Mulcher Thread

[Terra Firma Scott]

Wow guys, everyone must be busy cause no posts lately it seems... As long as busy equates to $$$ than thats great..Figured it was time to stir the nest...Whats new in the mulching community?

I had the opportunity last evening to run a RC 100 with a Magnum Mulcher. Met another mulcher in my area doing a 55 acre job and offered me the chance to run his machine versus mine..I was doing a 5 acre parcel adjacent to his and heck I couldnt resist and say no...

Very impressed with the Machines power. Mostly impressed with the cab comfort level..Freakin lazy boy seating compared to my CAT..Great AC and much lower noise level inside with the head running....Took some getting used to the Tail as the machine is longer than mine..Wider too but that didnt seem to bother me as much...

I must say though i like my Timber Ax .. ...I am sure I need more time to really get used to the different cutting technique of the Magnum , But i expected more from it..Only ran for like 45 minutes..Seemed a bit bumpy/rough cutting versus the Timber Ax's smoothness..Totally diferent head so its like apples to oranges but just my first carbide run....spins the opposite directiion and the axis of the cutter is forward of the heads center versus the Timber Ax is rearward of the heads center...I kept forgetting that...Played with closing the door a few times but didnt really now what I was doing and didnt see any difference really in finished material...I would like to run it again since I hear so much about it here....

Might be an ASV in my future

 

[deniscimafinc]

Hi there,

Just out of curiosity (well, not that innocent curiosity, you will guess, but hey, that's business)...

How long does the blades on your TimberAx last? How often do you need to replace them? How big of a tree you feel comfortable chipping with it?

Always good to know how competitors' models compare with ours

 

[Terra Firma Scott]

I have logged a whopping 50 hours with the Timber Ax...I have not had to replace the knives yet.Sharpened them twice so far.A new set is 700 bux for my 53 inch cut width..I feel comfortable mulching 4-6 inch all day long...I have gone into bigger than that occassionally and it lets you know when its time to back down.....it will do it it just takes longer and more attention to the sound of the pumps..The pressure gauge also is a great indicator of the load the head is seeing....This particular head was the best / only match for my machine due to flow requirements if all the other heads out there...I still havent met anyone with a smaller machine such as mine running a mucher..My machine weighs in at ball park 7500lbs and the 53inch head adds 1900lbs so im on the trailer under 10k ....now im rambling but hope i answered your head related ?'s...What model/brand are you refering too as a competitor as you spoke of?

 

[QwikDraw]

I'm going out on a limb here...

DenisCimaf

 

[Terra Firma Scott]

ah yes quick-i believe i looked at that brands website but had never heard of them before...Fred, is there a USA supplier/vendor?

curious-

 

[deniscimafinc]

Hi Terra Firma Scott,

Yes, QwikDraw was right on it. Well, the website as long needed updating but I've been overwhelmed with sales support and IT support. It's still a small family business (12 employees), but hopefully I'll be able to hire some help in the next months to speed up marketing.

Scott, DENIS CIMAF will sell its products through any heavy equipment dealers in the US. We have representatives for the South Eastern states, for New England states, for WA and OR, and for Texas. You can contact the main office first (toll free 877-279-2300) and someone will put you in contact with the representative for your area.

By the way, thanks for the figures. I always welcome opportunities to learn more about the other brands out there


Fred

 

[QwikDraw]

Fred,

I have been looking at a 12k lb excavator and I know another member (Robbie H) just purchased one.

What's your best head for a machine of that weight? I think the various machines are putting out between 18-23 gpm. I see you have different style heads for smaller excavators, are they similar to the AFE? I was leaning toward the Brush Hound flail but maybe you could change my mind.

Ted

 

[Terra Firma Scott]

Do I smell a DEMO???

 

[deniscimafinc]

Hello QwikDraw,

Well, first thing I need to make clear is that DENIS CIMAF is focused on industrial attachment that are meant to run all year. As such, it's not the kind of toy one would buy to clear his 40-acre parcel of land and sit in the garage afterwards.

Basically, for excavators, DENIS CIMAF has:

- brushcutter-chippers, that use the fixed-knives rotor technology with sharpenable, bolt-on blades (the DAH product group). They will cut and chip at the same time, leaving a mat of mulch on the ground. The smallest DAH head runs for around 30K+ $, and that's for the head alone. Complete package, all installed and ready to go, is probably around 42K$ (which you'll find is similar to a good hydraulic hammer package).

