Tiller Picking a King Kutter tiller

[Blueflint]

Time to retire my Caroni FL1400 tiller (produce and seed farm, really put thru the paces) and I have decided on a King Kutter for the replacement. I am torn between the King Kutter II and the King Kutter Professional. I am looking at both in a 6' model. Both share a lot of the same parts, both seem well made and much heavier built than my Caroni. Unfortunately I have not been able to see these two side by side but I have inspected both of them in person (different retailers). I see the KKII could possibly hold water on it's top side and this will be stored out doors (no room in the barn). I will not be using a quick hitch so that benefit on the Pro does not apply to me. I can get the KKII for $1,600 and the KK Pro for $1,850. So, is the KK Pro worth the extra $ and if so, why?

Thanks guys. Tony

 

[2458n]

Is the King Kutter chain driven? It seems to me some had a gear driven sticker on them. Just from the marketing approach you would think the,'' PRO'' would have more than 250.00 dollars worth of extra's. Interesting to find out.

 

[Blueflint]

Both are gear drive, both use the same gear driven side box and similar (if not the same) top gear box. Lot of the same parts. Both have PTO shafts with a clutch. KKII are made here in Ohio, KK Pro is made in Alabama. I can also get the KK Pro in green paint at Rural King for $1,950.

 

[ruffdog]

I have the KK II 5' model and wow, the prices have went up. I am happy with it and never had a problem. I took the shoes off and bury it when tilling. The top would collect water as a small amount of dirt gets on top of mine. It lives a sheltered life in my shed so rust is not a issue.

 

[dpb800]

I picked up a king kutter II this winter for $200. A few hundred dollars to fix it and it has been working great.

 

[ruffdog]

After looking at both of them online, I have thought of a few things. The KK II shielding above the tines is a thinner sheet because it has the exoskeleton frame work to make it strong. I would think that the Pro sheet metal would be much thicker because it is lacking that exoskeleton. Being that you will have it stored outside, get the pro unless it kills your wallet. I made stands for mine so it sits nice in the shed and I can stand on it to reach the top of my firewood stack.

 

[bjr]

Check out the price of replacement tines for the KK and you may go back to the Caroni. I have a 6' KK and am not looking forward to buying 42 of their tines. bjr

 

[mark02tj]

This was just posted an hour ago on Dayton's CraigsList. Oxford isn't too far from you!! Could save you a few bucks.

 

[Blueflint]

Check out the price of replacement tines for the KK and you may go back to the Caroni. I have a 6' KK and am not looking forward to buying 42 of their tines. bjr

We will never go back to the Caroni, it is not up to the work we do. Constant cracking of the steel in stress areas and original welds also cracking along with having soft bolts throughout. It was an economical piece at the time... but every year, it needs structural repairs. I will say the gear box has held up well. Overall the Caroni is thin and soft. Other than an occasional new sod tilling, it only saw 95%++ previously tilled ground and rarely a rock.

KK sells complete sets of tines, the 72" (6') kit is #505054, has 54 tines, list price is $357...ouch!!! Dealers can also order these kits in and seems they are selling them close to $100 off that price.

I know a couple people that have 5' KKII and they have held up well. I know ANY piece can have problems or need some TLC at times but I also know we need something new too. In fact we are getting several new pieces this year, time to move out the high hour items before they strand us. I know the KK tillers are not "Cadillacs" but they seem pretty tough. I can find KKII 5' models pretty reasonable (under $1400) but with a 6' wide tractor, the 6' KK tiller makes sense. I also just found a KK dealer less than 14 miles from our farm and will visit them in a day or so. KK website really sucks and needs updated. Their dealer listings are missing a ton of dealers and they also make a lot of things not on their site.

mark02tj, thanks for the listing but Oxford is 90 miles away and that is only $150 less than the new ones I found at my local KK dealer.

Does anyone have the weight specs on the KK Pro 6' model? The KKII 6' is 721 pounds.

Thanks guys...any more info?

-Tony

 

[LouieJunior]

We will never go back to the Caroni, it is not up to the work we do. Constant cracking of the steel in stress areas and original welds also cracking along with having soft bolts throughout.

it is interesting you mention soft bolts! I have a brand new Caroni flail mower, and prior to using it the first time, I deformed one of the bolts when changing the roller height. My wrench slipped off and the bolt head was no-longer hex shaped.

 

[ruffdog]

I can't imagine why a person would have to replace the tines on the KK unless you are tilling a rock pile.

