Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

[bob112]

We have a nice, modern 27T Cat with hydro thumb that we use a bit on the farm and our new building projects. However, due to the value of the machine, it really needs to run a bit more so considering some "for-hire" work. Before we dive in, I should mention I have a technical background as well as heavy construction, building bridges, roadways, retention ponds, culverts, massive storm sewers, etc. I am not a rookie, but I am also trying not to become an "excavation company" I guess.

I read a few posts on here that left me a touch discouraged on pond work and I sort of felt like it was "too easy" to where I would be competing with guys that have sloppy old equipment and I realize usually for pond customers, the price is usually all that matters. Those posts were from a decade ago so it would be interesting to see what some rates even look like currently? Honestly just want to see if it is worth the hassle and wear on the machine. I am trying to just stick with low liability work right now. However, that might become a bad idea. I am well qualified and licensed for geotechnical work, but not sure I want to get too wound in it right now. However, if that is something brings value, I can consider it.

Reason I bring this up is I dangled my card online a little a couple days ago and got many contacts. Most guys wanting tree/land clearing type stuff, which I might do some, but I am not about to start bashing the machine against trees or risk my life with 60ft trees. I have one contact I plan to meet with later today. He needs about 2 acres of area lifted for a parking lot for his commercial trash business, and pulling dirt from within the property. It seems right up my lane. We will have to discuss how big/deep he would want a pond, but I am not sure if I am to drag out all the details for the parking lot? I typically end up using my experience to explain how I will do a job, then someone goes and either does it themselves, or has someone else do it cheaper. It makes me want to throw a bid and say "it will get done right"....

I am trying not to become a "guy with a shovel, tell me where to dig".... The guy above has expressed interest in getting someone experienced on the job to help him make decisions on how to proceed and execute it. I have told others, but not this guy, that I am sticking to a $2k minimum just to get the machine on a site. Just not sure it is worth it for me to move for less. I have to clean tracks, prep machine, etc.

Any thoughts, advice, quotes, etc could sure help me determine a direction. I am in the midwest where the American dream is "a pond", but few want to pay for it. I would probably consider digging 'some' new home basements and stuff like that, but this machine is marginally big for some of that work.

 

[LD1]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

Im not saying it cannot be done.....but alot of the jobs you mention you currently see a excavator working in conjunction with a dozer

 

[MossRoad]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

And a dump truck...

And liability insurance.

 

[Steppenwolfe]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

Absolutely, Positively, get an Inland Marine Insurance policy for that excavator. Once it leaves your primary property the liability is staggering.

 

[hube2]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

...And liability insurance.

I was going to say this. I had thought to do some local emergency snow removal work. After big storms here there are always people that are not prepared for heavy snows hiring people to come move snow. I figured what could be easier and it could help pay for the new equipment. After some research I found that the cost of the liability insurance for me would outweigh what I could possibly earn only doing it part time.

 

[crashz]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

I don't see why not. While some have had mixed results, I have had great results with advertising on Craigslist locally. I spell out what I do, when I do it and base my pricing on looking at the job. 80% of the jobs I look at, I quote with either a fixed price or hourly with estimate of hours. 20% of jobs are either out of my wheel house, or simply too far away, or on the rare occasion a client that is questionable to work for. All customers I've worked for have been pleasant, paid on the day of service and most are re-occurring.

A couple of things that I've learned:
- Price yourself appropriately. My hourly rate is high for the market, but after insurance costs, fuel, maintenance, equipment upgrades or specialized equipment purchases, and mobilization costs, there is little left to pay yourself with. I made the mistake of not including and equipment repair/purchase costs into my rates. This means EVERYTHING I buy that is not strictly tractor maintenance is not accounted for. It helps as a tax write off, but I'm still paying out of pocket.
- My business is side work. I generate between $4k and $6k per year. I started it in 2017 and have been pretty busy most summer weekends. Its exactly the right amount of work. But to do the work I have purchased: a trailer, various attachments (which some have been great others duds), upgraded and repaired my dump truck (trailer hitch, brake controls, new dump body, routine repairs), walk behind brush cutter and lots of maintenance. My cash outlay has been way more than my generation. If I stop purchasing equipment (I'm in a good spot now), I will be able to cost justify at the 10 year mark. Really, I wanted all of this stuff anyway, so the business "need" is my justification, but from a P&L sheet view, this is not the way a business should be run.
- Insurance: I have separate commercial insurance, and liability that covers work that spans a lot more than I actually do. This is for personal and professional reason though. I have unique coverage due to the side business, but also I cover my PE license in it as well as another layer of security. Its worth every penny and not overly burdensome.

Go for it and good luck!

 

[MossRoad]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

I recall reading something somewhere about requiring different insurance if you dig past X feet in depth as well.

 

[crashz]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

Moss- you are right. 4ft is my insurance carrier limit. 0-4ft is covered in a "landscaper" policy. 4ft and greater is under and excavation policy.

