lining the fireplace chimney

[heehaw]

has anyone had the stainless lining installed in their fireplace chimney, and hooked to an insert? many years ago, my folks just installed an insert, and let the smoke make it up the chimney the best way it could, i don't think that is safe, i "think" it should have the flue extended up into the chimney?
this would be an easy job if it weren't for the damper. do they cut the damper out when the lining is installed?
heehaw

 

[psuedofarmer]

i run my wood stove through the field stone fireplace that sits on the outside of the house (not an internal chimney). in the beginning, i ran the stove off a stainless insert that ran from the back of the stove to the masonry lining of the chimney.

until i had a chimney fire.

i now run a dedicated stainless pipe from my wood stove, through the masonry stack. it was expensive, but definitely safer.

there are a number of problems with running the insert through the fireplace chimney:

- is the chimney external (read that: is on the outside of the house, or in the center of the house). an external chimney will be colder than an internal masonry stack; as a result, you'll get more creosote buildup because the temp of the stack is colder.

- an external stack is warm on the bottom, cold on top - this increases creosote buildup even if you're burning dry/seasoned wood and running a hot fire.

- in my application, i run the stove attached directly to a stainless T-pipe, then connect the T pipe directly to the stainless (metalbestos) liner. i REMOVED THE DAMPER.

hope this helps.. i burn 5-7 cords/year and have had no problems since installing the liner.

good luck.

pf

 

[gav64]

when i installed my insert earlier this year i installed a 6" ss liner since my stack was about 8x10. I bought a kit from the place I bought my insert, it came with 25 ft liner, cap and other fittings. I was about $500, well worth it rather than trying to piece all the stuff together. I had to remove the damper and unfortunately due to the angle I had to cut the damper frame (i used a 4.5" grinder). It took about 4 hours, it was my first time, including installing the insert (jutol). glenn...

 

[heehaw]

thats what i am wanting to do, where you able to run the pipe without cutting any on the firebox? i know its dangerous the way it is, and it hasn't been used in 8-10 years because of that: but am considering trying to make it safe and using it occasionally. did you have to transition the pipe from round to rectangular the back to round, to get it past the damper/smoke shelf area?
heehaw

 

[arthr31]

hi there,

you should find out what diameter flu size is ideal for your insert. Then, get a damper plate to replace the flue damper, and a stainless steel liner the diameter that your stove requires. This is what I did. The insert runs much better because the size of the ss flue is the correct size for the stove, and it runs cleaner... With too large a flue, the stove will allow smoke back down into the house and won't draft the fire properly resulting in a weak flame... good luck, put safety first on things like this!! -art

 

[JimR]

The stove setup I had in my house fireplace from 1978-1995 was run through a plate that covered the fireplace opening and sealed up. The stove pipe went up through the damper 6". I never extended any pipes beyond the damper and always ran a real hot fire once a day. I never had any problems with that setup. My chimney is external. I never had any chimney fires nor did I have any problems with creosote buildup in my chimney. The pipes were removed once a year to empty whatever ash laid in the bottom of the pipe and to clean whatever ash fell down into the base of the fireplace. My chimney flue liner never had any buildup on it. One note to mention is that I always burned seasoned dry wood in my woodstoves. The reason I don't burn wood at my house right now is that I fifnished off this room and my large stove would overheat that room in minutes. I am trying to find a way to get my house heated with wood again cheaply.

The wood stove I have at the old farm is sitting in the big old fireplace opening. This house has an internal chimney with a new liner. I took the damper out and cut a 1/4" steel plate to fit the damper opening. I then cut a rectangle out of that piece to adapt my 6" round pipe to fit an adapter to the new damper plate I made. There is no pipe extending above this plate. So far the stove and chimney have been running great. I burn one hot fire a day in the morning at 500-600 degrees for 20-30 minutes. The rest of the time the stove runs at 300 +- degrees. I've had no problem with chimney fires and I won't know until spring if there is any creosote buildup in this chimney. The fire never goes out in this stove. It has been running continuosly since the beginning of November.

 

[Mosby]

HeeHaw,
We had a relining dealership as part of our contracting business at one time. There was a time that we were doing over 100 per year. We did cast in place and some stainless. The majority of what we did was due to there already being a problem (chimney fire). We did fire and water restoration, so we had this as part of our services. I am taking the time to say this because there have been few things I have seen that will get so many different opinions.
There are so many variables that have to be considered when looking at what is best that I cannot begin to list all of them. I will offer this:
1--fireplace chimney's are designed/sized for fireplaces. When we install a stove or insert and in some cases even glass doors, in a fireplace set up, we change all of the dynamics that were accounted for originally.
2--almost every fireplace/chimney changes according to the mason that built it. I have seen smoke chambers big enough to stand up in to ones that were barely above the throat. The smoke chamber size has a significant impact on what happens in the chimney. Generally speaking, the larger it is, the more room for the smoke to cool, condense and create creosote. In fireplace set up, this doesn't impact a ton. It is only when we introduce draft control that this changes significantly
3--a direct connect (required in many jurisdictions now) bypasses the smoke chamber by running (usually SS flex) liner from the appliance to the clay lining in the chimney. There is usually a plate with adjustable legs and/or insulation installed at transition from the direct connect to the clay lining. This eliminates a major portion of the problem as it bypasses an area that is known to lead to cresote building.
4--the lining size probably most often seen in fireplace chimneys is 13x13. Stoves and inserts generally run from 6 to 8 inches. Folks often take a stove that is designed to be vented at 6 or 8 inches and just stick it in and think it will work well. Some do and many don't.
5--The optimum situation is to connect your stove/insert directly to the proper sized flue by way of a direct connect. It will be the most efficient and by far the least troublesome.
6--burning habits vary more than freplace/chimney design/construction. Those that keep a hot fire going have far less problems than those that don't. Those of us that try to damper down the stove to make it burn longer so we will have coals there when we get up and/or get home from work make it very difficult to avoid creosote build up. I have heard every story known when meeting folks to talk about their chimney fire, down draft, no draw, and other various problems. My favorite is the stove pipe stuck through a plate on a fireplace opening, sometimes even with downfall from the stove to the fireplace, a pile of wet soft wood and hearing how "that stove will hold fire all day while we are gone". At times you can even see the goo running around the plate.

So, I recommend highly a minimum of the direct connect. Depending on stove flue size will determine in the damper frame will need taken out or not. Some knock them out and lay them up on the smoke shelf for installation later. Ovalized pipe can also be used to fit through the opening. Depending on if you have offsets in your chmney and how many dictate how difficult the installation of a liner through the existing one will be. Without any offsets, it is relatively simple to do. With offsets, it can get a little trickier.

If you want any help with any of it, just pm me an I'll be glad to talk to you. I can't type very fast so this takes forever /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[heehaw]

thanks to everyone for all the info: i didn't like it when dad installed the insert the way he did, but sometimes sons can't tell dads things like that: and thankfully, they didn't have any problems: but now, i plan on hookin it up with direct connection, and i will sleep a lot better. until i get it changed, i'll continue to use the natural gas heaters, just dread seeing the bills this year.
heehaw