MF 1165 Crank No Start - Thinking Neutral Start Safety Switch / Lockout

[tr0y]

Need Help diagnosing a cranking but no start condition on my 2003 1165 MF Compact Tractor.

Please do not tell me how unsafe or dangerous this is ...
I fully understand the safety concerns of removing Neutral Start Switches / Lockouts on a Tractor.
This is for testing only to confirm a diagnosis of a failed part.
I have no plan or intention of operating without the lockouts.

Picked up a this unit a bit ago, it had a failed water pump, fan and radiator, repaired them and got it functional and driving.

It has been sitting in desert sun for years and the console and dash are in pretty bad shape but that is next on the fix list.

I have determined that we have a good battery and good fuel flow etc, I think that my no start is due to the machine thinking it is in a unsafe state to start due to being in gear or something else being turned on.

I think this is due one of the Neutral Stary Switches / Lockouts on the Tractor failing, because if I jiggle the transmission / drive levers occasionally it will start and run and then other times it won't.

I have the service manual but it is unclear as to what and where these lockout relays look like, can anyone here help me find them and wire around them to confirm they are failed so that I can order new replacement parts to make the machine function correctly.

Thanks !

 

[JWR]

I do not own an 1165 but will comment briefly: Most of these safety cutoffs are make/break switches carrying very low current, not relays (to the best of my knowledge and all the tractors I have worked on. ) Often the switches (especially on things like drive levers) are just mechanical position things. They are configured to allow continuity on through that switch which enables starting and/or running. I say "enables starting" but there are usually several of them in series any one of which can prevent starting/running if it is 'open.' Not much of a way to debug other than check each one individually. They have varied appearances depending on the tractor but are pretty obvious in function if you can find the darn things. Start with the lever and just track where it goes and what it moves or touches.

BUT WAIT: You said "cranking but no start!?" OK, back up in what I said and find your electric fuel pump or fuel shutoff valve INSTEAD OF the solenoid. If it is cranking your solenoid is already getting the 12v it needs. The destination is either your fuel pump or fuel shutoff valve lacking power. [I think most fuel shutoff valves require the 12v to stay on allowing fuel flow and shut off fuel when they lose 12v.] All that said, you SHOULD be able to run a temporary jumper from the positive terminal of your battery with a clip on to a bare spot on the trigger wire to the either the shutoff valve or the fuel pump (peel off insulation if you have to.) That temporary jumper amounts to bypass of all the safety interlocks no matter what they are. Use care because once you get it running this way taking off the jumper will be the only way to stop the engine if the culprit/victim is the shutoff valve.

You are way ahead having the manual! FIRST Use a voltmeter and look for the 12v at your fuel pump and the fuel shutoff valve, thus figuring out which one is the problem. Then jiggle whichever lever has been working for you and see which lever causes loss of 12v at the culprit pump or shutoff valve. Rambling, sorry. Hope this helps.

 

[lpakiz]

My Massey 1754 uses a 12 volt timed (several seconds) signal to energize the SHUTOFF solenoid. I can hear the click when I shut off the key, then several seconds later, after the engine stops, another click when the signal ends. My friends D4 Caterpiller crawler is the same--unhook that wire or remove the fuse, it won't shut off.