NX4510 HSTC Pricing

[countrybumpkin]

For me I'll keep hydrostatic for my lawn mower, and geared shuttle for my tractors, but that's me!!

I will say the HST is just about to take over the CUT market , so that should tell people just how popular they are with most users.

Congratulations on your purchase , I'm sure you'll love the new tractor, I haven't got to use mine yet.

Only had it three months and put 20 min on it. Been to busy with other things , and adding accessories so it's ready to go when I am.

 

[holeycow]

Go try one before you make your comments... Then you might have something useful to contribute. Besides, we're not talking about industrial wheel loaders, we're talking about compact tractors.

I've owned mechanical shuttle and HST, and I've used PowerShuttle. Gear transmissions belong in farm tractors & up ... In my opinion, there is little room for non HST transmissions in modern compact tractors. Except for the few folks that actually primarily "farm" with a compact tractor (in which case a gear trans excels over HST for constant ground engaging work) ... HST is an easier, safer, and likely more reliable option for compact tractors.

Here's something useful to contibute: for those of us that have been driving clutches in EVERYTHING we own for many years we may not understand any reason for an automatic. In fact some of us have a harder time driving an auto than a clutch. For real.

 

[RockyNY]

Well I had the Mahindra power shuttle for 3 years, before that I didn't own a tractor, but drove gear tractors for years. My first car was a standard. Anyhow, after 3 years I decided that hydrostatic was the way to go for what I am using the tractor for. It's a convenience/ease of use factor, not a requirement. I found that even with a power shuttle, starting out or making minute adjustments with an unstable load on forks can be difficult to do without slipping the clutch excessively. Plus, when plowing or blowing snow, you have access to a broader speed range without shifting gears.
That being said, if you're happy with gear, by all means continue on with a gear tractor. No need to deride someone else's choice of transmission, especially if you've never used one. You might not know what you're missing out on!

 

[GManBart]

Well I had the Mahindra power shuttle for 3 years, before that I didn't own a tractor, but drove gear tractors for years. My first car was a standard. Anyhow, after 3 years I decided that hydrostatic was the way to go for what I am using the tractor for. It's a convenience/ease of use factor, not a requirement. I found that even with a power shuttle, starting out or making minute adjustments with an unstable load on forks can be difficult to do without slipping the clutch excessively. Plus, when plowing or blowing snow, you have access to a broader speed range without shifting gears.
That being said, if you're happy with gear, by all means continue on with a gear tractor. No need to deride someone else's choice of transmission, especially if you've never used one. You might not know what you're missing out on!

No argument from me...I have, or have owned straight gear, power shuttle and HST and all have their place.

I will note that some power shuttles don't have a clutch pedal. I'm not sure if that's mostly on larger machines, or not, but my Case backhoe is a power shuttle with no clutch pedal. It has clutch buttons on the loader, and on the shifter, but the only time you need/use them is changing gears while moving, or if you want to rev the engine to speed loader operation when you're not moving. That makes it a bit easier to start out smoothly with something on the FEL...hold the brake pedal down, then flip the shuttle for the direction you want to go, and ease off the brakes. It's still probably not quite as smooth as an HST setup, but seems pretty close once you're used to it.

 

[RockyNY]

No argument from me...I have, or have owned straight gear, power shuttle and HST and all have their place.

I will note that some power shuttles don't have a clutch pedal. I'm not sure if that's mostly on larger machines, or not, but my Case backhoe is a power shuttle with no clutch pedal. It has clutch buttons on the loader, and on the shifter, but the only time you need/use them is changing gears while moving, or if you want to rev the engine to speed loader operation when you're not moving. That makes it a bit easier to start out smoothly with something on the FEL...hold the brake pedal down, then flip the shuttle for the direction you want to go, and ease off the brakes. It's still probably not quite as smooth as an HST setup, but seems pretty close once you're used to it.

Interesting, I never thought of/tried the brake method.

 

[holeycow]

Interesting, I never thought of/tried the brake method.

huh. I never thought of not using the "brake method". That is, after I tried it once or twice and realized that coming to a complete stop ensures a smooth transition.

 

[TJP89]

Interesting, I never thought of/tried the brake method.

It does require the brakes to hold the tractor while in gear, something neither of my tractors will do. When I first bought the H, I stupidly positioned in my barn so I needed to back up and turn, repeat, to get it out. The first time I tried that I put in 1st, at idle, came off the clutch a little to quick, and instinctively hit the brakes instead on the clutch. At the end of a rather intense 5 seconds I found myself on a stalled tractor imbedded in the work bench, with both clutch and brakes depressed. Luckily no major damage ensued, just to my pride, but I have decided then and there that A, I needed more practice, and B, this was never going to work long term. And on both tractors I have driven off many times with the parking brake on. My point here is I would never trust the brakes to hold back the tractor. The only time I use the brakes on either tractor is when I need the parking brake, or I'm making a sharp turn on the H. May be different on other tractors, but that's my feelings.

I have driven HST, the straight manual of the H, and my neighbor's power shuttle JD. I can get a pretty good creep and positioning with gear, but I could never put an implement to the exact millimeter of where I want it without HST.

 

[RockyNY]

huh. I never thought of not using the "brake method". That is, after I tried it once or twice and realized that coming to a complete stop ensures a smooth transition.

You do realize we were talking about using the brakes for a smooth start, not stop?

