Generator Making pto generator.

leaddog · May 14, 2004

I very rarily loose my power but for the few times that I do I would like to have a standby gen. I also would like to have power to run my welder those few times I need it out in the field or away from home. HF has a 10000 watt belt-driven generator head and it would be very easy to beltdrive it from my pto. My question is how steady of voltage can you maintain doing this and has anyone of you done this. I have a 5500 watt gen now that I have very rairly used and I have to keep running it and maintaining it and I thing a pto one would be better. Plus I can sell the small one for more than buying the bigger one. Like $270. I know that it will take more fuel and my tractor will be out of commision when I'm using it but I just want it to keep my freezers and ref. and heat going untill power is restored. and 10000 watts are better than 5500.
Thanks
leaddog

SPIKER · May 14, 2004

leaddog:

i've looked at those for a long time too, the thing is you need to have output monitoring somehow so that as load increases the pto rpm keeps the 110/220 voltage up and at 60 hrtz. otherwise you run the risk of damaging something electrical, (welder and regular stuff won't mind some fluctuations but any electronics tv's ect can fry with the output fluctuating very much. )

anyhow if you have a good RPM hold on the tractor and the governor compensates for power requirements holding the RPM then it should be doable easly enough with soem welding skills and a few parts. (though I think I'd rather dirrrect drive it through a gearbox so no slippage of belts happen when the output requirements go up.)

Just my 2 cents worth.

Mark M /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

uhmgawa · May 14, 2004

( HF has a 10000 watt belt-driven generator head and it would be very easy to beltdrive it from my pto.)

If you look closer you'll find 10KW is the intermittent surge rating on the
generator. Both generator heads sold by HF are 7.2KW continuous duty.

BTW, the generator heads above are 3600RPM designs. Driving either
from a 540RPM PTO will require a gear/pulley ratio of 1:6.66 for intended
operation.

On a practical note, I find the circumstances under which I loose power
are those which I need the tractor for other tasks (snowstorms, etc..).
Tying it up for generator duty is less than ideal. Also the hourly
maintenance cost is sure to be higher for a tractor vs. a small dedicated
gas/propane engine.

BillyP · May 14, 2004

Bite the bullet and get a gas fired welder/generator.

leaddog · May 14, 2004

One advantage of my century is that it has a 1000rpm pto so I wouldn't have as much trouble gearing to 3600rpm. I've got the skill and parts so it sounds like a doable project to me. I've only been out of power for over 12 hrs once in the last 30 years. I only lose power for 4to 6 hrs maybe once in 4years and it is usually because of wind blowing trees down and kicking out a substation. I'm on a main transmission line so when I go out they are fixing it right a way. I just need something to keep from spoiling my food and keep alittle heat so the loss of the use of my tractor for a short time is no problem and if I need to use it to move snow I can do without the elect. I was just concerned about holding a somewhat steady voltage. It shouldn't put to much load on my tractor as it is 40hp at the pto. Thanks
leaddog

texbaylea · May 14, 2004

I used a 7kw pto generator on a Kubota B6100E on the Texas Gulf coast for years. I had a frequency meter and set the hand throttle to get 60 cycle and let in run. It would sag a little with a motor start but would recover. Usually would drop by 2-3 cycles for a heavy load but would recover. Almost all electronics nowadays uses switching power supplies so are relatively immune to frequency and voltage shifts. Any 60 cycle controled motors would be speed affected.

leaddog · May 14, 2004

Mark
Yes i'm sure that running my tv might not be good but I can get along for a few hrs with out that but I will get withdrawalls from not being able to run to TBN. But I guess if I can get lights, heat, and not ruin any food I guess I can get by for a few hrs /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
My 3045 is 40pto hp so it should beable to hold steady rpms. I've got the parts and I've got a plasma cutter and mig welder that is ready to go on another project so I might just try it. Only troble is now it is getting to be nice weather and the better half says we need to start getting some camping done. Just not enough hrs in a day thanks
leaddog

Egon · May 14, 2004

Perhaps an alternator and inverter would give closer frequency and voltage bands.

Egon

To20Chris · May 14, 2004

I thought about that too, but it would not work out well for me. I can't get my tractor down to the side of my house that I need to hook up to. Also, my power is so unreliable that I think it would be a pain. We've been out overnight at least 6 times in the last 18mo., a couple of them for several days. I really don't think I would have wanted to run my tractor unattended that long. My 5kW generator will run quite a lot of my house (I can run a couple of the big loads at the same time, so I do the round-robin thing), and it will go almost 8hrs on 5gal of gas with a moderate load. I have to agree that one of those welder/generators would probably be the best ticket.

If you set up a PTO driven one, you'll definitely have to monitor the output voltage, and maybe the frequency too. Motor driven loads especially don't like to be driven at voltages & frequencies they were not designed for.

beenthere · May 14, 2004

For what its worth, I see that the attachment (options) book that Deere has for its X series, shows a portable generator for 3pt PTO (540 RPM) rated up to 10kw of power (likely it too isn't continuous). But it would be something to compare homemade to, as it has 4 120 volt outlets and one 240 volt.