And to be clear, I have commercial auto on the truck and trailer, liability for the business, and Kubota insurance on the tractor. 3 policies. Note that attachments, tools, etc are not covered. There is some exposure still. And no employees! That brings in a whole different set of requirements.

 

[lilranch2001]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

Insurance is what kept me from doing contracting before and after retiring.

Almost no way to overcome all the liability for a small guy.

I have a lot of respect for those who do it and do it right!

 

[Peter 315]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

Moss- you are right. 4ft is my insurance carrier limit. 0-4ft is covered in a "landscaper" policy. 4ft and greater is under and excavation policy.

And to be clear, I have commercial auto on the truck and trailer, liability for the business, and Kubota insurance on the tractor. 3 policies. Note that attachments, tools, etc are not covered. There is some exposure still. And no employees! That brings in a whole different set of requirements.

4 feet is pretty deep, I thought landscaper insurance would just be a couple of feet.....

 

[4570Man]

Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

No offense but I think you’re way out of line with a 2k minimum for a 5800 pound excavator. Also it’s way too small for building any degree of a pond or parking pad. I built a good size pad with with a 10 ton excavator and 6500 truck and that’s on the verge of too small.

 

[Industrial Toys]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

Here, moving stuff around has become so expensive, it's not just something you can dabble in. Also, when you get into construction, you better know what you are doing and have some experience.

 

[LD1]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

No offense but I think you’re way out of line with a 2k minimum for a 5800 pound excavator. Also it’s way too small for building any degree of a pond or parking pad. I built a good size pad with with a 10 ton excavator and 6500 truck and that’s on the verge of too small. View attachment 679166View attachment 679167

I initially thought the same thing. Thinking that he had a deere "model 27" excavator......or a 2.7 metric ton class machine....

But then I re-read it and I "assume" he is talking about a 27 TON machine....

IF thats the case....its a huge excavator and $2k min is not out of line.

I dont think someone would be talking about digging basements and building ponds if he only had a 2.7t class mini

 

[4570Man]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

I initially thought the same thing. Thinking that he had a deere "model 27" excavator......or a 2.7 metric ton class machine....

But then I re-read it and I "assume" he is talking about a 27 TON machine....

IF thats the case....its a huge excavator and $2k min is not out of line.

I dont think someone would be talking about digging basements and building ponds if he only had a 2.7t class mini

Yea if it’s 27 tons that’s a different story. Here’s a the specs I was going by.

 

[LD1]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

Yea if it’s 27 tons that’s a different story. Here’s a the specs I was going by.View attachment 679175

Yea, those are the specs of the 302.7

I dont think 27t is an actual model number. I think he was just referencing the machine weight. AS most people dont know what you are talking about if you tell them "I have a cat 325 excavator..."

Which is probably about the size he has if its 27 tons

 

[crashz]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

I read the OP's post and assumed he owns a newer 27 ton Cat. Like a 325 or so.

It would also make sense that he wants that rig to keep running and make a little bit of money. Less of an importance with a mini I suppose.

OP - Along with robust liability insurance, you better make friends with a hauler too. Quote the hauling based on the haulers actual price. I've been burned by tolls, fees and truck routes in the past.

 

[MickeyDBC]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

You might look at leasing it out on a weekly or monthly basis. A friend of mine leases out a couple of Bobcats and his conditions are you have to be a licensed and insured contractor, and he visits them every couple of weeks for a maintenance check. He is not getting rich off of them, but it covers his costs and them some. He said that he normally flips them at around three years so his machines are newer and nicer than the usual rental units and his customers like that. He keeps his overhead way down and can lease them out for a little cheaper than the rental yards.

 

[MossRoad]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

Moss- you are right. 4ft is my insurance carrier limit. 0-4ft is covered in a "landscaper" policy. 4ft and greater is under and excavation policy.

And to be clear, I have commercial auto on the truck and trailer, liability for the business, and Kubota insurance on the tractor. 3 policies. Note that attachments, tools, etc are not covered. There is some exposure still. And no employees! That brings in a whole different set of requirements.

Thanks for the details. :thumbsup:

 

[workinonit]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

Are you looking at doing project pricing or by the hour? I owned a PC220 for 10 years and just used it here on my farm for whatever I needed. It too needed to go somewhere to be run so I traded up to a cab tractor and sold the 220. Shortly after that I ran across a guy that has a 48,000# machine that comes to my place and works it for $125/hour plus $300 transport fee on each end. If I had known about him I would have sold the Komatsu long ago. The guy is fast and very, very good on a hoe. As good as I've ever seen thus he stays busy all the time. If you gonna run a hoe for a living you better be proficient at it.

 

[4570Man]

Re: Man with an excavator here. Considering doing a little "for hire" work.

Yea, those are the specs of the 302.7

I dont think 27t is an actual model number. I think he was just referencing the machine weight. AS most people dont know what you are talking about if you tell them "I have a cat 325 excavator..."

Which is probably about the size he has if its 27 tons

It looks like you’re right. After further searches I don’t believe cat makes a 27t excavator. But Kubota and Deere label their hoes like that so it didn’t strike me as 27 tons.