My "new" tractor

[Soundguy]

I did discover a potential problem safety-wise, other than no ROPS. I read a newspaper story online the other night while doing research on the tractor. A teenage boy slipped or fell getting off the tractor and engaged the PTO in doing so. Of course he landed on it and was killed. The only good way on and off for me is also the back of the tractor. I have an owner's manual for it now that says the clutch must be down to engage the PTO. Wrong! Mine can be started too without pushing in the clutch. It has a rod that needs to be pulled up to start it. This boy may have caught a shoelace or something on it, pulled it up and then fell from being caught. I can see how it could happen. So now I either shell out $50 for a PTO shield or try to make one. I'm also thinking boots without laces could be an extra safety precaution. Still won't stop me from catching my pant leg, etc. Just a note to pass on for anyone else thinking of getting a vintage tractor.

A good friend once told me that any problem that can be solved with a check, isn't a problem.. it's an expense...

Weld up a quick and dirty pto shield, and / or weld up a set of steps to make egress easier on the tractor. I have a set for my fenderless JD-B. it's virtually impossible to enter or exit that tractor if you got bad knees or an arm injury.. etc. The step makes it soo much easier.

Soundguy

 

[roxynoodle]

A wide front end would be too much hassle. From what I've read, it is questionable whether the ones that had it were more stable. This is a tractor with 24" of clearance, therefore, very high center of gravity. It will be pulling a spreader on flat as a pancake fields. Sure, it's possible to drive into a ground hog hole, hopefully I won't. I don't intend to use it for mowing or anything else that would put me on a slope.

Once I fix the choke issue I shouldn't need to get on and off while it's running. So undecided on the PTO shield. A step would take care of that issue too, good idea, Soundguy.

 

[BTDT]

PTO shield could also serve as the step, if sturdy enough.

 

[Joe1]

Looks like a pretty solid tractor. You said the instruments work. Any idea how many hours are on the tractor? I ran into a guy in Pennsylvania last year with a John Deere twin from the 1940.s (a "daily driver") that he claimed has 9,500 hours on the original engine and to have another, older version,with something like 13,000 on the original engine, allegedly neither having been overhauled.

Those old tractors were built like tanks and with relatively low speed engines seemed to last a long time.

Good luck with your latest acquisition.

 

[roxynoodle]

PTO shield could also serve as the step, if sturdy enough.

If I get on and off from the back, it is easy because I use the drawbar for a step (big C shaped one), then step up onto the rear axle, then onto the platform.

As for hours, there is no tach or hour meter. There is an oil gauge, temp gauge and battery gauge only. I have no idea how many hours it has or whether the engine has been rebuilt at any time. I figure I'll keep running as long as it will keep running and if it needs rebuilt at some time, I will get to learn something new!

 

[BobG_in_VA]

If I get on and off from the back, it is easy because I use the drawbar for a step (big C shaped one), then step up onto the rear axle, then onto the platform.

Get a couple of stair tread abrasive stick-ons to put on the axles, as early in the morning those things can get slick with condensation. I've "mis-stepped" a time or two myself as a result. All that steel and cast iron don't give much if you fall on it. BobG in VA

 

[schmism]

so for a guy that knows absolutly nothing about old iron....

how do you guys classify these things.... HP? weight?

what can/could it do?

I kinda have an idea of what modern tractors can do based on size and HP... but that doestn translate well to the old iron from what i understand...

 

[BobG_in_VA]

so for a guy that knows absolutly nothing about old iron....

how do you guys classify these things.... HP? weight?

what can/could it do?

I kinda have an idea of what modern tractors can do based on size and HP... but that doestn translate well to the old iron from what i understand...

