Power beyond?

[Kep1a]

I posted this in the Montana section not realizing there was I hydraulic section. So here is my question in the correct area. :confused2:

Hi all,
I have a project I want to do and wonder if anyone has tapped into the power beyond on a 2840 or similar Montana tractor. I have access to a couple 3 point hydraulic tools like a 3 point back hoe. So setting up an accessory power beyond would seem to be something I should put on my list.

I believe this block is from the pump to the loader and the oil return hose under those two lines.


That above block also feeds the rear remote fittings with a hard line going down to the top of the valve block in the above photo.


Here is the FEL valve set and the two lines that have no quick disconnects one line goes to the valve in the first photo and the other goes to the back for an oil return.


My question is how did you or how would you tap in for a rear power beyond connection. Anyone have photos of how they did it? I believe tapping in at the valve shown in the first photo would be the starting point.

Thanks again guys for you help.

 

[fried1765]

I posted this in the Montana section not realizing there was I hydraulic section. So here is my question in the correct area. :confused2:

Hi all,
I have a project I want to do and wonder if anyone has tapped into the power beyond on a 2840 or similar Montana tractor. I have access to a couple 3 point hydraulic tools like a 3 point back hoe. So setting up an accessory power beyond would seem to be something I should put on my list.

I believe this block is from the pump to the loader and the oil return hose under those two lines.
View attachment 577970

That above block also feeds the rear remote fittings with a hard line going down to the top of the valve block in the above photo.
View attachment 577972

Here is the FEL valve set and the two lines that have no quick disconnects one line goes to the valve in the first photo and the other goes to the back for an oil return.
View attachment 577973

My question is how did you or how would you tap in for a rear power beyond connection. Anyone have photos of how they did it? I believe tapping in at the valve shown in the first photo would be the starting point.

Thanks again guys for you help.

I will be anxious to see what sort of responses you get.
I posed a very similar question here on TBN, (for my Ford 1920 FEL) and did not receive a solution to the problem.
Contacted MtnView Ranch (Fit Rite Hydraulics), here on TBN, but he said that he was too busy to help.
Perhaps if you BUY from him.... he WILL help.

 

[RNeumann]

The “power beyond” hangs people up......I think.

The concept is quite simple. The pressurized fluid goes into the valve and then leaves the valve through the “power beyond”. If you only have one valve it would return to 3 point and reservoir. If, in your case, you wanted to add a third function, it would be out if the loader valve and into the third function valve. Then out the third function valve and back to the 3 point and reservoir.

So find your “return” or “power beyond”. Run that line into the third function valve and then back to the reservoir.

How To Series - 3rd Function Auxiliary Hydraulics for Tractor Loaders - YouTube

Construction Attachments or WR Long has longer videos that walk through the whole process. They can also sell you a kit.

 

[fried1765]

The “power beyond” hangs people up......I think.

The concept is quite simple. The pressurized fluid goes into the valve and then leaves the valve through the “power beyond”. If you only have one valve it would return to 3 point and reservoir. If, in your case, you wanted to add a third function, it would be out if the loader valve and into the third function valve. Then out the third function valve and back to the 3 point and reservoir.

So find your “return” or “power beyond”. Run that line into the third function valve and then back to the reservoir.

How To Series - 3rd Function Auxiliary Hydraulics for Tractor Loaders - YouTube

Construction Attachments or WR Long has longer videos that walk through the whole process. They can also sell you a kit.

"So find your "return" or power beyond. Run that line into the third function valve and then back to the reservoir".

Well: That does not work for me!

That means using just return fluid for the additional valve, and then it only works when you activate the loader valve itself, to make "return" fluid available to the new valve.
I must move my loader to provide return fluid to activate the valve.
Not a satisfactory situation.
I am trying to locate proper tee fittings to put in both the supply and return loader lines, and thus provide pressure to the new valve, and return pressure from the new valve.
My lines are hard steel, and there is no space for tees, so I assume that I will also need to change those two hard lines to hose, for space considerations.

 

[ptsg]

Regarding Kep1a's problem, looks like your tractor already have a set of rear remotes, is there any good reason for not just using those? If you need constant flow, just lock the rear remote lever with a bungee cord.

