Liability....WHAT liability?

[jaotguy]

I also remove/remount my tires with one of these now.
I'm out in the sticks and waste 2 hours turn around IF the tire shop is not busy...

how do you balance them afterwards ? I've got an old hub and 2 knife edges ....

 

[Diamondpilot]

yup -- I ran in to this issue too. I am sick of the high prices to remount old tires or last year snow tires back on and balance. From this point on I do my own tire service. Got one of those harbor freight manual tire changer and its worth the price in gold . I cant tell you how many times I used it on my two hands. I dont leave it permanently mounted in my garage floor, all I have is two bolt metal anchors ready to use left in floor. 5 mins and I'm ready to use.
These days it pays to do things yourself anyways.

I have one also. Mounted to a piece of plywood it's portable and some weight like the front tire of a truck is just perfect in the boat yard.

Like others said it's 2 hours minimum for me to go to town and get one done. I take them later for balance. It for emergency repair only in my eyes, not a permanent fix.

Chris

 

[zzvyb6]

Here you go

http://www.ammonslaw.com/publications/danger-of-aging-tires

When I worked in GM Tire Engineering, the best ones I heard of was a guy who mounted 16" tires on 16-1/2" wheels and complained about smooth road shake. Also the kid who mounted 16-1/2" tires on 16" wheels and complained (via his mother) that the tires didn't hold air. Tire problems on GM cars are usually handled at the dealer level. Of course all the morons who think the OEM tires are nfg and buy Oscar Meyer Bulldog Mud Spitter Daytonas are a real danger to the rest of us. Its them who have the crashes, kill someone (or worse, turn their Grandma into a vegetable) and make the rest of us pay in so many ways.

 

[JDgreen227]

I offered to sign a waiver of liability should they install the new valve stem...but...no. Might be somewhat off topic here, but in my biased opinion, those cretins who are quick to file stupid lawsuits in the hope of getting easy money are EXACTLY the same type of people who want to collect public assistance when they are able to work, but are too lazy to, so they file for disability or give some other fabricated reason they cannot take a minimum wage job.

By the way, I think the hoopla about tires being unsafe after 6 years is pure crap. I ran the OEM Steeltex Firestones on my GMC for 13 years, owned a '93 Cutlass with OEM Michelins and at 19,000 miles that I had confidence in driving to Florida when the tires were 15 years old, and I have a buddy with a '78 Corvette Pace Car edition that STILL has the OEM tires, he went to Bowling Green with it last year. For what you have to pay for a new tire today, they should last a LOT longer than 6 years and there is NO reason the tire makers cannot manufacture them to last that long.

 

[Industrial Toys]

My Tire Dealer did not want to repair a tear in the sidewall of a relatively new front tire on my JD 6200. I insisted and told them I would not come back if the repair didn't work. Fifteen years or so later, the patch has held. They probably would not do that today. I am in business, and I know about doing thiings to save someone money and now it becomes your hassle, never mind the law suits and stuff. If you want my professional service, pay for it, if you don't please just go away!

In the 80s I took some old worn 70 series snow tires off a Police Car I bought. I put them on the very skinny OEM rims of my home made VW dune buggy. The Tire shop told me I was crazy! We cornered so hard in that thing, that dirt and grass was stuck in the bead, yet they never once failed!

I'm not so convinced that the experts always know the answer when it comes to unconventional matters.

 

[ultrarunner]

^^^ I have to agree with you.

If tire age was so important then why does the local National Guard Unit still drive it's trucks and trailers with tires from the Vietnam Era?

If anything, the government should set an example... right?

I have nylon tires on several of my old cars... and I bought these tires in the 70's... I expect them to be around long after I'm gone.

My Model A Roadster has Montgomery Wards Riverside from the 60's.

I've had two flats in my life and both times were new or only a couple of weeks old Michelin tires on the truck... both on the freeway. One was a roof gutter spike and the other a knife blade.

As to liability... I went skiing at Squaw a couple of years ago... use to ski all the time a long time ago.

Bought my life ticket and then was denied lift access because my equipment was too old... was told it was liability the Squaw couldn't let me on the life because of it... anyway, I got that straightened out in short order and had a great day skiing with my K2 Holidays and Kastinger boots.

All I did was ask the lift operator to repeat what he said while I recorded it.

 

[txdon]

Only half a mill?? Guess the lawyer got 50%. Thanks for the whole story. Wow.. $800 offer. Come on Micky D. We know you can do better than that.