Different times bred different tractors. The H's and M's, the 2Ns, 9Ns and JD A/Bs basically replaced the horse/mule teams. You may look at them now and say they that they appear pre-historic in relation to the stuff selling today, a farmer in the 30s/40s/50s could do many times more with one H than he could do with the best team of draft horses in the country. Hence the drawbar pull for early tractor plows, etc. A "20-couple horsepower" H could and probably still can out pull todays 35 HP stuff, just by virtue of the amazing amout of torque it put out at a blistering 1650rpm (or so). Pretty much could run it wide open for about 10 hours on a tank of gas. Pull a 2 bottom plow all day and never get above 160 degrees (they have big radiators). Todays FEL is yesterday's wheelbarrow. The H also had a road gear (close to 15mph) that a guy could take his crops to town with even if he couldn't afford a truck. Different times indeed. Now we have a tractor hooked up to each implement.....Farmwithjunk probably could go on for hours on this. I gave it up when I was 18 and went to college....But we still have my grandmother's sidesaddle in the shed.....BobG in VA

 

[roxynoodle]

I keep seeing different specs on hp and weight so I'm unsure which numbers are correct. It is rated anywhere from 19-24hp on the drawbar and higher on the belt drive. Weight I've seen anywhere from 3875 to 5500lbs. I'm thinking it's closer to the 3875 though. It's advantage over my Yanmar, at least for pulling the spreader, will be weight. The 5th gear for faster road driving is between 15-16 mph so it's nice to go down the road faster. I also like those heavy duty drawbars for pulling.

And, let's be honest, it's just plain fun to drive! For the price it was worth adding to my barn.

 

[RobertN]

The steering wheel is so gooped up from sitting out in the sun that my hands get totally black in about 30 seconds. Looks like a new one is only $30, so I was glad to see that. The choke cable has been disconnected because it is rusted. So I have to move it by hand before I start it.

Ebay has TONS of parts come through. YTmag.com is a good source too. There are others if you do a web search. YTmag could help you confirm the year...

Re: the hitch; if you have a hydrualic 1pt or 2pt hitch, you can get a 3pt conversion.

Nothin like a RED tractor

 

[whitetiger]

The best thing you could do to make that tractor safer is to install a kit for a wide front end. The tricicle configuration was handy for cultivating but not nearly as stable as the wide front version. Many roll over accidents have occured with the trikes which is why they stopped making them 40 or so years ago. Great care must be taken when crossing ditches and driving on hillsides. I am not sure what the kit would cost you but maybe others on this site could give you an idea. Other than that, the H is a fine machine and you got a good deal.

A narror front end is no more unstable than a wide front end. The wide front axle pivots in the center. The narrow front was dicontinued primarily so larger size front tires could be used for a better ride. Also mud or snow would build up between the tires and pedestal locking up your front tires with a narrow front. A wide front set to the same track a the rear tires will till row crop every bit as well as a narrow front except for head land turns using 3 point equipment.

 

[Doc_Bob]

A narror front end is no more unstable than a wide front end. .

Hmmm, my gut tells me otherwise. I think I will go ride my tricycle for a while and think about narrow versus wide front ends.
Bob

 

[Nat]

Bob, I'd have to agree with Whitetiger on this on. A wide front has the same rear width and a pivot on the front where as a tricycle front is spread on 2 tires that are set about 1 foot apart so they are more stable than the same configuration tractor with a wide front on a pivot. I have seen studies in the past where the tipping point of a tricycle front was lower than the same tractor with a wide front. Some of the aftermarket wide fronts were extended out more and they were more stable.
I have a C farmall, with the tricycle front and a B- Allis Chalmers with a wide front and the C is much more stable than the B. I know this is apples to oranges, but if you spend time on trikes you would feel the same. Later, Nat

 

[JimParker]

I assume we're talking about early "wide front" designs that use a pivoting axle for steering. In this case, the only difference would be the width of the axle to which the wheels were attatched.

You would have to turn the axle 60 degrees or more off-center for the wide front to become effectively as narrow (sideways rollover axis) as the narrow front would be 100% of the time. Try it yourself with two different length pencils, and you'll see what I mean.

wide narrow
____ vs __

/
/ vs /
/

It is true that as you turn the axle farther to make sharper turns, you lose some of the stability created by the wider axle. But that does not change the fact that the wider front axle design will always be more statically stable than the narrow axle design.

