My wife is divorcing me over coyotes

[Bob_Skurka]

I've got to suggest that sometimes human interfearance causes the problems that we now have to deal with. Regardless of human sprawl out to the suburbs and beyond, and regardless of if we like superfarms, or any of the other things, here we are with a problem.

So how do we deal with a problem that 10,000 homes and 3 or 4 decades handed us? And how do we deal with the fact that we humans, over the past 10 decades, have often culled the predators out of the food chain that would have controlled the coyotes? Where I live the coyote is currently the top of the food chain save for man. We historically had bears and wolves here, but those have been gone for 100 years. So now it is humans and coyotes. And while neither they, nor I, are solely responsible for the problem, they and I have to resolve it. So given the choice, I have to side with protecting the human family.

If the pack is too large, it must be culled back. I'd prefer that it magically happen, or that nature resolve it, but often it falls to humans to 'fix' things. Its not much different than the deer herds that are at record sizes in many areas, the wolves or coyotes feast, in their absense the deer overpopulate and starve and/or they traffic gets them. But one way or another, the deer must go.

We screwed with nature, now we are stuck with problems. We sometimes have to screw around some more with nature to get things into some sort of pseudo balance.

 

[bugstruck]

Bob,

That pretty much sums it up. Once you alter the state of nature you have to take the responsibility to do the best you can from there forward.

What concerns me is when people who aren't terribly familiar with natural want to alter it because it doesn't go with thier concept of nature. Big skys, fresh air, few neighbors are good for many of us, but we don't have a right to move wild (natural) creatures off because they may be a little dangerous. Real nature isnt' as safe as we want or think once they land in the middle of it. So areas that are reasonably in balance with wildlife should be left alone and not culled of wildlife to suite someone's idea of what is safe. If it's out of control and balance as the original poster's area could be, then I'm all for some corrections. But not necessarily for the same reasons he is. Not just because things aren't "suburban safe". He, the misses, and his children became instantly more knowledgable in the rules of nature, albeit unbalanced nature, and that's not such a terrible thing. Scary though. No amount of dead coyotes will make his children safe. Safer, maybe, but not safe. I wonder how many children were attacked or killed last year? How many from Coyotes? Now humans, they are a huge threat to children. You see where this goes...... One more step and we'll be culling us. Yeah, we do try with the prisons but the threat is still substantial, stacked against coyotes anyhow.

Can you tell I'm not overly worried about safety? The danger we all try so hard to avoid can teach us quite a lot. So seek out a bit with measured restraint, you may be pleased the results, once it's over. No, I wouldn't reccommend stepping in front of a moving car....

I went through something about 5 years ago that was incredibly dangerous in my perception. But looking back, it wasn't nearly as dangerous as I thought at the time, I was overreacting. So I speak with some stupidity , I mean knowledge of danger and the anxiety it brings. I can't help much from here with the coyote issue but perhaps slightly with the other?

 

[Tom_H]

Jim, Bob, and Bugstruck,

All of you make some excellent points. I have been very impressed with the way in which there have been some very differing views in this thread, and yet the discussion has remained very civil and polite. I wish more of the discussions that go on in our nation could be like that: well reasoned and civil, even though the participants disagree.

It is true. Once we throw ecosystems out of balance, then we do sometimes need to take steps to bring back a pseudo balance. My own local coyote pack doesn't bother any humans and controls rodents. I do see the valid concern others have with monster packs contaminated with genes of feral dogs. I don't think most would accept bringing bears and wolves back to the edges of cities to restore balance.

I don't want to rile up any ranchers who may live adjacent to Yellowstone, however wildlife biologists in the park say that the reintroduction of wolves there has brought the ecosystem back to a much greater health. The wolves have brought down an overpopulation of coyotes, and populations of everything all the way down the food chain seems to be more balanced.

Thanks to all for an excellent discussion.

 

[Taylortractornut]

Im against poisoning myself. And snares arent really a favorite either as they both indiscriminately kill. I have been on both sides of the fence to. I raised 3 orphaned coyotes I caught in a den at work, but made sure they werent maid to pets and they live in a 300 acre fox pen. The thing I hated was a snare may catch a domesticated dog and hold it for the coyotes. And poison wll usually kill everything but the coyotes. Most are super leary of new things in their territory. To keep them out of the watermelons here we put contractors ribbon 3 feet off the ground around it and they wont cross it. Iwhen they get too thick here we shot one around thier borders and they will stay out of that area if we can let them lay.

 

[JimMorrissey]

There is little to no evidence that Coyotes successfully breed with dogs. The term "coydog" is used, but HIGHLY unlikely in the wild. It may have occured in a lab or some breeding grounds, but Coyotes will not sucessfully raise the offspring. It does not happen in the wild.

Reason: Male Coyotes diligently care for their own young and are a key reason for their success and survival. Male dogs have nothing to do with pup rearing. The female coyote can not and does not raise young on their own.

 

[Bob_Skurka]

There is little to no evidence that Coyotes successfully breed with dogs. The term "coydog" is used, but HIGHLY unlikely in the wild.

Jim, coydogs do exist but they are rare. They breeding cycles of coyotes are specific and based on the seasons, breeding cycles for domesticated dogs are different and consequently it is a rare occurance. I'm not totally agreeing or disagreeing with you, but from what I recall from looking at the biology of the breeds, the likelyhood of a 2nd generation of mixed blood is essentially nil and the likelyhood of a 1st generation is pretty small but still possible. I forget all the nuances of their cycles, but that is another reason why dog-coyote interbreeding is exceedingly rare.

 

[gsganzer]

shot one around thier borders and they will stay out of that area if we can let them lay.

Ranchers typically take the dead coyotes and hang them along the fence posts to ward off other coyotes.

 

[bugstruck]

Jim, Bob, and Bugstruck,

I have been very impressed with the way in which there have been some very differing views in this thread, and yet the discussion has remained very civil and polite. I wish more of the discussions that go on in our nation could be like that: well reasoned and civil, even though the participants disagree.

I'll second that. If I could grade the discourse of this thread....A+. Impressively solid bunch IMO too.

Ok, now we've jinxed it......

 

[Bob_Skurka]

I'll second that. If I could grade the discourse of this thread....A+. Impressively solid bunch IMO too.

Ok, now we've jinxed it......

No need to argue. We are discussing COYOTES not KIOTIS

 

[plumboy]

Jim, coydogs do exist but they are rare. They breeding cycles of coyotes are specific and based on the seasons, breeding cycles for domesticated dogs are different and consequently it is a rare occurance. I'm not totally agreeing or disagreeing with you, but from what I recall from looking at the biology of the breeds, the likelyhood of a 2nd generation of mixed blood is essentially nil and the likelyhood of a 1st generation is pretty small but still possible. I forget all the nuances of their cycles, but that is another reason why dog-coyote interbreeding is exceedingly rare.

The way I understood the coy dog thing is a stray female dog in heat gets knocked up by a male coyote.She raises the pups.They are now wild dogs,not in a pack.Just wild dogs.But second and third generation wild dogs themselves are enough for me to carry a pistol in the woods.Nothing like seeing a rot or pit mix running the farm.