The rest rest of the story:

The jurors awarded Liebeck $160,000 in compensatory damages and 2.7 million in punitive damages. The ammout was $2,735,000 more than Liebeck's lawsuit had requested.

(The 2.7 million is what the jurors determined was 2 days of coffee sales for McDonald's.)

However, the amount was later reduced to $500,000. I'm betting the lawyers got half of that.

So now the million $ is just a quarter of a million $.

 

[Diamondpilot]

The rest rest of the story:

The jurors awarded Liebeck $160,000 in compensatory damages and 2.7 million in punitive damages. The ammout was $2,735,000 more than Liebeck's lawsuit had requested.

(The 2.7 million is what the jurors determined was 2 days of coffee sales for McDonald's.)

However, the amount was later reduced to $500,000. I'm betting the lawyers got half of that.

So now the million $ is just a quarter of a million $.

Or about $160,000 after taxes.

Chris

 

[JDgreen227]

Just got a text from my ex, who got my '04 Lesabre in the divorce...she said the car still has the OEM Michelins and although over 10 years old, they have given her no problems. I really think all this hype about older tires being unsafe is just a ploy to get drivers to buy new ones.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Just got a text from my ex, who got my '04 Lesabre in the divorce...she said the car still has the OEM Michelins and although over 10 years old, they have given her no problems. I really think all this hype about older tires being unsafe is just a ploy to get drivers to buy new ones.

It's not hype. You two are not the norm. I am putting 20,000 miles a year on my vehicles and this is what all my friends and neighbors do. This means we are replacing tires every 2 to 3 years.

I have blown out better than a dozen older tires personally. Most on trailers but some on vehicles. Neither is any fun and down right dangerous at 70 mph. Since I have adapted a 5 year max policy on all my personal stuff and that I maintain not a single issue. The cost is more than worth my safety and inconvenience.

Chris

 

[dave1949]

This is from zzvyb6's link:
Michelin and Tire Shop Pay After Old Tire Causes Wreck

Michelin and Tire Shop Pay After Old Tire Causes Wreck

The Ammons Law Firm has successfully negotiated the settlement of a product liability case against Michelin and a tire shop on behalf of the surviving wife, children and parents of a Florida man who was killed when his van rolled over.

The rollover was caused by the tread separation failure of a BF Goodrich Radial T/A tire that was over ten years old when it was installed on the man's van by a local tire shop. The tire, manufactured by Michelin, had deteriorated and become brittle with age.

The lawsuit filed by Rob Ammons claimed the Radial T/A tire was manufactured using inadequate materials and processes and that it was designed without the features necessary to prevent a tread/belt separation. Ammons also claimed that despite knowing how age adversely affects a tire's components, Michelin did nothing to warn consumers that older tires are dangerous.

Allegations against the tire shop centered on its sale and installation of the deteriorated tire that was unsafe to place into service due to its age.

According to Ammons, "The appearance of a tire has little to do with how safe it is. The components inside a tire degrade over time, even if the tire is not being used. To prevent crashes caused by tire failures, tire companies need to make tires more durable and sellers need to remove old tires from their inventories."

Both Michelin and the tire shop required that the settlement amounts be kept confidential.

The Ammons Law Firm is located in Houston, Texas and practices personal injury law, including cases involving: tire defects, oil rig explosions, truck accidents, plant explosions, refinery accidents, wrongful death, post-collision fires, seat belt defects, seatback defects, air bag defects, SUV rollovers and workplace negligence.

 

[batwing]

Just got a text from my ex, who got my '04 Lesabre in the divorce...she said the car still has the OEM Michelins and although over 10 years old, they have given her no problems. I really think all this hype about older tires being unsafe is just a ploy to get drivers to buy new ones.

It seems tires south of the MI boarder do not last very well, My dads 1987 fifth wheel still has the original tires on it, every year before I pull it up to camp I check the tires for dry rot, cracks, weather checking and last fall were still looking good. Our utility trailer that has carried a lot of green oak are starting to look very bad, were on the trailer when dad bought the trailer in the early 70s. I know tires are not built the same as the good old days, but still feel most tire problems in MI are caused by improper care.
Ron

 

[Diamondpilot]

This is from zzvyb6's link:
Michelin and Tire Shop Pay After Old Tire Causes Wreck

Michelin and Tire Shop Pay After Old Tire Causes Wreck

The Ammons Law Firm has successfully negotiated the settlement of a product liability case against Michelin and a tire shop on behalf of the surviving wife, children and parents of a Florida man who was killed when his van rolled over.

