Medical costs

[ultrarunner]

Hey, from '43 to '52, the total cost of delivery for my four sisters and one brother was exactly 1 country ham per kid. The last three brothers were born in hospital, don't know what that cost.

I know my Grandparents needed a Doctor visit after the twins were born... it was a calf for payment... they were Dairy Farmers... all my uncles and aunts and Mom born at the farm.... just like my Grandmother and her Mother before her...

 

[ultrarunner]

You have hit upon one of our problems. Until we have Tort reform in this country (which will never happen), we will never be able to control medical costs. The many other items you mentioned all factor in as well.

It is a factor across many areas... yesterday and couple with a young child was awarded 3.5 Million for illegally being evicted from the San Francisco rent controlled unit...

Many things Docs and Hospitals do is because of liability or fear of liability...

 

[ultrarunner]

I know a few MDs that have weighed the pros and cons of Canada vs USA practice.
The US MD earns piles more that the Cdn MD (like 2x-3x) but the malpractice premiums take the net earnings down below a Canadian MDs take consequently not many leave for the US.

Older MDs welcomed the current Canadian MEDICARE scheme because it meant that EVERY procedure would be reimbursed while B4 they had to overcharge some to compensate for the deadbeats or simply poor ones.

Another point is upon admission in a Canadian hospital patients have to sign a waiver otherwise no treatment.
Suing the gov't medicare system, I suspect, would be quite a challenge.

Many waivers here are tossed because it is against Public Policy or signed at a time of Duress...

 

[EddieWalker]

I am a medical provider and I can tell you that our health care outcomes are certainly NOT GREAT when compared to other first world countries. Period. End of story. We also, as a country, spend about twice as much per person. It really is pretty embarrassing.

What countries provide better healthcare?

 

[ultrarunner]

There are so many ways to look at things... and just about every top 10 list will not be the same.

Last I checked... Hawaii is the United States and one of my friends works at Queens Medical Hospital... they have a never ending stream of patients for all over the Pacific seeking treatment.

A lot of the Best Lists go on cost... or affordability... others are based on technology...

Many that are on the "Best" lists do not offer organ transplants... or Gamma Knife for Brain Tumors or Gene Therapy... etc.

Just a few weeks ago the British Healthcare System refused to allow the parents of a sick child to take the child out of the country for treatment... scary stuff when you think about it.

 

[aczlan]

This thread is on cost so lets start there:
Per capita the US spends almost twice what THE NEXT HIGHEST country spends! Wow. We should have the best health care in the world. We have the 31st highest life expectancy (Cuba is #32). Our infant death rate fits in better with third world countries than other first world nations (truly frightening). Maternal morality too. Hospital readmissions, infections after surgery, unnecessary procedures are all very poor. Outcomes for many cancer treatments too. There is more. Again, I am not an expert but I am knowledgeable.

In my opinion, insurance companies are a huge part of that.
I knew someone who had cancer which had chewed up several of their vertebrae, the insurance company refused to pay for a full body CT scan or MRI (I don't remember which) but was happy to pay for surgery to fuse the vertebrae that the cancer had chewed up.
They died several weeks after the surgery because the cancer had spread through their entire body including to their lungs and brain. The insurance company could have saved a lot of money (as well as pain and suffering on the part of the patient) if they had done a full body scan like the doctors were requesting because the patient would have never approved the back surgery had they known how far the cancer had spread.


Aaron Z

 

[mjarrels]

Morgan Spurlock did a segment on a large hospital in Bangkok where many go for treatment. Five star with prices posted, first class doctors and medical staff and you go next door to five star hotel on the beach to recover. Cost is about 75% lower than the US.

mark

 

[Luke'sScreenName]

What countries provide better healthcare?

Below is the World Health Organization's ranking FWIW. I do not know there methodology other than it is outcome data driven.

If you want to know about specific segments, procedures, diseases, etc, other than what I mentioned in my previous post just ask and ill see if I can find it. :thumbsup:

1 France
2 Italy
3 San Marino
4 Andorra
5 Malta
6 Singapore
7 Spain
8 Oman
9 Austria
10 Japan
11 Norway
12 Portugal
13 Monaco
14 Greece
15 Iceland
16 Luxembourg
17 Netherlands
18 United Kingdom
19 Ireland
20 Switzerland
21 Belgium
22 Colombia
23 Sweden
24 Cyprus
25 Germany
26 Saudi Arabia
27 United Arab Emirates
28 Israel
29 Morocco
30 Canada
31 Finland
32 Australia
33 Chile
34 Denmark
35 Dominica
36 Costa Rica
37 USA

 

[ultrarunner]

Austria is number 9 and I am well acquainted with Austrian Doctors and Nurses...

There are many wonderful things they provide for the unborn, newborn, kids and productive adults... not so much once you retire... it is changing but they all say the US offers much more for geriatric segment.

It is also interesting they have quite a cross boarder exchange between Germany and Austria that goes both ways... both medical systems have prohibitions on what they can offer citizens but not so with non-citizens... so one option is a short drive across the boarder to get the treatment you want... can be as simple as root canal vs extraction...

The well baby program is well known... first... each firm must provide 2 years off maternity leave and I had one friend that had her 3 kids back to back... she had 6 years paid leave AND the her employer had to keep her job open...

Also, with each pregnancy comes a baby book... when the mother follows all the steps she alone receives a cash stipend for her good mothering... i.e. baby class, vaccinations and doctor visits.

A rather new benefit is the father is now eligible for maternity leave... in some families the Mother may take off 1 of the 2 years followed by the father taking off 1 year for the second year...

The local village near where I worked had a village Doctor... nicest guy and made house calls... his office was beneath his flat... his stipend for being a Doctor was not enough for him to ever buy a home... so he had a side job as a truck driver... not many American physicians would to for driving a taxi or truck to supplement their income.

They also still institutionalize kids with severe disabilities... much more so than here where home health aids and visits are often provided... it is less expensive and more efficient to institutionalize as it was explained to me...

One more little added fact... compulsory service is required in Austria... however this is not limited to military service and many choose social service to fulfill the requirement with the medical system being the largest beneficiary... can be as simple as providing medical transport to working in a senior center or hospital...

 

[/pine]

You have hit upon one of our problems. Until we have Tort reform in this country (which will never happen), we will never be able to control medical costs. The many other items you mentioned all factor in as well.

Tort reform is not the answer to reducing the cost of malpractice insurance...(It has not worked in TX anyway)...
below is what I posted earlier in the thread...
Tort reform would only limit injured parties that is not the answer...

Another factor is the extreme high cost of malpractice insurance...one way to reduce that is to take away contingency fees from lawyers...if injured parties did not have to give up 40%-50% of their settlements to the stinking lawyers the payouts would not have to be so substantial...limit the scumbags to 10% and justified costs...