JD 4400 Tractor won't start

[doc2460]

Beenthere and K7LN,

Does the tech manual have physical descriptions of the various relay and switches? And does it describe how to pull the instrument panel to get at them? At this point, I'm limited to physically tracing the wiring to find and test the various relay and switches.

Also, the schematics that you all provided does seem to match what I'm seeing. For example, the ignition switch has three red, one green and one white wire. The schematic doesn't show the white wire.

I really appreciate everyone's help...kept me from pulling the starter and taking it in.

 

[beenthere]

doc
There is a relay test procedure, and I suspect it applies to the relays in the fuse and relay load center. The relay is K2 that is the starter relay.

 

[dcyrilc]

I don't have any manual. I'm just going by what was posted earlier. Rather than test the relay, just swap it out with another one or use the spares in K10 & K11 if you have them. I think they will all be the same.

You might want to try and place a jumper from F5 straight to the solenoid. If things work then, you've narrowed the problem area down to the switches and connections in that part of the circuit. You can also pull K2 and place a jumper between pins 30 & 87. That will take K2 and the rest of the circuit out of the picture.

As to the white wire, it's not shown because it belongs to an unrelated circuit.

Not to try to confuse things, but a bad ground on relay K2 would also stop it from cranking.

 

[dcyrilc]

That's true, you can never dismiss ground problems. What makes it hard is that you don't know what the guy on the other hand has for experience and tools. Furthermore, the schematic makes it look easy, but where the parts are actually located is a different story.

Trust me, I know. I'm doing the same thing on a JD2240 and the manual that came with it was the wrong one. Totally different wiring schematic from what the tractor has for wiring. Buying a new manual's out of the budget right now so I'm in the same boat that he is, other that I'm an electrician by trade for thirty years and did electronics in the Marine Corps and now work as a traffic Signal technition. Lots of practice troubleshooting electrical circuits.

 

[RavensRoost]

I am not familiar enough with other tractors to know if the 4400 is similar to my JD 4500 or not. On my 4500, the PTO is activated with a dash pullout switch and every once in awhile I have to TURN the knob slightly in order to get interlock continuity for it to crank. (You can tell when you turn the key to ON and do not hear the fuel solenoid click.)

Obviously, the PTO switch on mine has a problem, but I choose to ignore it for now as I know what it wants: turn a bit while it is only a push/pull activated switch to get interlock continuity.

If you have a pull out PTO switch, try turning the knob a bit CW and/or CCW.

 

[beenthere]

I am not familiar enough with other tractors to know if the 4400 is similar to my JD 4500 or not. ..........

The 4200, 4300, and 4400 are on the same size frame. The 4500 -4700 are on a larger size frame. Other than that, there are similarities (beyond the green paint ), but not the same layout.

Here's hoping doc finds his 4400 starting problem.

 

[doc2460]

Hey guys,

Thanks again for the input. Not having a lot of luck due to inability to find the physical location of the F5 fuse and the PTO and transmission neutral switches on the wiring schematics. Tested the K2 relay which tested fine.

Probably have to get it trailered in to the local JD shop.

 

[dcyrilc]

Hey guys,

Thanks again for the input. Not having a lot of luck due to inability to find the physical location of the F5 fuse and the PTO and transmission neutral switches on the wiring schematics. Tested the K2 relay which tested fine.

Probably have to get it trailered in to the local JD shop.

Try making a jumper wire from pin 5 on the start switch to pin 86 on K2 start relay. This will bypass the safety switches and test the fuse when trying to start it. If it starts, the problem is in one of the safety switches...if not, it's the fuse.

Scratch that...that would test fuse F1.

I'm sure someone can tell you where those parts are.

 

[RavensRoost]

Hey guys,

Thanks again for the input. Not having a lot of luck due to inability to find the physical location of the F5 fuse and the PTO and transmission neutral switches on the wiring schematics. Tested the K2 relay which tested fine.

Probably have to get it trailered in to the local JD shop.

Doc, did you try turning the PTO knob a bit, assuming yous has one?

 

[doc2460]

Arrgh...JD can't get to it for two weeks and I've already lost the 5yr old boy in the tall grass.

Anyone have any information on where to physically locate the F5 fuse, the rear PTO switch, and the neutral transmission switch?

Thanks again everyone.

 

[doc2460]

Ravensroost,

I have a PTO lever on the right side of the seat. I've pulled, pushed, jiggled, cussed and it still won't start.

 

[beenthere]

Here is the wiring bundle for location of neutral tran switch.
The F5 fuse is with the other fuses on the fuse and relay board (previous pic posted). When I find the PTO sw, I'll post

 

[beenthere]

Here is the main wire bundle showing the rear PTO switch relative to the park brake switch.

 

[beenthere]

Here is an image showing the neutral switch (46) bolted to the speed control lever (why?, I don't know).

 

[beenthere]

One more, as this shows that speed control lever and the likelihood that the neutral switch is attached to this (although it is not shown in the diagram). Maybe a visual inspection of this (if possible) will be a clue to a "no start" if the pedals are not in neutral position. Guess one could turn on the key and work the forward and reverse pedals to see if a neutral position can be found. But that sounds to easy.

 

[dfkrug]

I have a PTO lever on the right side of the seat. I've pulled, pushed, jiggled, cussed and it still won't start.

The PTO mechanism is a huge problem with these tractors. The switch is
on the central gearcase on the upper left side. You need to get in there
and put a jumper on the connector, after pulling it off.

As for the neutral switch, if that is causing a problem, then you need to
put a jumper on the "X2" connector under the left side of the floor board,
as shown in BEENTHERE's diagram.

I have permanently jumpered both of mine.

 

[beenthere]

And...another pic showing the actual neutral control switch. Seems getting at it might mean splitting the tractor.... But maybe not.

Still looking for the PTO rear switch, and am thinking it is on the right side of the tranny, just under the forward/reverse pedals. But no pic to confirm that yet.

 

[Long0]

If you have a hydro tractor, verify your pedels are not activated - Meaning both are in the stop position.

Andy

 

[doc2460]

Hey all,

Just an update. JD was able to get to my tractor sooner than thought. Turned out to be the rear PTO switch. Mechanic said it was a bear to get to...had to pull one of the rear tires and the fender to get to it.

Anyway, it's up and running now. I appreciate everyone's help.

 

[dcyrilc]

Hey all,

Just an update. JD was able to get to my tractor sooner than thought. Turned out to be the rear PTO switch. Mechanic said it was a bear to get to...had to pull one of the rear tires and the fender to get to it.

Anyway, it's up and running now. I appreciate everyone's help.

Glad to hear it's running again.:thumbsup: