Old Troy Bilt need service advice.

[Rustyiron]

I've got an old Troy Bilt Horse and have decided that it deserves a good servicing. I bought it, used from an estate, prolly 12 or better years ago. I have only used it literally 3 or 4 times because I usually use the tractor tiller.
Well now I have scaled down the garden size and want to take care of the 'ol girl, I've only ever changed the engine oil. I drained the gearbox oil and figured that it takes 90 wt. ( I don't have a manual) but what drained out looks like maybe 140 wt. gear oil. It's prolly not that critical, just hate to do things wrong if I can avoid it. The second thing is the rear housing for the tiller drive (shaft) and gearbox, I don't see a drain anywhere. It has the 1/2" sq filler plug with an attached dipstick (it reads full) but for another quart or so I'd have ALL new oil(s) in the whole unit. Do I loosen the 2 bolts that attach it io the rest of the machine and just turn it up to drain? I was woried that if I did that I might booger up a gasket or seal between the 2 parts and I really don't want to chase down any more parts. It is (I think) pretty old, the S/N is hand stamped into the casting and on the casting that supports the handles, Garden Way is cast into it. Thanks for any help.

 

[looknlearn]

Here is the manual for the Troybuilt tillers. (Troybuilt Manual)It may take a while to download depending on your connection. It looks just like the manual we have for ours. It has service info after the operation instructions. The transmission can take either 90 wt or 140 wt oil accord to the manual.

I think there were two different designs where one had one belt and four speeds(move the belt to get two of them) and one had two belts thus having two speeds. Not sure on that.


Taking off the rear tiller section with those two bolts doesn't drain the oil. The tractor part and tiller part are two different units. Troybuilt used to have a trailer, generator, wood splitter... not sure if that was all, anyway they bolted up the the rear of the Troybuilt and ran off the pto. The newer manuals don't seem to show the extra attachments but our older manual does. Great machines but a little slow for pulling a trailer unless you aren't going anywhere in a hurry.

Here is ours working pulling a trailer for picking rocks( easier than getting on and off the tractor)Troybuilt

 

[heehaw]

make sure you read the part in the manual about how to check the oil in the tail section..its not just a matter of using the dip stick: you have to raise the tail section about 4.5 inches, let it set for a couple hours, then check with the dip stick...etc etc..anyway, its not just a matter of pulling the dipstick out an seeing if theres enough oil...
heehaw

 

[Rustyiron]

Thanks guys, I think I'm all set!

 

[bilrus61]

No your not all set. The gears in the troy bilts are brass/bronze. You can't use a milti viscosoty gear on in them as it corrodes the brass gears. It is VERY difficult to find gear oil these days that is compatable with the gears in a troy built. I hope you have saved that older gear oil cause the best thing to do is strain it through something and put it BACK in the tiller unless you can find some straight viscosoty gear oil for it.

 

[Rustyiron]

Whoa, I'm glad I checked back in here (bilrus61) . So are you saying that as long as my new gear oil is "straight" 90wt I'm ok? I do still have the orig. oil (it's still draining overnight) but it looked really different from any other oil that I've seen. A caramel color that did not look like it had water in it. Very very thick, it "slumped" up in to about a 3/4 inch "pile" as it drained out. I think it would take hours to strain it unless i warmed it up a bunch. I have not paid too much attention when getting gear oil lately, is it hard to find a "straight" grade?

 

[Tnbilly]

I can't speak to the later Horses but the earlier ones specified 140w gl2 for all but cold weather where 90w was all right. It should not be too hard to find, I just picked up a couple gallons at the NAPA store. Not all of them probably carry it, I had to go to the one all the way across the county. BTW you want mostly to not use any gear oil unless it specifically says it's safe with bronze/copper alloys. Most GL5 formulations are suspect. As the tiller is basically a big worm gear and needs the thicker fluid That was the reason I searched out the 140w for mine. I mistakenly put 75/90 in mine last year.

 

[looknlearn]

No your not all set. The gears in the troy bilts are brass/bronze. You can't use a milti viscosoty gear on in them as it corrodes the brass gears. It is VERY difficult to find gear oil these days that is compatable with the gears in a troy built. I hope you have saved that older gear oil cause the best thing to do is strain it through something and put it BACK in the tiller unless you can find some straight viscosoty gear oil for it.

I have been putting 80-90wt oil in the gear case. How do you go about find straight 90wt or 140wt? Auto Zone doesn't seem to carry it.



EDIT: I found it at NAPA, part number: SL24238. (140 wt GL4)

 

[sixdogs]

Also, I was told by Troybilt that any synthetic gear oil is OK as well.
I used GL1 ? at NAPA but notice my TSC now sells it as well.

 

[bilrus61]

Since yours is the older Garden Way made in Troy NY it should have the "yellow" gears in it. I don't have any experiance with the newer MTD made tillers. Garden Way was always saying not to use a multi-viscosity gear oil and to use a straight weight oil. I've no idea is the multi grade synthetics are ok for brass/bronze gears or not but if you called MDT they may be thinking you have one of their tillers and not the older Garden Way one with the yellow metal gears. To play it safe I would try to find a straight weight gear oil and put in it.

 

[2manyrocks]

My understanding is it is not the weight of the oil, but the service grade (GL1, etc) that determines if it is safe for use with bronze parts. There was a thread on this a while back and some of the guys were saying the newer formulas are safe for bronze gears....but you need to specifically check.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/oil-fuel-lubricants/145754-gl4-gl5-gear-lube-bronze.html

My local oil jobber stocks the older gear old without the additives that cause all the problems with bronze parts. You may not find it at your local box store.

 

[sixdogs]

My understanding is it is not the weight of the oil, but the service grade (GL1, etc) that determines if it is safe for use with bronze parts. There was a thread on this a while back and some of the guys were saying the newer formulas are safe for bronze gears....but you need to specifically check.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/oil-fuel-lubricants/145754-gl4-gl5-gear-lube-bronze.html

My local oil jobber stocks the older gear old without the additives that cause all the problems with bronze parts. You may not find it at your local box store.

Good point. Unless the oil container specifically addressed the bronze gear issue, get GL1 at a NAPA or TSC and call it good. $10 ? a gallon.
These gears are not in any great strain and a basic oil is all that is needed.
The viscosity is really only an issue to ease starting in real cold weather or to deal with extreme tilling in extreme hot weather.
I can't recall what my GL1 "mineral oil" from NAPA was but I think just 90W.
We have used these tillers for decades and one thing you do not want to do is pull it apart to replace bushings. Although if you do it once, it's much easier the second time.

 

[heehaw]

my manual says gear oil must have an API rating of GL-4 only, for full oil replacement: small top-offs can use GL-3, GL-4, or GL-5:
heehaw

 

[2manyrocks]

Which year manual do you have?

I have the 3rd edition manual that came with my mine in 1982. It says there are bronze worm gears in the transmission, and to use only 90 or 140 SAE gear oil, but I can't find a specification for the oil. It does say not to use automotive type gear oils as they are too light.

 

[heehaw]

about a 82 model, i have looked everywhere in town, an cannot find 140weight in GL-4...can find 90 weight in GL4 and GL5....an thats only at one auto parts store...i wish i knew what the difference in 4 an 5 are??? 5 is everywhere....
heehaw