Probably more fun to make up your own. When the power goes out, intermittent use to run the freezer, the washer, the well, the furnace, the drier, the refrigerators will work while changing off plowing snow, and removing downed trees if an ice storm.

I recall using a 10k generator in the 70's after an ice storm, running from farm to farm to get water pumped (flush them toilets!), milk the cows, and do the other things above. Getting back around in 6-8 hours to do it again was all anyone needed for an emergency. Actually the 10k worked out well. Neighbors were mighty happy to have you stop by, and it was great except the beer wasn't always cold. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

For me, I will take my chances. By the time I would get the set hooked up, likely the power would be back on. For the investment, I can go to a motel and stay for a good number of nights too, if'n I can't shower at home. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

For a portable welder, it sounds like a great idea.

texbaylea · May 14, 2004

I ran my Kubota B6100E for 10 straight days at speed generating power after a hurricane. Stopped every 4 hours to refuel - 2.5 gals. Never faltered during that time. That type of operation is what diesels are desined for.

surfran · May 15, 2004

I too have been somewhat interested in that unit and will be watching this post to see what you end up doing. We rarely lose power, but it would sure be nice to have that cheap of insurance. And that version wouldn't take up much room for storage either.

It sounds like Texbaylea has done it and it will work. I only have a BX1800 so wasn't sure if that would be enough either. I haven't really given it much thought, but do pause every time I look at the unit in the HF catalog.

Good Luck,

texbaylea · May 15, 2004

I left out of my posts that the B6100E is 12hp net. It would not handle full load but did well otherwise. I believe about 15hp net would handle full load on that particular generator. - 7.2kW. My unit was hung on the 3pt so for someone with snow problems and a front mounted snow blower, it should not be a problem to disconnect, do your snow clearing and return. My generator is an orphan - the manufacturer closed down 15 years ago - so when it fails I will get a larger unit and pad mount it so that I just back up and hook up a drive shaft.

A small generator is also useful for using electric tools out in the boonies.

MMM · May 15, 2004

I think the factory pto gens are set up with speed increasers. They're a couple hundred bucks if I remember right. An UPS for electronics should save TBN/CNN junkies. I dont think momenrary cycle variancies would hurt as much as volt drops.
The system that really interests me is the hydraulic gen/welder which doesn't tie up PTO or hitch. I could use PHD etc, and put genset on FEL forks for welding/power tools. Plus there is one less engine to maintain on a farm. Seems when I need to use something I gotta work on it first.

Trev · May 15, 2004

( I ran my Kubota B6100E for 10 straight days at speed generating power after a hurricane. Stopped every 4 hours to refuel - 2.5 gals. Never faltered during that time. That type of operation is what diesels are desined for. )

I did the same, 10 days or so, when the big ice storm took out our power. Just shut down once for an oil/filter change, and brought it back up (it's a manual tranny, so didn't need to worry about the hydro fluid.) I didn't even shut down for fuel.. just carefully poured it in while it was running. One fill-up in the morning, and one when I got home from work. Saved our sorry butts.. would've ended up in one of the shelters they set up in local school gyms, or in a motel, if we didn't have it. And then our pipes might have frozen.

I just hook it up and run it for 30 minutes with a load every few months to keep it in shape.

It powered everything in our house, and our neighbor's house, without ever breaking a sweat. (JD 4300 with GenPower 17KW continuous and 35KW surge genset.) The PTO gensets seem to be able to handle surges without a problem, due, I suppose, to the rotational inertia. I don't even bring things up sequentially.. I just throw on the main breaker and the tractor doesn't even emit a puff of smoke as it takes the entire load at once.

I wouldn't part with it. And no extra engine to maintain!

Bob

To20Chris · May 15, 2004

OK OK, I give! If I had the bits I'd do it too! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif. A buddy of mine just bought an old farm house, and there is an old generator in a shed out by where the barn was. Four cylinder water cooled flathead of some kind (too dark). It's been a lot of years since it ran, but it's been under shelter - it's calling me! Now everyone please tell me it's hopelessly shot and I ought to stay away from it............... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

RichNJKubota · May 15, 2004

Go for it! It just may work.

Slamfire · May 17, 2004

4 cylinder flat head, sounds like a model T or A motor. They were by far the most prevalent.

Soundguy · May 18, 2004

Ford sold thier 4 cyl L-flat head engine to lots places as stationary power units... Might be an N - industrial engine.. which is essentially the same engine as thier 1939-1952 tractor engines. If it is.. it is a rock solid little work horse..

Soundguy

To20Chris · May 18, 2004

Yeah, I don't think it was an A motor, it seemed more compact than that. The N is a good possibility. I think the Willys also found its way into a few of these applications, as well as maybe Dodge? It’s bugging me now, I’m going to have to go over and look!