- plain brushcutter, that use a horizontal disc with two swiveling blades (the DAV product group). These heads will only cut the vegetation, so finish is not as nice as with the DAH models. However, price tag is sensibly lower, and you would probably have it all installed and ready to roll at around 32K$ for a model similarly-sized as the smallest DAH head.

By the way, in these price figures, I'm including pipping, hosing and installation labor, so the numbers are more or less a worst-case approximation. What you already have installed don't have to be paid a 2nd time. You get the picture. And you might find these heads are more expensive than other brands, and that's known and that's understandable: stronger construction, variable displacement axial-piston hydraulic motor, priority-flow-valve kit for better performance, timing-type cogged belt, heavy duty bearing, premium cutting technology, one full day of installation verification and in-field startup included in the price (wherever you are on the continent). And we're nice people too

I also need to add that DENIS CIMAF went through the flail-type models. Back then, the DAH models were the TRH, and there were only the TRH-150 and the TRH-100. The knives were on an axle and would bounce back whenever they would hit something. Idea was that, if there was a rock, the knives would not be hurt. Truth, though, was that:
- hard impacts would damage the axle, thus making maintenance a pain;
- in bigger material (10" and over), at 3000 rpm, the knives would end up bouncing back as well, thus changing the cutting angle, and thus resulting in lower production.

When the fixed knives rotor was tested, there was quite sensible increase in productivity that was seen (around 30%). And that, just because the cutting angle wouldn't change anymore. Of course, the rotor was then much more aggressive, and that's when the protection rings were added (limit size of material, protect the blade holder itself). And then it was clear that a winner was born, and patents were submitted (granted around 2004).

All that to say:
- In my opinion, it is clear that a flail mower can't do as heavy material as a fixed-knive brushcutter-chipper can do;
- If you're in for year-round operations and need highest productivity possible, a fixed-knives rotor is the best option;
- If you're in smaller stuff and don't want to invest in heavy duty machinery, then a flail mower will probably serve you well. We simply don't want to play in that market for now;
- If you're a good excavator operator, and unless you are specifically required to mix material in the ground (which cost a lot), there's no advantage to go with carbide hammers. There are ways to work with a fixed-knives rotor that, altough they might seem slower at first for the hasty operator, prove more profitable in the end for the operator who take care of his machine. But isn't it like that for any type of equipment ?


For a 12-ton machine, DENIS CIMAF has:

- the DAH-125D brushcutter-chipper, cutting width of 48", 17 knives with sharpenable, bolt-on blades, requires about 25 gal/min of flow, good to chip trees 10" in diameter and more if required;

- the DAV-510 brushcutter, cutting width of 32", 2 swiveling knives mounted on a horizontal disc, sharpenable knives, requires about 20 gal/min, good to cut trees up to 6" in diameter, but not much more than that;

Let me add that you don't have to worry about the flow requirement of the DAH-125D. As quickly said before, you will usually get a priority flow valve installed, which takes the flow of the pump(s) and send the required flow to the head. Yes, that will slow down the rest of the system, but there are a few tricks in the way it is installed that keep the whole system comfortable to use.


I'm not sure I have convinced you but in the end, the real important thing is you get the machine that is right for you, isn't it

So, again:
- if you need industrial-class productivity and want to be able to bid on jobs where time constraints and nice finish requirements are important, then a brushcutter-chipper like the one from DENIS CIMAF is a good choice;
- if you need good-looking finish but productivity is not paramount, then a flail mower is all right;
- if good-looking finish isn't paramount and only need to cut down vegetation (power line management, pre-com thinning), then a plain rotary brushcutter represents the lowest operating cost;
- if you know you will have to constantly mix material into the ground and can't afford to have two machines (one for brushcutting, other for mixing), then a carbide hammer machine is probably the advisable choice.


Hope this helps...



Fred

 

[deniscimafinc]

Scott,

Regarding a demo, if you're not too far from Panama City, FL, it is certainly possible to arrange a demo of a front-mounted head installed on the tracked skid steer.

It could smell a demo if you'd like me to put one on the stove for you



Fred