organic farming

[Duffster]

One of my pet peeves, at least locally, is that folks don't understand the difference between "Organic Farming" and "zero input farming" which is how a lot of the uninformed go about farming organically. A successful organic operation has significantly higher input costs than a conventional operation producing the same crops on the same scale. Organic farmers need premium prices for their products to offset those higher input costs.

Can you expalin that? Just wondering what that means.

 

[smstonypoint]

Can you expalin that? Just wondering what that means.

Zero input farming is a new one on me too. In ECON 101 we learn about land, labor, capital, and management as being the inputs into a production process. So we can produce something of value without any of these inputs? Sign me up.

Steve

 

[schmism]

The large garden the wife and I tend we try to shoot for organic....

We use natural fertilizers... (horse/cow poo, chicken poo etc)

We hand weed and mechanical weed.

The hardest part is dealing with insect control. cabbage worms (the caterpillar version of the White butterfly you always see in the garden) are the worst to deal with. make a mess of cabbage and broccoli.

The second most difficult thing to manage is squash bugs. They really did our cukes in this year. Attacked our zucchini hard but not before we got 2 dozen forearm sized zuks off the plants.

So when i HAVE to i spray seven for cabbage worms and squash bugs (paying attention to get the spray on the BOTTOM of the plants)

We had a bad bout of blossom rot on our first set of Tom's this year due to environmental issues, (no action taken) but i usually do spray a Copper based fungicide early in the spring due to our wet weather we usually have which tends to mitigate any further blight issues.

Is it truely organic? no. is it brod application of lots of chemicals... no. I spot treat with a properly mixed chemical for a specific problem keeping in mind blossom times and harvest times.

I personally think you can get 200% better yields with 95% the same goals as true "organic" farming.

 

[RickB]

Can you expalin that? Just wondering what that means.

"Zero input farming" is my term. It refers to the cultivation of a crop relying solely on the nutrients readily available from within the soil structure without regard to replenishing those nutrients via either conventional or organic methods, depending on the business model. Zero input farming works well in the short term, but is equivalent to 'soil mining' in that when the first required macro- or micro- element is depleted to the point where crop yield and health are affected, things start going south.

A prime example of this is a fairly local to me fledgling biofuel pelleting enterprise. The business model is crafted around the harvesting of uncultivated former row crop fields that are overrun with broadleaf weeds, most notably goldenrod. The premise is that X number of pounds of biomass per acre can be removed using conventional haying equipment year after year without liming, fertilizing, or providing any other inputs. This failed logic ignores the fact that the current situation allows the weeds to thrive because nothing is removed; all plant matter decomposes back into the earth along with an enormous seed supply, replenishing those nutrients taken up by growing plants and providing the means for annual re-seeding. The entrepreneurs are basically looking for a free lunch. About the third year they go back to the same fields (if they get that far) the free lunch will be a snack.

 

[flyingcow]

If you don't own the land, i'd be real careful about putting anytime or money into it. I've seen a few times where renters will spend money getting fields ready for quality crops, than owner sells property. Even with contracts, still might loose all input costs.

 

[bp fick]

The large garden the wife and I tend we try to shoot for organic....

We use natural fertilizers... (horse/cow poo, chicken poo etc)

We hand weed and mechanical weed.

The hardest part is dealing with insect control. cabbage worms (the caterpillar version of the White butterfly you always see in the garden) are the worst to deal with. make a mess of cabbage and broccoli.

The second most difficult thing to manage is squash bugs. They really did our cukes in this year. Attacked our zucchini hard but not before we got 2 dozen forearm sized zuks off the plants.

So when i HAVE to i spray seven for cabbage worms and squash bugs (paying attention to get the spray on the BOTTOM of the plants)

We had a bad bout of blossom rot on our first set of Tom's this year due to environmental issues, (no action taken) but i usually do spray a Copper based fungicide early in the spring due to our wet weather we usually have which tends to mitigate any further blight issues.

Is it truely organic? no. is it brod application of lots of chemicals... no. I spot treat with a properly mixed chemical for a specific problem keeping in mind blossom times and harvest times.

I personally think you can get 200% better yields with 95% the same goals as true "organic" farming.

schmism, you are to congratulated for moving in the direction you are going.
After a life time of traditional market gardening, I am now in my second year of organic approach. This has been one of the most challenging things I have ever attempted, but must say, also one of the most rewarding.

I often say that step one is natural fertilizers. Next is no herbicides. These two beginning steps don't seem to over tax most would-be organic gardeners. The pest control is by far the most complex, in my experience, it required my "re-learning" and adopting procedures previously unknown to me. Now in my second year with zero pesticides, I can only say that what I never believed possible, is indeed possible. Frankly, I still feel like a second grader on the learning curve, but it is so rewarding in so many ways.

 

[deere755]

I see there is a lot of good advice as usual on this sight. I have been away from the computer for a few days as we had a bad storm go thru here Monday afternoon.That is another thread though. She has talked about organic asparagas. As far as the field I farm next to it, it is seperated by 40 to 50 foot of grass and a row of pine trees. The next field is across the road. She has some contacts as she sells wine to resturants all over the state including Chicago. I will have to do a lot of research on this subject. I will only be interested as long as I can continue farming the rest of my land the way I do now. I would need a contract for several years with her. I sort of get paid for mowing her pasture. I store equipment in her pole barn for mowing her pasture and roadsides. I approached her a few years back about renting her pole barn and she said she would like for me to do some mowing instead of paying her money.