JD4520 and CCM toplink - Have questions

[eepete]

I see what you mean. The nut closest to the box is fixed, the nut that is on the pipe from the banjo bolts is what I loosen, right? Know it should be obvious, easier to ask, less surprises.

Speaking of surprises, I got a big one when I flipped the valve assembly 180. In my failed attempt to purge the cylinder of it's oil, I left the whole thing under a lot of pressure. Fortunately, I remember reading on this site that when working with hydraulics you should have your gloves on- no exposed skin. I've always worn gloves when working quick connects and put them on to work on the cylinder. So when I cracked the nut, there was a high power wire-sized stream of fluid. It missed my finger by just a bit, but the glove would have protected me (I hope). So now that I know that this thing can pack some power, I'm a little skittish. When I rotate the valve, I'll work the control level but there could still be some fluid under pressure in there due to the very nature of the valve.

Thanks for the reply.
Pete

 

[kennyd]

I see what you mean. The nut closest to the box is fixed, the nut that is on the pipe from the banjo bolts is what I loosen, right? Know it should be obvious, easier to ask, less surprises.

Yes, that is correct.

Speaking of surprises, I got a big one when I flipped the valve assembly 180. In my failed attempt to purge the cylinder of it's oil, I left the whole thing under a lot of pressure. Fortunately, I remember reading on this site that when working with hydraulics you should have your gloves on- no exposed skin. I've always worn gloves when working quick connects and put them on to work on the cylinder. So when I cracked the nut, there was a high power wire-sized stream of fluid. It missed my finger by just a bit, but the glove would have protected me (I hope). So now that I know that this thing can pack some power, I'm a little skittish. When I rotate the valve, I'll work the control level but there could still be some fluid under pressure in there due to the very nature of the valve.

Yes, do be careful. Fluid injection is very possible when working with high pressure systems like hydraulics-gangrene and/or amputation usually follows shortly thereafter.

Google "hydraulic fluid injection" if you want to see some scary/morbid photos.

I do not want to scare you-I just want you to be aware.

 

[eepete]

I'm delighted to report that on these matters of safety, you're preaching to the choir. I also do the volunteer fire/medical stuff and have seen enough to slow down and take precautions.

I saw your project for under the cabinet LED lights. I made a LED light board and did that for a room. 27 boards with two 1-watt LEDs per board. Boards also had the smaller white and color LEDs on it like the ones in your project. Good stuff.

Pete

 

[jenkinsph]

Pete,
To get the hoses right you may need to consider some swivel fittings or angle fittings that are available at most NAPA stores, hydraulic shops or dealer. You simply need the right combination of fittings to allow the hoses to route to the couplers without hitting or chafing anything.
QUOTE]


Hey I tried to tell ya

Just to get a handle on all of this, if you look just below the washer fluid tank there is a deep cavity where hoses can be run out of the way of anything.
When I ran the new hoses for the topntilt I removed the existing hard lines that go to the loader connections and filed them in the rafters minus the couplers, if one day I decide I want a loader on this tractor I can put them back. This allowed me to run the hoses from the valve with 90 degree connectors back and up over the rearaxle housing in the cavity or space. The couplers for the four hoses all nest in this space too out of the way of everything. Typically I can't see much reason for unplugging these connections but they are there and available. This frees up the third remote with mounted couplers for other uses.

Using the joystick to control the hitch then is intuitive, move joystick left tilts the hitch to the left, pull back on the joystick extends top link tilting implement back.

I am rehashing this because the space I am referring to is in the middle area and is easier to plumb your lines too than what you are doing now. If you go back to the picture I posted you will see the upper hoses are coming from the boxblade scarifier bar. If I were using the I Match and a simple implement there would be nothing plugged in to the third remote.

 

[eepete]

"Hey I tried to tell ya"

I can tell you enjoy a good "I told you so" as much as I do. Some of my resistance here is I want to see if adding something will really be worth it, some of it is it's easier to spend $1K in little $250 chunks rather than all at once.

The joystick would be a very intuitive way to do a top and tilt. Between your pictures and explanation, I understand what you did. So what are your comments on this approach (he said risking another "I told you so" moment):

Make 4 lines that run from the existing loader QCs to the rear of the tractor and mount a plate with the female QCs for the TnT stuff. Seems like your approach is the cheapest, this approach is more money but you take nothing apart, and the most expensive is the JD diverter and new set of connects with the win that most of the hydraulic lines are metal not hoses.
Part of what has me considering the middle approach is the fact that I'm seeing a regrettable trend: Every time I think "I'll never do that" I want to do it. So keeping the front QCs intact has some appeal. I also know I'm a bit squeamish about taking off the metal lines and all.

I've sent an email to the dealer so he can price out my iMatch and 2 more sets of bushings. I also told him to order me a new label for the 3rd SCV. This might be new thread material, and if so let me know and I'll start one, but it's not clear to me how the MX6 mower connects to the iMatch with it's funny swinging toplink connection point.

