Lets talk car/truck/tractor batteries ??

[Fallon]

Lighter means less lead and less stored charge or energy in the same space.

Not really. surface area is what make for available amperage. A 1lbs cube of lead will have WAY less energy than a 1lb paper thin sheet. However if you sneeze on that paper thin sheet, it will tear. That is even worse when you consider a discharged battery converts the lead plates into weaker lead sulfate (and the acid becomes water) That's really the difference between RV batteries & car batteries. RV batteries are noticeably thicker & sturdier to survive when heavily discharged. Car batteries rarely get heavily discharged & aren't designed to survive when in their weaker heavily discharged state for extended periods of time.

 

[dickfoster]

Not really. surface area is what make for available amperage. A 1lbs cube of lead will have WAY less energy than a 1lb paper thin sheet. However if you sneeze on that paper thin sheet, it will tear. That is even worse when you consider a discharged battery converts the lead plates into weaker lead sulfate (and the acid becomes water) That's really the difference between RV batteries & car batteries. RV batteries are noticeably thicker & sturdier to survive when heavily discharged. Car batteries rarely get heavily discharged & aren't designed to survive when in their weaker heavily discharged state for extended periods of time.

Well that and how pure the lead is but I was speaking as a rule of thumb all else being equal. The AGM batteries I use have many thin plates which does increase the surface area and they are also made of of higher purity lead. Both taken together means they pack more charge into a given volume. However they are also heavier than a traditional battery of the same size. The weight comes from more lead in the same volume and since the plates don't have to support themselves as they do in a wet cell the plates can be made of pure lead instead of a lead alloy which also adds to the weight but it also makes it more chemically efficient.

I just swapped a group 35 wet cell for an AGM the same size. The AGM weighed about 50lbs while the wet cell weighed about 35. I didn't weigh them, that's from the specs. Since the AGM weighed 50 lbs I was sure glad it had a handle. Guess which one stores more energy.

 

[CADplans]

Since we are talking batteries,,,
I have noticed that some chargers come with a "de-sulfating" cycle,,,

Has anyone actually used one? It sounds like it should work,,, but,,, Hmmmmmmmm,,,,,,,,,,??

The CTEK is pretty heavily bragged on, the "CTEK (56-864) MUS",,, but, $85 is a lot of scratch to test an itch,,,,

Are there others like this??

 

[Sawyer Rob]

The more I read about those AGM's, the more I like them!

I'm tempted to try one out, but they will have to go some to beat the HD Interstates I've bought in the past when you consider the price difference...

SR

 

[coobie]

The more I read about those AGM's, the more I like them!

I'm tempted to try one out, but they will have to go some to beat the HD Interstates I've bought in the past when you consider the price difference...

SR

The last interstate batteries we bought for my ford truck & wifes car were JUNK after 3 years.Paid $167 bucks for the truck battery,had buyers remorse.LOL

 

[Fallon]

Since we are talking batteries,,,
I have noticed that some chargers come with a "de-sulfating" cycle,,,

Has anyone actually used one? It sounds like it should work,,, but,,, Hmmmmmmmm,,,,,,,,,,??

The CTEK is pretty heavily bragged on, the "CTEK (56-864) MUS",,, but, $85 is a lot of scratch to test an itch,,,,

Are there others like this??

It sounds like snake oil, but actually works. Lead sulfide crystals build up on the plates over time & insulate things, slowly choking the batteries. If you hit those crystals with the right resonance frequency, they will shatter.

It will help prolong the life of a battery a bit & freshen up an older battery that is loosing some capacity. It's not a miracle tool though & won't fix a dead or shorted cell or make a battery last a crazy long time.

You can make your own charger that will generate that frequency for about $10. I'm sure it's noticeably cheaper at scale. I picked up a charger a year or 2 ago for $80 if I remember. It will do up to 80@ output, wet cell, gell cell & AGM (different types need slightly different voltages for optimal charge) as well as desulfating & some testing. I'd flag it as a required feature when buying a new charger, but not sure if I'd recommend upgrading from a good working one just for that feature.

 

[dickfoster]

Since we are talking batteries,,,
I have noticed that some chargers come with a "de-sulfating" cycle,,,

Has anyone actually used one? It sounds like it should work,,, but,,, Hmmmmmmmm,,,,,,,,,,??

The CTEK is pretty heavily bragged on, the "CTEK (56-864) MUS",,, but, $85 is a lot of scratch to test an itch,,,,

Are there others like this??

I have and found that it works. I've recovered two abused batteries with mine. Neither would hold a charge before I desulfated them. It takes a long time though depending on how bad the battery is and if they aren't too far gone. Some batteries are so far gone they just can't be helped.
Yes there are others out there. Mine was cheap compared to the cost of the batteries I saved with it. Mine wasn't a CTEK but from what I understand they make good chargers.

If I ever buy another charger I'll buy an Odyssey because they are made for the Odyssey AGM type batteries that I use. So far I'm getting by with what I have, a small 4 amp desulfator, an old Sears charger and a power supply that puts out the required current to recharge an AGM from a deeply discharged state properly. It's not so automated though so I have to watch things. The Odyssey charger is a hook it up and forget it type of affair.

 

[dickfoster]

Funny thing, I just replaced an Interstate in my wifes car with an Odyssey AGM. They aren't the cheapest but you get what you pay for. As it was only two years old, I donated the Interstate to our mechanic. Once I had it charged up of course. I think the wife said the cost was something like 65 bucks more for a group 35.

 

[Fallon]

Check out The RV BATTERY CHARGING PUZZLE << HandyBob's Blog for some good info on charging batteries. He's a bit angry & ranty, not to mention being RV & solar focused, but the root information is pretty good & interesting. Well worth reading, he knows his stuff & isn't trying to sell you anything, if you want to go down the rabbit hole of properly charging batteries fully or solar charging stuff.

In short you need to use some higher voltage (14.5v range) to pump all the amps you can into the battery. However once the battery has taken a full charge, hitting it with higher voltage will just boil off the electrolyte. Smart chargers or careful timing are required to get a fully charged battery & not damage it. Most chargers undercharge the batteries.

 

[TemporaryKubotaOwnerMark]

Lighter means less lead and less stored charge or energy in the same space.

See the post above about thinner plates. When they cram more CCA into the same space, they do it at the expense of shock resistance. Fine on a machine that lives on pavement....