Pine Trees

[thcri]

About three years ago I transplanted about 15 pine trees. They ran between 7 and 8 feet tall. The guy that moved them for me had a spade that was a tad bit small for the trees but I was able to keep them all but one died finally last year. All of the others are doing greet except one will get new growth about 5 times a year but then the new growth will die out. Now the tree is looking sick and I think I could loose it if I don't do something with it. From my measurements it has not grown 1" since it was planted where the others probably now have grown anywhere from 6" to a foot.

I have put the fertilizer spikes on it (3 of them) each year and even have sprayed the acid on the tree itself a couple of times.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.


murph

 

[Glenn9643]

Realizing that we're in very different environments Murph, and my pines are probably a different variety but we planted about 300 seedlings four years ago with a dibbler and they are about 8-10' tall now. There are some "scrubby" ones in the bunch that are about 5' but they'll catch up eventually. No water or care other than mowing between them regularly.
Sounds like the root system isn't developed enough to support the top growth maybe.

 

[EddieWalker]

I'm no help, but thought it interesting that you "want" to save your pine trees. Here in East Texas, they are worse then weeds. Needles and sap that kill off the grass. If you don't keep the grounds and pastures mowed, pines and sweat gums will take over in a few years. Just a different perspective on them.

Good luck with your trees. If you want more, come on down, I'll give you all you want to dig out. Thousands if you want. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Eddie

 

[woodchuckie]

Like Glenn said, pine trees grow, They should grow at least a foot a year , not a foot in three years. Trasnplanting a 7 foot tree is a big shock to it and would need constant watering. There is no way you could get the entire root system transplanted. I would try a smaller tree in Janurary or Feburary if you can't wait on a seedling.

 

[rozett]

Have you checked the soil pH in the area the trees were transplanted? Most pine prefer a slightly acidic soil.

Although I have no personal experience with fertilizer spikes, both a landscaper and an arborist I know both frown on their use. They prefer not to concentrate the fertilizer in a few spots, but to spread granular fertilizer around the trees at the drip line.

 

[Cityboyfarmer]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( any suggestions would be appreciated. murph )</font>

I suggest attaching a bushhog to your TC29 and running them over. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Then go to your local nursery and buy some Bradford Pear trees or dogwoods, or oaks or maples or some other beautiful, colorful trees to plant.

I look at pine trees as a crop tree. Not much use to me otherwise. We have billions of them here. But if you really like pines, just replace the sick ones with new saplings. They grow pretty fast without a lot of help.

What kind of pines are they? Here we grow primarily loblolly and slash pines. They grow like giant woody weeds, especially where you don't want them.

 

[FL_Cracker]

The only good pine on our place in Blue Ridge, GA is the one you are currently burning to stay warm while working out doors. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

In the last 4-5 years the beatles have killed almost every Yellow and several Whites on our property. I had the entire property logged 8 years ago and knowing what I know now I would of had EVERY pine on the place removed. The 100 or so pine trees we left are almost all dead and falling down. It's a weekly job to burn the one that fell over during the last windy day. /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

 

[thcri]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">(
I suggest attaching a bushhog to your TC29 and running them over. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif)</font>


The trees were my wife's idea, running them over would be like commiting suicide?? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

And here in Minnesota most people like pines. They are Blue Spruce and I paid about $95.00 each for them transplanted. If I go to a local nursery I would pay anywhere from $300 to $500 for them. So I got a good deal on them and feel lucky that I only have lost one so far in three years. Most of my neighbors got trees from the same guy at the same time and they have lost more. But I put a lot of time in them watering and etc.


murph

 

[arthr31]

blue spruce aren't pine. They are soft evergreens, and nice to look at, very nice, if growing properly. I think most people here are thinking of red and white pine which kinda grows like a weed.. I would encourage you to work with the spruce, it'll live long and give good coverage if you are trying to block an area. and, as someone has already said here, the fertilizer spikes are not good for spruce. I nearly killed an old spruce with those... so i think...

Also, the spruce will like more light, at least full light for half day to do well....and this'll depend on how they were growing before you transplanted them too (e.g. half or full light.).

Anyway, only cut a tree if you need to. Sometimes cutting a tree, or neighboring tree will help the other grow... -arthur

 

[Glenn9643]

Murph,

You might try the conifers forum at Gardenweb for some advice.

 

[sassafraspete]

Blue spruce are nice to look at. A guy local in our area told me to use dish washing soap in my water when transplanting trees. (he has transplanted trees here for years). Not sure what that does, but he swears by it.

As for your spruce.... maybe mulch it good and do a watering regiment using something like miracle grow formula made for acid loving plants...eg once a week maybe for awhile. Use a dispenser on the end of your hose. Don't know how close the tree is to a water hose.