 

[gladehound]

Comparing otherwise like machines... I prefer gear tractors with shuttle reversers mostly because I like to drive. I enjoy blipping the throttle, double clutching and the feeling of that direct connection to the engine. I also find the mushiness of HST to be unsatisfying.

However, I totally understand the HST crowd. I'll be the first to admit that precission loader work is easier and slightly faster with HST even for experience gear rowers and a lot faster for those who grew up on auto everything. For non-precise loader work I find there to be no difference power reverser vs HST. If HST tractors could be bought as economically as a power reverser I'd by an HST, because then my girls could more easily learn to work the tractor. And if I were running my tractor commercially, I'd pay the premium for HST because it simply is more effective for many tasks and time is money. If I had employees I'd definitely get HST since they'd likely destroy a clutch in short order!

However, there is another side to it. You can get a much larger, heavier and more powerful power reverser for the price of a smaller, lighter less powerful HST. With a bigger bucket, more lift, more weight - there are many loader task that a larger power reverser will do faster than a smaller but same price HST. For anyone who doesn't mind gears, this is a fact that simply can't be ignored. Case in point, my DS4510HS was $19,100 with loader before add ons. I'd have to drop a frame size to get an HST for that price. 2 frame sizes if the HST is John Deere!

Why NX not RX you ask? For me I'd take an RX over an NX all day long (as long as it was only me driving it!). But I totally understand why most would prefer the NX.

 

[holeycow]

You do realize we were talking about using the brakes for a smooth start, not stop?

yes I do.

 

[holeycow]

Comparing otherwise like machines... I prefer gear tractors with shuttle reversers mostly because I like to drive. I enjoy blipping the throttle, double clutching and the feeling of that direct connection to the engine. I also find the mushiness of HST to be unsatisfying.

However, there is another side to it. You can get a much larger, heavier and more powerful power reverser for the price of a smaller, lighter less powerful HST. With a bigger bucket, more lift, more weight - there are many loader task that a larger power reverser will do faster than a smaller but same price HST.

Why NX not RX you ask? For me I'd take an RX over an NX all day long (as long as it was only me driving it!).

Excuse my hack of your post please, but you have addressed the topic well. I have highlighted my feelings out of your post. I have gained an understanding now. Thank you.

 

[ksbrdmkr]

I like both the shuttle shift on my NH TN55 and the HST on the DK 45 but many jobs the HST is much better, like today when tree shearing. Being able to jog back and forth, ease very slow and still have the rpm up enough for proper hyd flow without burning the clutch.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

I need to try it I guess. Though I have no trouble whatsoever putting my loaders within a mm of where I want them. With a clutch and gears. Quickly. Precisely. Hmm mm.

Neither do I, and yet gears stink because HST is easier, faster, and more precise. Moreover, HST is less jarring allowing old bones the ability to work all day without pain.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

Very little. I have been driving stuff with a clutch for a long time though. How many large loader tractors are available with hydrostatic tranny's I wonder? Is wanting an hst simply a matter of skill set, or is it really somehow better than say, a no - clutch reverser.

Except with a power reverser transmission you'll still use the clutch going from forward to reverse unless you're in a gear so low that you aren't getting anything done and have nothing to do and all day to do it.

 

[DK35vince]

Neither do I, and yet gears stink because HST is easier, faster, and more precise. Moreover, HST is less jarring allowing old bones the ability to work all day without pain.

HST is easier, but it costs more and sucks power.

 

[RockyNY]

HST is easier, but it costs more and sucks power.

That's right, well I guess it's a good thing I bought a 60hp (gross) when I originally went shopping for a 45hp. And it will be doing the same work that I'm currently doing with a 40hp. lol.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

HST is easier, but it costs more and sucks power.

Yeah? Use a gear tractor with a power rake, rotary cutter, snow blower, or any PTO driven attachment that can go to max load in an instant using a gear tractor and then try it out using an HST. You'll find the HST handles the load better than the gear tractor and then so with less power and drama. For reference, I think the HST robs a whooping 3 hp of PTO power over the now apparently discontinued gear version of my 60hp tractor. Shucks, I have 48.3 PTO hp instead of 51 PTO hp, a 5.5% loss. Oh, the shame! Oh, the terrible weight of the shame of my inefficient hydrostatic!

Wait, I bet I'm more than 5% faster operating the HST machine!

I am redeemed! :laughing:

 

[DK35vince]

Yeah? Use a gear tractor with a power rake, rotary cutter, snow blower, or any PTO driven attachment that can go to max load in an instant using a gear tractor and then try it out using an HST. You'll find the HST handles the load better than the gear tractor and then so with less power and drama.

Guess I better sell my snow blower, 6' rotary cutter, 7' rear finish mower, and 6' tiller I've been running with no problem on my 34 HP gear drive tractor for the past 13 years.
Apparently there's to much drama

 

[murphy1244]

Guess I better sell my snow blower, 6' rotary cutter, 7' rear finish mower, and 6' tiller I've been running with no problem on my 34 HP gear drive tractor for the past 13 years.
Apparently there's to much drama

Dibs on the finish mower..

 

[MinnesotaEric]

Guess I better sell my snow blower, 6' rotary cutter, 7' rear finish mower, and 6' tiller I've been running with no problem on my 34 HP gear drive tractor for the past 13 years.
Apparently there's to much drama

Imagine your 34 hp tractor with even more HST goodness power!