Large Rocks?

Darins · Mar 26, 2001

I have a problem? This weekend I had some Septic problems(big) . But we won't go there anyway I had a trackhoe there and I asked him to get some of these big rocks out of this hole so I can use them for landscaping. Well they are a little bigger then I thought. Now he is gone I need to move them. I did move some of them but it dented the top of my loader. And being that it only has 15hrs on it I didn't like that! It did move them alright but is there a easyier way to move them? Should I get a strap or Strapes and try to pull them? Or is that too dangerous if they slip off. Any help would be great. Thanks Darin

Bird · Mar 26, 2001

Should I get a strap or Strapes and try to pull them? Or is that too dangerous if they slip off.

In my opinion, yes. I'm not sure just what you did to dent the top of your loader, but the only way I've moved things too big and heavy to pick up and carry in the front end loader is to use the loader to push and roll them from behind. I've moved big round bales of hay, big stumps, etc. with a B7100 by starting with the bucket low and pretty square with the object, and then push forward as I raised the bucket and just kept on doing that, stopping to back off and lower the bucket, and going again. Slow, but gets it done eventually.

Bird

Von · Mar 26, 2001

It all depends on how big the rocks are. I have pulled big rocks (3ft. in diameter) out of hedge rows with chains and then rolled them onto a stone boat with the loader to be moved. You can drag them with straps and chains if on flat ground, but it does a number on the yard. A stone boat on the other hand skims across the sod nicely.

RobS · Mar 26, 2001

Re: Large Rocks/Stone Boat

Von, I take it a stone boat is nothing like a concrete ship /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif Can you describe it a little for us, or perhaps a photo? Sounds like it could be a useful addition to my arsenal /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Bird · Mar 26, 2001

Re: Large Rocks/Stone Boat

Von's idea of a stone boat would work quite well. Of course, I'd never heard of a stone boat until I started frequenting this forum./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif Of course, we don't have any "stones" in Texas, but we do have a lot of rock./w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif And if you don't have a "stone boat" an old car hood works quite well./w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

Bird

WillingtonPizza · Mar 26, 2001

My cusin has a small yanmar tractor, he welded a piece of angle iron down to form a three sided triangle on the top of his bucket. He then welded a hook on this, it has made his bucket very strong, when I bought my tractor it already had the metal on top rolled to form a triangle, very strong and good for hooks because it spreads out the load over the width of the bucket. Good luck

Rich

TWINKLE_TOES · Mar 27, 2001

Darin,

I have used a couple of truck tire chains to wrap boulders and then drag them away.

Al

hayden · Mar 27, 2001

I like that idea! Nice way to keep the rock from slipping out from the chain.

Thomas · Mar 28, 2001

Maybe a old car hood could help,just roll the stone on the hood than drag them w/your tractor.

Thomas..NH /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

Boondox · Mar 28, 2001

Reminds me of the roadside rock our town highway department decided to remove one day. Seems they had broken many a snowplow wing by hitting that stone...and were getting tired of the repair bills. So they came out bright and early one summer morning with an excavator. Had to dig a huge hole, and for a while there it looked like it was part of the planet's core, rather than just a boulder. The guy was a real wizard with the excavator, and though he tipped over several times was able to right himself and get the rock onto the road.

But the rock was the size of a Mack truck, and the excavator was unable to move it any further. This was a problem because it was completely blocking our 8 foot wide dirt road. So they got a dozer from back in town and brought it up with all the confidence of men used to moving heavy things. The dozer hit the rock and stopped dead in its tracks. Hardly even scratched the granite.

So they loaded a dump truck with sand and came charging up the road to ram the boulder. The truck left part of its front end wrapped around the stone, and limped back down the hill.

So they rented the largest Cat bulldozer in the entire county. A huge behemoth that made the earth shake as it rumbled past. No luck. It didn't break, but neither did it budge. If only they could have gone around the boulder and come at it from uphill everything would have been fine, but the obstruction was perched halfway up a 22% slope, wedged between a steep embankment on one side and an historic stone wall on the other. The breezeway over my driveway was much too low for any large vehicle to pass beneath, so they had to attack from downhill. Bad news.

