Injector Pump failure

[RickB]

Not for nothing but my warranty clearly states fuel systems are not included in Kioti's warranty among other things. I believe this is a judgment call by Kioti whether to warranty or not.

Here is some reading that should be required for anyone interested in this topic.
Let's cut through the garbage and stick to the facts:
http://www.epa.gov/oms/cert/hd-cert/stds-eng.pdf

There is a certain amount of subjectivity in warranty claims, but the most flexibility is in the dealer's hands relative to how a claim is presented and submitted to the manufacturer.


Edit:
I have located John Deere's explanation of the emissions warranty as it relates to offroad compression ignition engines. This info applies to Kioti and everyone else in this market in North America.
All fuel system components are covered for 5 years or 3000 hours. This applies to all off road diesels built after 1998 and greater than 37kW output and those 1999 and newer with 19-37kW in output.
http://www.deere.com/en_US/docs/warranty_pdf/power_systems/EPA_nonroad_emissions_ci_warranty.pdf

 

[Coyote machine]

Here's one possible explanation for why hard parts could be getting damaged by lack of lubricity in the fuel. Lubricity by its name and definition implies things are getting lubricated in ways that fuel with diminished lubricity is not. Therefore logic would seem to follow this path: less than needed lubrication, parts stick/ don't slide well, could result in parts sticking then releasing at greater speed/force than normal, resulting in damage to parts in question. Pumps with adequate lubricity present might fare better.

For the record, one of Kioti's top guys at Corporate Headquarters told me in a phone conversation we were having about TBN, the internet, and various problems like injectors, pumps, fuels, etc., that NO injection pumps have contained plastic gears, period. He said this is one of the things they dislike about internet forums- incorrect information that gets spread as if it were fact.

 

[Deerherd]

Not for nothing but my warranty clearly states fuel systems are not included in Kioti's warranty among other things. I believe this is a judgment call by Kioti whether to warranty or not.

Not for nothing but you should read your warranty again. It IS covered under part one of the general warranty for two years. In part two of the engine drive train extended warranty (years 2-4) it is listed as an exception.

See the warranty here: http://www.kiotitractor.com/img/parts/KIOTI_Warranty_Eng_05072012.pdf

 

[PoorPlowboy]

For Tony: Perhaps you can help us understand how/why fuel quality is a factor here. These IP failures (and several are currently under discussion) involve teeth on the rack and gears on the bottom-side of the IP which is lubricated by engine oil. Only the plunger and cylinder are lubricated by fuel and any significant wear to those parts would degrade performance and/or leak Diesel into the crankcase. I am not opposed to Diesel fuel additives (personally use them in all my Diesel engines) but I don't see how fuel additives are relevant to these IP gear/rack failures. Also, from the little research I've done, BioDiesel is alleged to have superior lubricating properties to any additive although I can't say how it might effect polymers like tanks and hoses. Any insight appreciated.

If there are sticky deposits accumulating in the wet fuel side of the IP, wouldn't this put higher than expected stress on the rack and gears?

 

[sherrym]

If there are sticky deposits accumulating in the wet fuel side of the IP, wouldn't this put higher than expected stress on the rack and gears?

I would agree if it were not for my using the same fuel in two other tractors that have a lot more than 500 hrs( when my kioti IP broke) on them. I have to conclude from my situation that it is bad parts(gears), and that kioti is very much aware that this is a problem, but if you are out of warranty and you do not have a dealer that will help you than be prepared to spend a lot of money on the part and alot of money on transportation and labor. Thanks to this forum my husband and I were able to remove and install the part to save on that cost.

 

[stealthf8r]

I would agree if it were not for my using the same fuel in two other tractors that have a lot more than 500 hrs( when my kioti IP broke) on them. I have to conclude from my situation that it is bad parts(gears), and that kioti is very much aware that this is a problem, but if you are out of warranty and you do not have a dealer that will help you than be prepared to spend a lot of money on the part and alot of money on transportation and labor. Thanks to this forum my husband and I were able to remove and install the part to save on that cost.

I could not imagine having to pay out of pocket :ashamed:

 

[Coyote machine]

I would agree if it were not for my using the same fuel in two other tractors that have a lot more than 500 hrs( when my kioti IP broke) on them. I have to conclude from my situation that it is bad parts(gears), and that kioti is very much aware that this is a problem, but if you are out of warranty and you do not have a dealer that will help you than be prepared to spend a lot of money on the part and alot of money on transportation and labor. Thanks to this forum my husband and I were able to remove and install the part to save on that cost.

From all the discussion on this and other threads about Kioti IPs it seems that the pump in question is found on various brands across the tractor market. I am not aware if Kioti has the pump for their application tweaked to a particular use of specific parts that might differ from what is used on another brand tractor, for instance Kubota or something similar. But there seems to be no question that if the internal rack does not seize either full open or closed that the other issue is the gears jamming, stripping teeth and rendering the pump dead, since no rebuild parts are available to the aftermarket pump rebuilders. Freeing up a stuck rack is sometimes possible and may last as long or short as a roll of the dice, but its still better than the expense of a brand new IP at today's retail market prices.
I am a believer that fuel that might run with no problem on a couple of your tractors MIGHT not get the job done WITHOUT additives for your Kioti. If it were me I might be inclined to tweak the mixture for at least your Kioti by adding a proven lubricity enhancer, just for peace of mind, and the off chance that the close, or too close tolerances of the Kioti's IP might benefit from added lubricity, and you might not encounter the same problem sometime down the road; which I'm certain you want to avoid at any reasonable effort/minimal cost. Just my 2 cents.