The rollover was caused by the tread separation failure of a BF Goodrich Radial T/A tire that was over ten years old when it was installed on the man's van by a local tire shop. The tire, manufactured by Michelin, had deteriorated and become brittle with age.

The lawsuit filed by Rob Ammons claimed the Radial T/A tire was manufactured using inadequate materials and processes and that it was designed without the features necessary to prevent a tread/belt separation. Ammons also claimed that despite knowing how age adversely affects a tire's components, Michelin did nothing to warn consumers that older tires are dangerous.

Allegations against the tire shop centered on its sale and installation of the deteriorated tire that was unsafe to place into service due to its age.

According to Ammons, "The appearance of a tire has little to do with how safe it is. The components inside a tire degrade over time, even if the tire is not being used. To prevent crashes caused by tire failures, tire companies need to make tires more durable and sellers need to remove old tires from their inventories."

Both Michelin and the tire shop required that the settlement amounts be kept confidential.

The Ammons Law Firm is located in Houston, Texas and practices personal injury law, including cases involving: tire defects, oil rig explosions, truck accidents, plant explosions, refinery accidents, wrongful death, post-collision fires, seat belt defects, seatback defects, air bag defects, SUV rollovers and workplace negligence.

This brings up a good point. I probably buy a dozen sets of tires. Before they are ever mounted I check the manufactures date stamp on each tire. I will not accept a tire over 6 month's old.

Chris

 

[Industrial Toys]

What event ever brought on that mandatory TPS BS anyway?

 

[puckgrinder85]

Just got a text from my ex, who got my '04 Lesabre in the divorce...she said the car still has the OEM Michelins and although over 10 years old, they have given her no problems. I really think all this hype about older tires being unsafe is just a ploy to get drivers to buy new ones.

Not at all hype, just like belts and hoses, rubber is not an everlasting thing and tires flex a lot. I am a mechanic and tow truck operator after hours and I, by trade, see this very often. Old, dry rotted tires represent I'd guess about 30% of the failures I see. I've had a person come to our shop with an old "80s chevy van with 4 crappy dry rotted tires for a blown tire. Replaced the one and off he went, blew the second, the third and the fourth all in the following days. If you think its a fluke that's fine but at least take a look at your tires. Some do age better than others, but for cars that sit out in the sun all day and get baked day in and day out are the ones that will have troubles down the road.

Trailer tires also are meant to be replaced every 4 years or so, they just aren't made the same as vehicle tires.

 

[Industrial Toys]

I have in my kitchen a dish drying basket from 1964 in perfect shape. A NEW similar type construction shampoo and what/not holder in my shower lasted a year before the vinyl seperated from the metal and it began to rust.

You can't tell me that chemistry and technology hasn't improved in Fifty years? Consumers are just such total suckers to be sold the cheapest crap they can make it seems

 

[Diamondpilot]

What event ever brought on that mandatory TPS BS anyway?

The Firestone Ford Explorer debacle.

Chris

 

[Winmac]

You can't tell me that chemistry and technology hasn't improved in Fifty years?

Of course it has but the designers have control of how much of it goes into the product, if the design life of a tire is "x" years why would you spend the extra expense to make it last "y" years.

 

[ultrarunner]

Agreed... usage and climate are important factors.

I'm the first to admit I'm a careful driver... think it is related to my auto restoration hobby... been driving 40 years and never had a ticket.

I also live in a very mild climate... never freezes and no one around here has home air conditioning plus my vehicles are for the most part garaged.

My only new car is 14 years old and just made the 60k mark on the odometer...

Commute to work is 9 minutes and it's rare for me to drive 35 miles from home.

I do take the new 14 year old car a couple of times a year north to Washington State and I make sure my vehicle is road ready.

I have friends that live in Arizona and they tell me the heat just bakes the cars there... interiors, tires, etc.

My 91 Pickup and my 2002 BMW look like new.

Only point is some common sense has to apply and I grew up around the family car business...

I do think mentioning the local National Guard using tires dating from Vietnam makes a valid counterpoint.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Speed and heat are what ruin modern radial tires. Comparing nylon and bias tires that never see 50 mph is like comparing tin foil and a 12" steel I - Beam and saying they are both metal.

Chris