotMe · Jul 20, 2004

Re: Hydro power loss? 20%, not on it\'s worst day!

There is no power loss in an HST, remember that basic fact of physics, energy is neither newly created nor destroyed. If we assume an increased safety/efficiency in a particular HST machine when compared to a geared one for a given application, then the reduction in horsepower at the PTO for example does not represent a loss of energy, but a transformation of that energy to the increased efficiency/safety. Nobody complains about the power loss in assisted steering, or the power loss when they turn on their worklights, because of the appreciation for the benefit that accrues from the transformed energy.

Your bias against HST is interesting, you have stated that you will not buy the new 4X20 by your beloved JD for that reason.

cowboydoc · Jul 20, 2004

Re: Hydro power loss? 20%, not on it\'s worst day!

Yea this is another good one. My beloved John Deere. In that same thread that I get hammered on for hydro issue I say how stupid deere is for not having draft control and not putting a reverser in the 4720. But I'm a deereoid, yep. Heck I'm trying to do a deal on the New Holland that Robert turned me on to. Yea I'm a dyed in the wool deereoid for sure. I don't like hydros, I like deere equipment, yea I'm just a really bad person.

KNotMe · Jul 20, 2004

Re: Hydro power loss? 20%, not on it\'s worst day!

Cowboydoc,

Nice response, you took my comments in good spirits without offense which is the way it should be.

More grease to your elbow.

Egon · Jul 20, 2004

Re: Hydro power loss? 20%, not on it\'s worst day!

Doc, I can understand an HST in a combine as ground speed can be varied according to the required feed rate and yet the internals are still running at the proper RPM. Don't think its a lot of fun to clean out a plugged up combine. Many years ago a neighbour had the straw chopper plug up and was found some time later minus part of his head.

As for a tractor used pulling ground engaging equipment I 'd go for the gears.

For the type of use my little Kubota sees HST is the way to go.

Egon

cowboydoc · Jul 20, 2004

Re: Hydro power loss? 20%, not on it\'s worst day!

I agree that hydro in a combine is the way to go for sure. Hydro in the little compacts and sub-compacts is probably the way to go as well.

Robert_in_NY · Jul 20, 2004

Re: Hydro power loss? 20%, not on it\'s worst day!

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Yea I'm a dyed in the wool deereoid for sure. I don't like hydros, I like deere equipment, yea I'm just a really bad person. )</font> /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif Don't worry to much about this Doc. There are some things best left alone. Has the weather been better to you then it has to me? I can not get more then two good days in a row before we get another 3 of rain. It is getting really frustrating.

cowboydoc · Jul 20, 2004

Re: Hydro power loss? 20%, not on it\'s worst day!

It's the same her Robert. I got most of my second cutting done in between rain. I've got a couple third cutting fields ready to go but it's so dang humid now that I'm going to need four or five days of good weather to cut, dry, and bale it. That just isn't happening. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

To20Chris · Jul 20, 2004

Re: Hydro power loss? 20%, not on it\'s worst day!

Of course the energy is not "lost" - it turns into heat, which is of little use when operating a tractor. From the point of view of a tractor, the energy is in fact lost as useful mechanical energy. The mechanical energy that doesn't make it to the drive wheels in a gear tractor also becomes heat.

I think this test is too old and the tractors not similar enough to be really meaningful. You need otherwise identical tractors - same engine, chassis, final drive, tires, etc. There are several CUTs that would be good candidates for such a test. Also, a steady-state load pull may yield different results than a pull from a stop - in the latter the "infinitely variable" gearing of an HST may be an advantage. Stick it on a chassis dyno and see what come out.

I do think that a standardized drawbar HP rating would be good to have, but most don't list this spec for CUTs. It is at least as important as PTO HP anyway.

But really, there is no need for people to get all worked up about it. Once you understand how they work, and depending on what you want to do with it, the best choice will either be obvious or it will not matter. For those whose tasks fall into the region where the two systems are both reasonably good choices, then it becomes a matter of preference. It's the same thing with the light/heavy weight issue - understand the difference and pick the one that suits your needs best.

Then make sure you jump all over anyone who picks something else! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Robert_in_NY · Jul 20, 2004

Re: Hydro power loss? 20%, not on it\'s worst day!

I am still trying to get first cutting off 70 acres for a customer. I cut 60 acres for the inlaws dairy and have 10 more on the ground to be round baled and sold to a grape farmer for cover in his grapes so that doesn't matter much if it gets rained on. I can't get the weatherman to co-operate with me to get any qood squares done. Of course I am still having fun though. Take care.