You just need to make sure the line that will have pressure is the one on the pressure relief side of the backhoe valve.

The other line of the backhoe will just flow back to the tank through the other remote port.

Now for fried1765 issue, can you post the link for your thread? So we don't mix everything up between the two problems.

Anyway, you can't tee the pressure lines on a open center system. Otherwise the oil will just free flow to the path of least resistance.

The only line you can tee together is a the return/tank lines.

 

[Kep1a]

Does the rear remote flow enough to operate a backhoe? My lines are fixed metal lines for the remote but do not seem as big as the pump supply and return line size. Is this an illusion?

The way I have seen it done was two hoses coupled together for normal operation (no attachment). You then can alternatively connect the hoses to the backhoe to place the backhoe etc in full flow power beyond circuit. Is this not the normal way to power high flow power hungry attachments. I just don't know for sure how to plumb that hydraulic circuit yet.

I purchased a Fitrite Hydraulics top link and currently use the remote lever on that. I plan to add another electric hydraulic circuit for the alternate use of that same remote as a tilt function. I love the Power top link as it has transformed my use and connection of my attachments. I can only imagine the tilt in use too!.

 

[Kep1a]

The 菟ower beyond hangs people up......I think.



So find your 途eturn or 菟ower beyond? Run that line into the third function valve and then back to the reservoir.

How To Series - 3rd Function Auxiliary Hydraulics for Tractor Loaders - YouTube

Construction Attachments or WR Long has longer videos that walk through the whole process. They can also sell you a kit.

That is not exactly the same plumbing issue I was talking about. I already plan to implement a third function for the tilt cylinder to compliment my Fit rite hydraulics hydraulic top link.

 

[fried1765]

Regarding Kep1a's problem, looks like your tractor already have a set of rear remotes, is there any good reason for not just using those? If you need constant flow, just lock the rear remote lever with a bungee cord.

You just need to make sure the line that will have pressure is the one on the pressure relief side of the backhoe valve.

The other line of the backhoe will just flow back to the tank through the other remote port.

Now for fried1765 issue, can you post the link for your thread? So we don't mix everything up between the two problems.

Anyway, you can't tee the pressure lines on a open center system. Otherwise the oil will just free flow to the path of least resistance.

The only line you can tee together is a the return/tank lines.

I don't understand, "can you post the link for your thread".
The question I posed is above in this thread.
I checked out the two links mentioned in post #3 by RNeumann, but neither are of any help in solving my problem of getting a newly installed remote valve to work properly.

 

[Tractor Seabee]

Do you have or can you get a workshop manual for your tractor. Diagrams in there will pin down what does what leading to a proper solution. Your pictures do not show the whole system routing.

Ron

 

[ptsg]

Does the rear remote flow enough to operate a backhoe? My lines are fixed metal lines for the remote but do not seem as big as the pump supply and return line size. Is this an illusion?

The pump supply is always bigger as you don't want the pump to starve for oil and the return lines are bigger so there is a free flow route back to the tank without any restrictions. The steel lines will actually handle much more flow than any hoses. The hoses look bigger because of all the rubber and wire mesh it has to handle high pressures. But the inside diameter is actually much smaller than the steel lines.

The way I have seen it done was two hoses coupled together for normal operation (no attachment). You then can alternatively connect the hoses to the backhoe to place the backhoe etc in full flow power beyond circuit. Is this not the normal way to power high flow power hungry attachments. I just don't know for sure how to plumb that hydraulic circuit yet.

You can do that also, I just suggested using the remove valve because it was easier and simple to do. Doing the way you mentioned, you have to be careful to always reconnect the lines when the backhoe is off, otherwise you can dead-end the pump and blow things up ( usually are protected by relief valves but we never know).

Can you post a picture of the backhoe valve showing the lines to connect to the tractor?

I purchased a Fitrite Hydraulics top link and currently use the remote lever on that. I plan to add another electric hydraulic circuit for the alternate use of that same remote as a tilt function. I love the Power top link as it has transformed my use and connection of my attachments. I can only imagine the tilt in use too!.

The side link are usually more useful with box blades. But it's definitely a good addition.