They finally brought in a demolition crew, drilled holes in the rock and blew it with dynamite. The boulder grudgingly split in half, and the huge dozer was able to pull them downhill as far as the turnaround where they became mired in sand and remain to this day. The town abandoned the turnaround, and the twin stones are now used only by snakes trying to get warm in our all too brief summer months.

Pete
www.gatewaytovermont.com

GrantMO · Mar 28, 2001

Boondox,
That's a good story, somehow I figured that explosives were going to come into play in the end. About 25 years ago the spring rains loosened a small house size boulder that slid down on a very heavily travelled road near here. They had to blast it too. At some point the rock is just too big for machinery. I wonder at what weight that is.

Roy · Mar 29, 2001

At some point the rock is just too big for machinery. I wonder at what weight that is.

At first, I thought that we could estimate. By getting some accounts of how large (what physical size) these unmovable rocks were, we could compute volume (assume a sphere). Using the average mass of various rock types, estimate the total weight, and therefore size (type dependent). But, alas, my own search for mass information was fruitless. The only information I could find was like that at the University of Michigan “Tunnelling: Mechanics and hazards” (http://www.umich.edu/~gs265/tunnel.htm), : … the descriptions of rock masses can be extremely complex, and are much more so than for soils. The reason for this is that, although rocks have a greater innate strength than a soil, their mechanical characteristics are dominated by the effect of anisotropy (the state of a characteristic of the rock being different in different directions) and the discontinuities contained within. These discontinuities may range from foliation in the rock , such
as the layering in a schist or the fissibility of a shale. The discontinuities may also take the form of fractures, ranging from the minuscule cracks to major faulting.
(Parker, 1996)

So, I guess the rule is, try to move it first, and if that fails, blow it up! /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Roy

Jag · Mar 29, 2001

Roy, from my engineering books, solid rock will vary, soft rock will run from just above 100 lbs/cf, sandstone 140-150 lbs/cf, granite 170-180 lbs/cf up a little over 200 lbs/cfs for certain very dense rocks... Most times just figure 150 times the volumn and you will be close.... For reference dry soil is normal 95 to 105 lbs, damp 105 to 125 lbs or so, concrete is normally 150 lbs/cf.

Edited by JAG on 03/29/01 06:16 PM (server time).

Roy · Mar 29, 2001

Jag; So, if we get some size observations from these guys, then we can make a weight guess-amate! I tried to find weight values, but only found (like the cited example) on why they would not give density! Good going!

OK… If someone can report the estimated physical dimensions of these unmovable objects, we should be able to estimate a weight range for those beasts.

Roy

GrantMO · Mar 29, 2001

Roy,
I'm guessing the rock was about 50X30X15 and and least partly limestone.

Roy · Mar 30, 2001

That's a house! So 50'x30'15' = 22,500 cuf * 150 lbs/cuf = 3,375,000 lbs!!!!

Can this actually be?

Roy

gerard · Mar 30, 2001

Whish I could find the picture in "Farm Show" magazine but a few issues ago they had a picture of a HUGE rock that they were pulling by using 2 huge D8 dozers and 5 big farm tractors, all daisy chained together. That had to be SOME chain!!

As an aside I pull small rocks that are too big to fit in my bucket using a chain with slip hook. I wouldn't use strap because I look at that as a big rubber band with a hook on the end and I don't want to be on the other end IF it breaks! Chain doesn't have as much elasticity if it breaks.

Roy · Mar 30, 2001

Remind me to never complain about my rocks! The largest ones I have dealt with were probably around .5 cubic feet (figuring 1'x 1'x 6"). They fit in the loader nicely, and only weigh 50 to 75 lbs (guessing 100 to 150 lbs per cubic foot).

Roy

Rick572 · Mar 30, 2001

Several years ago I had an opportunity to deal will several large rocks used in a landscape project. What we did was lift one end of the rock and then placed a couple pieces of steel pipe under the rock, then did the same with the other end. Once the rock is suspended on the pipes, about four of them, it offers only a fraction of the resistance as before. We lifted the end of the rock with a high-lift jack and a chain. Its kinda a two man operation. We pulled our rocks with a jeep very slowly and as the rock kicked out a piece of pipe we replaced it in front of the rock. One drawback, is that the ground must be fairly flat and if its as wet as it is here in TX it would require placing some boards down for the pipe to role on. Its slow, but with enough time and patience I believe almost any size rock can be moved and not damaged.

Rick