opinions on TOYOTA TUNDRA for my towing needs

[john_bud]

Bob,

Nice thing about diesels is that they only add the fuel you ask for. Lighten up the right foot, slow down and you can get more economy. Of course there are issues...

The emissions deal is a real econ killer. They should be able to up the milage, but that would heat up the mixture - must use EGR to cool it off. That gets particles produced - must use a regenerative filter. Filter gets clogged, they must DUMP fuel to heat the filter up to burn off the particles. Sulfer is bad, must drop the 500 ppm to 10 ppm S. That raises the cost of the fuel, decreases the energy content, decreases the economy, decreases lubricity and decreases fuel system reliability. (thanks EPA!)

Sigh. Oh well, I can still get 21 on the highway. But I used to be able to get 23.5 with the old fuel.

 

[Bob_Young]

What scares me, John, is that we've placed the whole problem in the hands of academics who can give a thousand technical reasons for why a common sense approach won't work....And, because they have better command of the tech vocabulary than anyone else, there will be no debate.

I have to wonder whether burning more fuel to run somewhat cleaner is an overall gain for the environment. Looking at the system wide impact of higher fuel usage for X miles traveled would require taking into account the increased energy (and emissions) required to refine and transport the extra fuel; not to mention the extra crude usage and CO2 creation that goes with the higher consumption (poorer mileage). I've seen no indication that such considerations ever enter the analysis.
Bob

 

[schmism]

Ill be getting a early 2000's Tundra (first gen) by years end.

Double cab, with color matched topper.

Will pull duty as tow vehical for trailer with tractor,
double cab to move the wife and dogs, with camping gear and popup in tow.
Daily driver to town (5 miles away) for 9-5 job


I relize ill pay 1.5-2 twice as much vs a F-150 or simular. But in my book it will be worth it. Ill likely to upgrade to a new 2007 Tundra in a few years. I may hold onto it long enough to see if Toyota rolls out a 3/4-1 ton thats rummored. (with big block diesel/hybrid)

 

[KICK]

Bob,

Nice thing about diesels is that they only add the fuel you ask for. Lighten up the right foot, slow down and you can get more economy. Of course there are issues...

The emissions deal is a real econ killer. They should be able to up the milage, but that would heat up the mixture - must use EGR to cool it off. That gets particles produced - must use a regenerative filter. Filter gets clogged, they must DUMP fuel to heat the filter up to burn off the particles. Sulfer is bad, must drop the 500 ppm to 10 ppm SQUOTE]


EGr stinks on Diesels but they haven't found a way around it. I have been dealing with EGR and the resultant problems on 2 brands of diesels since 2000.

lube oil gets dirtier and has a tendency to sludge.

failures of the catalytic muffler

more complex controls can be problematic

turbo is more intricate and prone to failure

If'n I was in the market for a pickup, I 'd seriously consider a gasser over a Diesel, don't care what brand we are talking about.

 

[cp1969]

Bob,

Nice thing about diesels is that they only add the fuel you ask for. Lighten up the right foot, slow down and you can get more economy. Of course there are issues...

The emissions deal is a real econ killer. They should be able to up the milage, but that would heat up the mixture - must use EGR to cool it off. That gets particles produced - must use a regenerative filter. Filter gets clogged, they must DUMP fuel to heat the filter up to burn off the particles. Sulfer is bad, must drop the 500 ppm to 10 ppm SQUOTE]


EGr stinks on Diesels but they haven't found a way around it. I have been dealing with EGR and the resultant problems on 2 brands of diesels since 2000.

lube oil gets dirtier and has a tendency to sludge.

failures of the catalytic muffler

more complex controls can be problematic

turbo is more intricate and prone to failure

If'n I was in the market for a pickup, I 'd seriously consider a gasser over a Diesel, don't care what brand we are talking about.

My gut tells me the bloom may be off the rose for diesel pickups. I own one and it has been an excellent truck, but fuel was $1.30 when I bought it. It now is pushing $3.00 and is perpetually 30 to 40 cents a gallon higher than unleaded, thanks to the EPA and oil market speculators who drive the price up a quarter if a cow pees on a flat rock.

I am tempted to get rid of it while there is still a decent market for used diesels.

 

[gemini5362]

My gut tells me the bloom may be off the rose for diesel pickups. I own one and it has been an excellent truck, but fuel was $1.30 when I bought it. It now is pushing $3.00 and is perpetually 30 to 40 cents a gallon higher than unleaded, thanks to the EPA and oil market speculators who drive the price up a quarter if a cow pees on a flat rock.

I am tempted to get rid of it while there is still a decent market for used diesels.

I get an easy 16 to 17 miles per gallon on my 3/4 ton 4 wheel drive diesel no matter how I drive it. I can see me getting 9 or ten miles to the gallon with the same truck in a gas version the extra 30 or 40 cents per gallon is made up with the extra mileage. The extra price of buying the diesel is hopefully going to be made up in the better torque of the diesel engine and the longevity of diesel engines.

 

[Bob_Young]

If I understand this thread, in a 3/4 ton or heavier, diesel may make sense for towing if the truck is racking up lotsa miles either as a tow vehicle or as a daily driver that may be running empty much of the time.

If NOT a daily driver and only used for occasional heavy towing or hauling, then gas makes the most sense. This would be the case for the guy who does his daily commuting/grocery getting in a Neon or Civic using the truck as his weekend War Wagon.

I always thought the V10 gassers would be impossible gas hogs but, considered this way, I can see they make sense. It seems like the best possible buy for the occasional tower would be a low mileage used V10.

The cost difference between a new diesel and a used V10 might almost pay for the Neon.
Bob