Poor Diesel Mileage(Dodge)

TOMLESCOEQUIP · Oct 22, 2004

Also the '95 smoked like a freight train and still got good mileage It would make sense to me that if my 04.5 doesn't smoke & makes more power it "SHOULD" be more fuel efficient and also more emmissions friendly than the '95 given the same displacement of the engine and approximate equal weight of the vehicle ?? But then, thats a common mans analogy of the obvious ?? Tom

LarryRB · Oct 22, 2004

again I ask why did Dodge go to a six speed manual if it makes no difference?
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The H.O.models dictate a 6sp because the auto's can't hold up to the HO's torque band.. It's right there in the book when ordering,,,,,,,,,,

BigDave · Oct 22, 2004

From what I've read, mileage seems to vary between trucks & drivers.

Daily driven diesel mpg

6 Speed vs Auto

RobertN · Oct 22, 2004

Your mileage may vary

As a data point, my buddies truck get's about 5mpg better than me. Both trucks are '01 Dodge 2500 long bed xcab 4x4. I have auto/4.10's while he has 6-spd/3.55. This is after we have both had out trucks for 3+ years, and we have similar driving styles, so there is a longer term comparison for us.

I have no comparison to Ford. The only truck I am familiar with is an '01 F450 2wd 6spd flatbed 7.3PS. It got poor mileage, but is a heavy truck, and my buddies driving habits were heavy footed.

The Dodge tranny story is interesting. The tranny has basically been an updated 727, which was a pretty good tranny. It is interesting it would hold up to drag racing 426 hemi's and 440 6-packs, which made plenty of torque and hp, but it won't hold up to tweaked up diesels(yes, I know the hp and toque bands are different, but those motors still made some massive peak power).

I wonder if those earlier Ford trannies were C6 upgrades(another decent tranny)?

Another interesting thing is the lack of torque vs hp compared to the bigger motors. The newer fire engines in the district I live in, have 350hp 8.9l Cummins in them. That's only 25hp more than the 5.9l motor and Ford/IH-6.0's. But, the torque is more than double in the big motor.

FWIW, I like Ford too, and had good luck with my '80 and '89 F250. I like the newer Fords too.

cowboydoc · Oct 22, 2004

That's the best answer you could come up with? Why then did Dodge go to a 6 speed BEFORE there ever was a HO. Also are not all of the trucks now at 610 on torque? And even if that was the answer why wouldn't Dodge come up with an auto that would withstand the 300 ponies like Chevy and Ford does? The cummins is a great motor and I like the truck looks too but they've got the worst auto out there in a diesel and there is no arguing that. It needs to be a five speed and it needs to be something bulletproof like the Allison or the Torqshift.

Tom to answer you question yes the trucks certainly were supposed to get better mileage. The cummins guys are having a heck of a time figuring out why they are getting such poor mileage.

bgott · Oct 23, 2004

They went to the 6 speed to split the ratio between second and third gear. The engine will pull the steep ratio but it does a lot better with an extra gear there.

QueBota · Oct 23, 2004

Back in 2000 the NVG 6 speed was ready to go before the HO engine details were worked out. They delivered a limited amount of trucks with 6 speeds and no HO engine. The later 6 speeds were beefed up a little when bolted to the HO engine, I believe a slightly larger clutch and mainshaft.

Dave

( That's the best answer you could come up with? Why then did Dodge go to a 6 speed BEFORE there ever was a HO. )

LarryRB · Oct 23, 2004

I can only give an estimated answer to your question, and it comes from my in-laws who were Dodge and Int Harv truck dealers from 1948 till 1998 then they sold out. Being when I hung around their dealership, I've seen a lot of things happen, Most were good and some were terrible. The terrible is the Dodge line of trucks.. From what I gather over the years, Chrysler tried to cut costs and to do that, the transmission was the quickest way to do it.. After losing and rebuilding to code, the first few diesel automatics, and having them lunch again, my father in law started sending the trannies to another private shop in Enfield CT,., This shop specializes in truck auto's.. They woould rebuild again, but change oli passages and a host of other minor mods.... Never had a problem again,,, EVEN when my FIL showed the Chrysler reps, what he was doing,., could prove the changes worked, and these changes were for guys that were pulling heavy 5th wh campers and such,,,it fell on deaf ears... Economics is what the whole problem is., That Gertrag trans is what started it,, Junk then and probably still junk.. The HO models arent's going to hold up with higher torque band and better than normally aspirated diesel that CANNOT hold an automatic trans.. Economics dictates to upgrade vs a million more auto warranty claims.. Might not be the correct answer or one that is totally accurate,, It is what I've seen personaly that came from a one time busy and large Dodge/IH truck dealership..

TOMLESCOEQUIP · Oct 23, 2004

Larry........All three of my dodges have been automatics.......I sell forklifts as my main business and routinely pull a heavy tag trailer(3300# empty) and the lifts I haul run between 4000# and 12,000# with the most common ones I haul are usually at 9000#. Combine that with the trailer weight, add in a chain,boomer or 3 and I haul around 12,500# on a routine basis. I have never had an automatic fail me yet. I leave my trucks basically stock with no add on boxes to stress out the drivetrain. I had to wait for my 2004.5 to be built as it has the high output cummins with the auto trans..........they supposedly beefed the autos to handle the 600 and weren't available until late spring.( It's my understanding that all the new trucks are built now with only the H/O cummins as the only diesel engine option) As for blaming the poor mileage on the trans...............the first dodge got 20.5 empty, and 17 loaded........with the "worthless" automatic. I service the trucks on time and I watch the trans temp when I'm pulling an extreme grade. I guess I'm just one of the lucky ones who's had no problems. Tom

RobertN · Oct 23, 2004

I do not tow as much or as often(have towed 8klb on occasion; other wise 2k weekly, with some 4klb mixed in here and there). Mines' an '01 just now turning 60k miles. It is bone stock 2500 4x4 quadcab long bed auto with 4.11's.

I do wish had gotten 3.55 gears; that diesel does not need 4.11's for what I do.

An auto, no matter of make, is a ding on fuel mileage whether gas or diesel. Gears are too. That's why I mentioned it previously, as I took a double-ding with my auto and lower gears.