 

[Gary Fowler]

I have a KK II in the 72" model. The top looks tight but it drains water easily when clean. I don't know if a lot of dirt and mud would stop up the water drain but when I hosed mine off, all the water drained thru easily. The top shield plate might be a little thinner on the KKII compared to the Professional but I haven't even seen the professional model at any dealer around me.

I have lots of rocks and I have noticed that the paint is flaking off in spots where I am assuming rocks dinged it. NO DENTS that I can see but the paint is suffering a bit. If that is the only difference, I don't know if that difference is worth the extra $250. I have tilled across some pretty big rocks and so far no damage to the tiller tines.

Does anyone know if the professional is a reverse turning tiller. They seem to cost more than front rotating. THIS could also be the only difference.

 

[Baby Grand]

I can't imagine why a person would have to replace the tines on the KK unless you are tilling a rock pile.

We don't have many rocks here, ruffdog - just sandy loam & clay. After 6 years of using a 60" KK II (maybe 100 hrs total running time) the tines are starting to get worn down. The tine corners now have an almost full radius rather than the square corners they had when new - at least that's my recollection from last fall when I pressure washed it before putting it to sleep for the winter. Sand is tough on steel. At this rate I'll need another set of tines in another 6 years or so. I'd consider it money well spent if the tiller's still performing like it is today.

KK is their own worst enemy. Their website was pretty bad, then they changed it and now it's painfully bad. But they sell lots of tillers in spite of themselves, based on their reputation for building a nearly bullet proof machine. We need more companies that can do that.

 

[SteelonSteel]

Well I'd rather have them have a good product and craptastic website than the other way around. Seems a lot of companies in this world focus on the website and sales and skimp on the product/QC. Old school wins on this one.

 

[ruffdog]

Why wouldn't you just grind a new edge on the tines? That is what I have done on my cheap walk behind tiller. Sharpen them like my mower blades and it tills like butter.

 

[Daver1963]

I have a King Kutter Pro in the 4ft model. The difference I see between the Pro and the II in this size is where the three point hitch frame meets the tiller body. On the II it's welded a few inches here and a few inches there where on the Pro it's a solid weld from front to back. Also the back plate on the Pro is about 1/4 inch solid and on the II it looks like thick sheet metal.

 

[Baby Grand]

Why wouldn't you just grind a new edge on the tines? That is what I have done on my cheap walk behind tiller. Sharpen them like my mower blades and it tills like butter.

The tines sharpen themselves, more or less, so I don't have to. The wear occurs between the cutting edge and the outside edge - hard to explain in words. I have a couple spare tines in the garage & I'll take a photo of fresh and worn tines and post them this weekend so you can see what I mean. It hasn't affected performance, but I'm aware that they're wearing and know that I'll probably have to replace them before the tiller itself wears out - which is what I would expect from a well engineered product - the wear component wears out sooner that the rest of the machine and is easily (aside from cost) replaced. In ground engaging equipment I consider what ever part actually does the work on the soil to be a consumable. The tines work the soil and are getting consumed, as it should be.

 

[Ford850]

I talked to KK about the differences in the 2 tillers a few years ago before I bought my 7' tiller. They said they are identical except for the 3ph. Obviously the shape of the tiller is rounded on the pro model, but KK claimed it is the same gauge as the KKII. My soil has an occasional odd shaped baseball sized rock, and my KKII now has a few bulged creases on the flat top where the tines tried to pull a rock through the narrowing gap. I think the pro model would be less likely to do that with the rounded design. The top of mine collects dirt too, but it's not an issue since it's stored inside. If doing it over, I would probably opt for the KK Pro model.

 

[Dillier23]

Looking at the two models, I noticed that the gear box is held onto the frame with three bolts on the standard model. On the PRO model, there is a thick plate on the gear box side that helps support the gear box. I'm not sure if the PRO weighs more, websites use shipping weight over actual weight typically.

There has been posts that the standard model is not QH compatible, but mine fit just fine onto the SpeedCo QH I have.

 

[Baby Grand]

The tines sharpen themselves, more or less, so I don't have to. The wear occurs between the cutting edge and the outside edge - hard to explain in words. I have a couple spare tines in the garage & I'll take a photo of fresh and worn tines and post them this weekend so you can see what I mean. It hasn't affected performance, but I'm aware that they're wearing and know that I'll probably have to replace them before the tiller itself wears out - which is what I would expect from a well engineered product - the wear component wears out sooner that the rest of the machine and is easily (aside from cost) replaced. In ground engaging equipment I consider what ever part actually does the work on the soil to be a consumable. The tines work the soil and are getting consumed, as it should be.

Here' 2 pictures ... first is fairly new tines on our Sicma and second is the worn tines on our KKII: