Plumbing a bolt on grapple

   / Plumbing a bolt on grapple #11  
I agree with Winston, it looks like it is plumbed correctly, now that isn't saying you can't change how its done... There are other ways to plumb this set up, however you would lose function of one thing or another during the time you are using another, if that makes sense. I ran into this situation when I added PS to my 2210d with a FEL.
 
   / Plumbing a bolt on grapple
  • Thread Starter
#12  
Thank you winston1. Could you post the example link again ? Can't see it.

Thinking pressure is distributed to lift and curl and another function with same supply and return hoses? One more lever?
 
   / Plumbing a bolt on grapple #13  
I agree with Winston, it looks like it is plumbed correctly, now that isn't saying you can't change how its done... There are other ways to plumb this set up, however you would lose function of one thing or another during the time you are using another, if that makes sense. I ran into this situation when I added PS to my 2210d with a FEL.

I agree. There are several ways to divert some fluid to run a grapple cylinder. The simplest of all is if you have an unused PB (Power Beyond) port on your existing directional control valve setup. It looks like yours has it.... but it is already in use. You can theoretically daisy-chain directional control valves using the PB from one to send fluid to the next and so on....but you end up spending more money for control valves and hoses while and creating more resistance in the circuit.

I like the idea of replacing the entire directional control valve setup with one that has 3 or more levers because it is the most elegant solution. And by the time it gets installed It might be no more expensive than the rest, too. Remember that hoses cost real money. Cost on a 3 lever DCV is about the $350/400 mark at hydraulic surplus sites like Surplus Center.
If you go that way be sure to match the threads on your existing hoses, and get one with PB. You don't need much flow capacity. Your tractor is probably not flowing 10 GPM at full chat. So realize that the small pump volume of the tractor's onboard hydraulic pump is limited in how many functions it can power at once - if you are working one lever, the others will work too....but slowly.

However...think on this: The downside to swapping to the 3 lever system - or making any changes in your hydraulics flow path is that before changing anything about the flow profile you MUST be determine that if you have power steering that it has priority in flow. Usually that is via a discrete hydraulic priority valve. What that valve does is to makes sure that the steering gets it's required flow (often about 3 gpm) before sending any fluid to the rest of the system. Sometimes there is not a discrete hydraulic priority valve and instead the manufacturer has just balanced the various resistances to flow to accomplish the same thing.

Another possibility that used to be more popular on old farm equipment was to use a selectable diverter valve in one of the pressure lines. Selectable Diverter Valves are just what they sound like, they manually or electrically switch the high pressure flow from one system to another. I've even seen them installed after the directional control valve so that for instance the lever that used to curl the bucket would now work the grapple .... You would then switch back and forth. Prices range from $100 to $500 depending if they are manual or 12v. solenoid actuated. But as has been said, you only get to actuate with whichever system is selected to be getting the fluid at the moment. That's a big downside.

Another option that you might want to consider is a 12 volt electric over hydraulic motor with it's own reservoir. You can find those on Amazon. Picture below. You toggle an electric switch for forward/reverse, and the switch actuates a solenoid diverter. These complete kits are actually reasonably priced because so many of them are sold for little dump trailers and for snow plows on pickup trucks - basically anywhere you need one 2-way hydralic cylinder. They typically come with a two-way switch and their own hydraulic reservoir. The whole unit is about the size of a breadbox. If you have room for it - and a decent alternator & battery on the tractor - then it's a pretty good solution for about the same $$ and doesn't affect the tractor hydraulics.
rScotty
 

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   / Plumbing a bolt on grapple #14  
   / Plumbing a bolt on grapple #15  
rScotty,
The 12V hydraulic motor option is very interesting. It might be not only suitable for a grapple but a top link hydraulic cylinder.

I am also considering using an electric linear actuator for a grapple to replace the cylinder....

https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200520514_200520514

It will lift 1000 lbs and hold 3000Lbs. Seems much easier to mount than adding a valve and running hoses. Unlike the diverter valve option it will retain the curl function while the grapple is operating.
 
   / Plumbing a bolt on grapple #16  
rScotty,
The 12V hydraulic motor option is very interesting. It might be not only suitable for a grapple but a top link hydraulic cylinder.

I am also considering using an electric linear actuator for a grapple to replace the cylinder....

https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200520514_200520514

It will lift 1000 lbs and hold 3000Lbs. Seems much easier to mount than adding a valve and running hoses. Unlike the diverter valve option it will retain the curl function while the grapple is operating.

There's no reason why you can't feed the 12V hydraulic motor into a diverter valve (solenoid or manual) and run several different circuits. Doing that retains the curl function as well.

There are also linear electric/hydraulic cylinders if you need it more compact. All forms of hydraulics are better than electric linear actuators in actual use. Definitely worth the extra effort to install.

The surplus shop is one place to buy huy hydraulics. You can also buy more than 3 spools This one has SAE 8 threads, PB option, but no float position. They have a huge selection.
3 Spool 14 GPM Prince WVS31BBB5C1 DA Valve | Directional Control Valves | Hydraulic Valves | Hydraulics | www.surpluscenter.com
 
   / Plumbing a bolt on grapple #17  
The concern I have with the 12V hydraulic pump option is the current draw....figure about 100-250 amps when it is running. That might be ok for running a dump trailer up and down a few times an hour but a grapple get more cycles and my JD855 only puts out about 40 amps IIRC.
 
   / Plumbing a bolt on grapple #18  
could add a true 3rd function which would allow you to operate other functions. At least it does on my Kubota. Of course the ps flow issue may affect this on these yanmars


W.R. Long, Inc. | Valve Kits
 
   / Plumbing a bolt on grapple #19  
The concern I have with the 12V hydraulic pump option is the current draw....figure about 100-250 amps when it is running. That might be ok for running a dump trailer up and down a few times an hour but a grapple get more cycles and my JD855 only puts out about 40 amps IIRC.

Your alternator should be big enough if the battery has sufficient reserve. The problem is that all those JD/Yanmars - and all the Yanmars, too - came with a minimal sized battery. Next time battery replacement comes around, you might want to see how big of an battery will fit. I expanded the battery box on mine to fit a std. automotive battery. The same one I use in our diesel PU truck. BTW, it makes sense to use a sealed battery or AGM type especially when the battery is right there in front of the radiator.
rScotty
 
   / Plumbing a bolt on grapple #20  
Having a 3rd function would be great, you could use it for a lot of other attachments too.
 

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