As you begin to explore the "dynamic rollover" characteristics, the wide-front remain considerably more inherently stable. That's why all the manufacturers switched to wide-front designs, and then to stationary axles with pivoting wheels when product liability lawsuits came into vogue.

That's one of the reasons I find New Holland's "SuperSteer" such an interesting anomality... I wonder how they ever got that past their internal legal review teams!

 

[roxynoodle]

I did some research on the tractor before I bought it. The wide front ends, statistically, were only slightly more stable than the trike fronts. The biggest problem with stability on the Farmall H is that it has 24" of clearance, and therefore a very high center of gravity. Wide front or not, this tractor is easy to tip. I do have the back wheels at 84" apart. One of my neighbors is trying to get me to take them in, but as high as this tractor is, I want them left where they're at. If slopes are a concern and you want a vintage tractor, I would look at the Ford 8Ns and 9Ns. Low center of gravity combined with wide stance.

My Yanmar has the front wheels set out the same as the back ones. But, it also is a tall tractor for it's width (to till in water for the rice paddies) and it is tippy also. Center of gravity seems to be more a factor than the setting of the front wheels.

 

[wolc123]

You are on the right track with the wide setting of the rears, that will help a lot, but if one of those rears breaks into a big gopher home, you will not have much to keep the tractor from rolling. The pivot on a typical wide front is limited to about 15 degrees and will still prevent roll in many cases. Also, the fronts, being in the same track as the rears, will often break open the gopher homes before the rears get there. I own a trike and one thing for sure, it is not a tractor for inexperienced operators. Trikes were more effective than wide fronts for cultivating for three reasons: better visibility, tighter turning radius, and better crop clearance. Also, lacking hydraulic power they were quite a bit easier to steer. Even with these advantages, safety concerns halted thier manufacture 40 years ago (it had little to do with snow and ice getting stuck between the front wheels, who cultivates in the winter?). Heck, even the 3 wheeled ATV suffered the same fate 20 years ago. Good thing we have a bunch of lawyers looking out for us.

 

[roxynoodle]

Yeah, I can see mud getting stuck in the tricycle front end. For my use though, it could be snow and ice, as the fields are empty all winter and it is a good time to spread as long as it isn't too much snow or too wet.

I did get a choke rod on it today and that is so nice not to have to jump on and off the tractor to adjust the choke. Plus I shouldn't be chancing running myself over when I start it as I'll be in the seat. I did also put on a new steering wheel. The old one isn't even round anymore and I assume at one point it was round. The steering wheel was a lot harder than the choke rod. Had to use a mini sledge to get the old one off and the new on (with a block of wood to keep myself from marring the new metal).

 

[whitetiger]

You are on the right track with the wide setting of the rears, that will help a lot, but if one of those rears breaks into a big gopher home, you will not have much to keep the tractor from rolling. The pivot on a typical wide front is limited to about 15 degrees and will still prevent roll in many cases. Also, the fronts, being in the same track as the rears, will often break open the gopher homes before the rears get there. I own a trike and one thing for sure, it is not a tractor for inexperienced operators. Trikes were more effective than wide fronts for cultivating for three reasons: better visibility, tighter turning radius, and better crop clearance. Also, lacking hydraulic power they were quite a bit easier to steer. Even with these advantages, safety concerns halted thier manufacture 40 years ago (it had little to do with snow and ice getting stuck between the front wheels, who cultivates in the winter?). Heck, even the 3 wheeled ATV suffered the same fate 20 years ago. Good thing we have a bunch of lawyers looking out for us.

Have you ever visited a farm??????????? The tractor was used for about every thing except going to town on saturday evening. They are used year round in all kinds of weather. Mud snow and ice packing between the front tires had a lot to do with the end of narrow front ends.
I also own two tractors with narrow front ends, 22 MH and a 44 MH. We farmed 320 acres of rolling fields with new terraces for many years with the 44.
Take a hi clearance wide front axle tractor of the same era and jack one front tire up until the axle contacts the frame. Measure how high it raised. Now jack one rear wheel up to the same hight and see how stable the tractor is now ( if it is not already laying on it's side.