Kioti DK4210 FEL won't lift and curl or drop and dump at same time

[Phantese]

Hi,
I have the new model Kioti and am frustrated with the operation of the FEL, it will lift or drop fine (well it's slow) but I can't get it to curl or dump while lifting or dumping very well. These functions are at 10, 2, 5, and 7 oclock on the loader handle. BTW I had a Kubota B2610 and it worked like a charm but maybe it's because this is a larger tractor with more lifting ability but the dual function we all like when using the loader is awful on this one - the dealer says it's the way it is and adjustments to the speed or curl/dump can't be made. Any thoughts?

 

[rhunt]

Sounds like not enough RPM's. Bob

 

[art]

I didn't know all tractors came with the convenient to use valves that kubota uses. That is a premium feature that gets used daily but many manufacturers only use the cheaper valves that won't work four way. It is always better to find it going the other way!

 

[Ortimber]

While I have no experience with Kioti, I suspect what you are experiencing is normal operation. If you run a Kubota loader for any length of time, you will be disappointed with most other compact loader valves. John Deere CUTS/SCUTS have almost no “sweet spot” for getting two loader functions to operate simultaneously either.

 

[N2DFire]

The overall speed that the loader operates will vary with engine RPM (and thus Hydraulic pump output)

The sweet spots for getting 2 functions at once is very small and the farther you move the stick the smaller they get.

More expensive valves (like those on larger tractors, construction equipment, etc) use a piloted valve that allows a portion of the incoming flow to be directly routed downstream even when the valve is open/operating thus leaving flow for the next valve / function. Most SCUT/CUT hydraulic systems use a simple valve that dumps all the available fluid into the open/operating function. In order to have any leftover flow for the next valve you need (1) High RPM / high system flow and (2) a very light touch to only partially open the valve.

And FWIW - this get's magnified even more once you add a 3rd function valve for ..say a grapple. Can't open/close and curl/dump at the same time but you get used to it.

When we bought our CK35 - I was expecting construction grade performance but after running it a while either I have adjusted and don't notice it or don't really need 2 functions at once as much as I thought. Your needs may be different.

 

[RNeumann]

I learn something new everyday! Thx for posting. It makes sense that valves are better but I didn’t know why......

 

[oldnslo]

Kubota also used a series parallel style valve on some of their models of tractor. This style of valve takes the oil returning from the lift / lower circuit and directs it to the curl / dump circuit which makes performing both functions easier. Not sure if any other CUT manufacturer uses this style of valve.

 

[Sheldon Hamblin]

I don't understand that. I realize I have a much smaller machine, ck2610hst, but mine is super fast. It slows down a little in the 10-2-4-7 positions but is still much faster than my old Deere 850 2 stick loader.
I would call a different dealer to see if what your dealer is telling you is true.

 

[Phantese]

I don't understand that. I realize I have a much smaller machine, ck2610hst, but mine is super fast. It slows down a little in the 10-2-4-7 positions but is still much faster than my old Deere 850 2 stick loader.
I would call a different dealer to see if what your dealer is telling you is true.

Some tractors of the same model use different loaders I had a CK4010SE with KL4020 loader that was real slow, when I bought the tractor (cab model) I had them put on a KL4030 loader that was supper fast. Maybe twice as fast but the machine was the same, I can't imagine why anyone would want the KL 4020 on a Kioti cab when the Kl4030 is available. This being said, I now have a better understanding that the Loader valve on the CK's and the DK 10SS Series is an economy valve. Ortimber hit the nail right on the head - Kubota spoiled me, now who nows where I can find a loader valve thats similar to the one Kubota uses hmmm...

 

[Phantese]

The overall speed that the loader operates will vary with engine RPM (and thus Hydraulic pump output)

The sweet spots for getting 2 functions at once is very small and the farther you move the stick the smaller they get.

More expensive valves (like those on larger tractors, construction equipment, etc) use a piloted valve that allows a portion of the incoming flow to be directly routed downstream even when the valve is open/operating thus leaving flow for the next valve / function. Most SCUT/CUT hydraulic systems use a simple valve that dumps all the available fluid into the open/operating function. In order to have any leftover flow for the next valve you need (1) High RPM / high system flow and (2) a very light touch to only partially open the valve.

And FWIW - this get's magnified even more once you add a 3rd function valve for ..say a grapple. Can't open/close and curl/dump at the same time but you get used to it.

When we bought our CK35 - I was expecting construction grade performance but after running it a while either I have adjusted and don't notice it or don't really need 2 functions at once as much as I thought. Your needs may be different.

Excellent explanation, thanks