Pete

 

[jenkinsph]

Pete,
First let me say that the 110 tlb has the diverter with triple remotes each end. The 110 also has the aux circuits on the loader as well as the backhoe, and that setup was kind of pricey. Necessary if you need the loader, backhoe and top and tilt functionality for the large boxblade. Now with a 110 with all the lines in place I also have a belly pan to protect the underside of the tractor.

As I have mentioned before my reason for buying the 4520 was to have a dedicated tractor for three point work, with out a loader in the way. With this in mind having three hydraulic circuits on the rear was all I want. I thought about making up hose extentions and could have plugged into the existing mid loader couplers but then I would have to deal with these long hoses beneath a tractor without a belly pan. I knew that the hoses are tough enough to pull and twist the hard lines around if they got snagged on something, then I would have a real mess on my hands. A little pondering and it made much more sense to remove the existing hard lines to the mid couplers before they were damaged and store them away.

To accomplish the switch from mid to rear I removed the hard lines and took one of them with me to get the hoses made so the hose maker would know what type threads were needed. I had all four of the hoses made to a 48" length, this worked out perfect. The valve end of the hoses have 90 degree turns on them and the coupler ends have straight fittings. All of the hoses were installed with the hoses pointing to the rear coming off the valve. These hoses are routed up and in front of the rockshaft out of the way of the moving hitch parts on the rear of the tractor, crossing over to the opposite side of the tractor where they are shown with the couplers bundled. Orignally I had intended to make a new plate to fasten all six couplers in place as I have on the 110, but realized that these four lines running the top and tilt would remain in place regardless of the use for the tractor. The third remote is the only set that needs to be easily accessible for routine use and is installed with couplers and plate as provided. To clarify though all of the couplers are easy to reach in case you want to remove the cylinders for some reason.

In reality this is a simple job, remove the four hardlines and replace with four hoses, reinstall the couplers. Since the hardlines have swivels on the valve end it was an easy change over. Here are some pics I just took for you to see better, we have rain snow and mud here right now, when the weather clears I will get you a picture from beneath the tractor.

 

[jenkinsph]

With time indoors on my hands in this cra**y weather, I did verify that the front hardlines would require replacement if you decide to upgrade to the diverter setup. When you change to the diverter hookup it changes almost all of the lines. If you look at the parts diagrams you will see the diverter valve lines are completely different from what you have now with standard joystick.

I think to decide you would have to consider whether or not you think you will want to add a loader, I know that I don't want one on my tractor. If I find I need to purchase another loader it will be either a large skidsteer or preferably an articulated wheel loader as a separate machine altogether.

If you know you will add a loader to the 4520 then you have either the choice of leaving what you have in place now or forking up the cash for the diverter setup (make sure the price of all the new lines are included in the price) if you want top n tilt and third remote.

In my case with the tlb to handle the loader work the $120 bucks for the hoses I needed was a cheap and viable solution. If I need to sell the 4520 at a later date I can easily put the hardlines back as factory in an hour.

 

[eepete]

That's a lot to think about. As always, the hard part is figuring out what you want to do now and in the future so you don't waste resources. If the B21 TLB died, I'd get a loader for the 4520 and contract out backhoe work since most of my digging (after the current two projects are done) is over with at the new house. The $6-8K for a backhoe buys a lot of time at $120 per hour, and I only have to pay for the dig not the cover and clean up. It will buy 6 full days and 10 half days (with transport charge). So your approach looks pretty tempting, since getting the loader would be a big step precipitated by some calamity. My use of the 4520 will be all 3PH stuff since other tractors can do loader, front blade, and snow removal. I'll also have to think about the under tractor protection. The B21 has wonderful belly protection. In theory, I'll not take the 4520 into unknown areas where stuff can poke up in. But we all know it's a practical world.

Something I can't quite tell from your pictures is if you have the quick connects mounted on a plate from the lines you ran to the valve at the rear of the tractor, or are they in free space like big hydraulic extenuation cords?

It's sunny and warm today, rain on the way, and I've got to get one more trench to dig with conduit so I can have it inspected Monday, hopefully before the rain. Two big projects in the works and we have one of the wettest Novembers on record. I'll be tilting the box blade for the 1st time today, so I'll give this decision a little seat time to mull it over. Tonight I'll fire up a new thread about the MX6 on the iMatch in case others have the question. That makes the search function more useful for others.

As always, tnx for the input.

Pete

 

[jenkinsph]

Pete,
Reread the third paragraph, I describe the hoses running in front (or towards the middle of the tractor) of the rockshaft. There is a large space there and the four couplers are bundled. When I get a chance I will wrap these in canvas whether it is needed or not. Once plugged in I see no reason to unplug them unless you need to repair a cylinder or hose.

MX6 and IMatch,
My dealer gave me a set of the lower link pins for the I Match and a top bushing to use for the top link. The swivel joint is left alone, the joint directly above it gets the bushing to bring it up to I Match specs which requires the 1 1/4" diameter. My MX6 is out at the ranch and I am in town, sorry I can not get you a picture today.


With 54 acres and several ponds your backhoe work will never be finished, just my thoughts.