Ok, don't know why I am trying to give advice.... I planted some spruce seedlings a few yrs back, and out of 100, the 10 I have left are just now starting to grow good. OK, take what I suggest with a grain of salt.....

sassafraspete

 

[thcri]

The fertilizer spikes that I get are for spruce. They have the high acid content. The box says for Blue Spruce unless you are still telling me the spikes are no good. I am not buying the regular spikes. I have mulch around them all including the one that looks like it is dieing. So I am going to water the living daylights out of it and see if that helps as we have gone sometime without a good rain. It's just funny this one does the new growth thing and the new growth dies. The rest of them are growing pretty good for being transplanted trees.

murph

 

[beenthere]

I would water them regularly, but not "water the living daylights' out of them. I wouldn't bother with more fertilizer until the tree shows signs that it is growing better.

I assume that you still have the tree staked, so that the wind cannot blow it around. If the wind can move the tree, then the dirtball also moves and the real fine hair roots trying to get established just break off. These hair roots get bigger and longer and eventually will hold the tree.

I like the spruce and pine, especially the white pine as it has a finer needle than the red and southern pines. Also, they are green in the winter. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[meledward23]

The dish washing soap I imagine is used a an anti-transpiration and is more applicable to moving deciduous trees in the summer. Trees pull moisture through their entire body and allow it to escape out of their stomates on the under side of the leaf. When being moved if they expell more water than they have or, if they transpire at a rate faster than they are capable of (heat, wind, etc) then the link is broken (the chain of water molecules) and cells collapse causing serious damage and many times the death of the tree.

Your Blue Spruce certainly seem a mystery on why they push new growth and then die back. But I know I have read something on this over the years. I will see what I can find.

BTW, in as a general rule here in the South in hard clay soils (Pinus Virginiana and P. Taeda) Loblolly and Virginia Pines will 9 times out of ten will perform better the smaller they are planted. Quite often we can plant one gallon, 7 gallon and 10ft. B&B Pines on a jobsite and in 5-10 years later the one gallon is often the biggest and healthiest. My point, I would consider finding some small seedlings and planting them as a back drop row to your existing pines. Just a thought.

 

[meledward23]

http://www.ipm.uiuc.edu/diseases/series600/rpd625/

This is a link to Sphaeropsis blight. It mainly affects different pines and older pines than yours, however it was the only thing I have found so far.

"The most noticeable symptom of Sphaeropsis blight is a browning, stunting, and twisting of the new shoots and needle growth (the candles) (Figure 1). Usually the lower branches of the tree are the first and most seriously affected, and sometimes infection is concentrated over a small area or on one side of a tree."

 

[arthr31]

thanks for that link. I have several pines which are suffering from that blight, so i think. poor trees!!

 

[arthr31]

murph, i talked w/ some arborist pals today about this... so.. a couple / few things: a) did you test the soil before using the fertilizer spikes? One friend (forestry arborist) said that the spikes could cause "hot" spots in the soil where it would become too acidic. But, he said, with adequate watering this would not be much of an issue. b) another friend said (park arborist) said that too much mulch, too high on the tree trunk will cause both growth and foliage problems on the tree. Both agreed that light could be an issue. For example many years ago we worked on planting many doug firs that were about 2' tall. These firs were grown in a field with full sun. We transplanted to areas which were mostly shade. Only one out of 12 made it!! EEK. What were your trees light conditions before and after?

We also talked about watering. If roots are burned, over watering may cause rot thereby increasing disease and further die-off. General recommendations included a few deep waterings with enough time to dry out (couple of days to a day), mulch away from the trunk, but form a deep ring around the tree, test the soil, and stake/support the mast of the tree if heavy winds prevail....

the multiple grow and die-back within a season is a recall from school-- we planted ash trees and would purposefully destroy tendrils to see what path the tree would take. It would usually have a number of re-growths before giving up or running out of energy for the season.. this is what you are probably seeing with the growth and die-back on your trees.

Lastly, maybe give the trees about a month of TLC thru august and then let nature run its course. If the trees are OK thru aug, they'll probably make it.

Good luck, we all need more beautiful trees! I hpe this give some additional advice or food for thought at least... -art

ps, i just remembered something pretty important for the future of transplanting trees--- it is very beneficial to prune the roots a year before transplanting. to root prune you'd walk around the tree about a few feet from the trunk and cut down with a flat spade. when you do this, you break some roots which then re-grow closer to the trunk. when you replant/transplant the tree a year later, it's root system is more robust closer to the trunk, therefore losing less vigor in being able to grown. it is possible with your trees that some left behind major root systems that it was counting on for survival...

I know that the doug firs and other evergreens send LONG shallow roots out, if they lose these, they can be comprimised... bye for now. -art /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif