Power Brown Out

[Industrial Toys]

Experienced one of those for the first time today. Ran down and shut off main switch. So I never had a chance to measure voltage before the power went out entirely.

Started Generator, no Problem.

Ontario Hydro Outage Map Indicated 680 customers out, crews dispatched, under investigation, pending classification, restoral estimate about three hours. How would they know that?

What do brownouts damage? I know compressors. But after how long?

What else is worth knowing about the effects of brown outs?

 

[oosik]

Due to voltage fluctuation during a brown out - most any type of electronics can be damaged. My APC, standby power supply, will kick in if voltage drops below 116V or above 124V. It protects my computer, satellite interface, external data storage units & printer.

Most all the other electronic devices in the house are normally off. I do have voltage protection on my TV, satellite interface, surround sound & DVD/CD unit.

Strange - it never has had a negative effect on the refrigerator or freezer.

 

[radios1]

brownouts can damage starting capacitors on any ac induction motor that use a starting capacitor if the brownout lasts longer than 3 seconds, that's all those starting capacitors are rated for, and they DO get very hot approaching the 3 seconds!.. as far as electronics go, anything with a HDD or SSD can be corrupted, not permanently, but will require a rebuild of the data structure if the device was writing at the time of the brownout.. most other electronics will just stop working during a brownout!..

 

[Industrial Toys]

Thanks for the replies. Many appliances that are turned off are indeed still on. Maybe not doing their work, but powered up, like dishwasher electronics and microwaves. I'm guessing switching power supplies found in just about everything, also don't like brownouts.

Heavy rains here on and off. Now hydro site indicates a four o clock restoration and cause, tree on line. Number of customers affected has increased which makes no sense to me. The feed for our local TS is in a wide corridor. Hardly imagine any trees near those lines.

 

[radios1]

Thanks for the replies. Many appliances that are turned off are indeed still on. Maybe not doing their work, but powered up, like dishwasher electronics and microwaves. I'm guessing switching power supplies found in just about everything, also don't like brownouts.

that's standby mode, it draws so little power, it's not worth considering, pennies per year.. and won't be damaged by a brownout!..

 

[Industrial Toys]

So you don't think a brown out would hurt the DC, probably switching supply in a microwave, trying to "Start"?. I used to replace inrush resistors on the switching psu's of NEC phone systems all the time.

 

[grsthegreat]

Brownouts can also damage automatic transfer switches. Especially Generacs 電umb switch. Not enough power to pull contactor completely closed...Keeps powering coil until they fry. I added a brownout kit to my own unit as we do experience them. No problem switching to emergency side as the generator poweres it. but when utility is partially restored under brownout conditions this can cause issues.

 

[radios1]

So you don't think a brown out would hurt the DC, probably switching supply in a microwave, trying to "Start"?. I used to replace inrush resistors on the switching psu's of NEC phone systems all the time.

a poorly designed switching supply yeah, a properly designed unit would have temperature and current limiting..

 

[Industrial Toys]

I installed one Generac Generator and Transfer switch for a customer at his cottage years ago. I got a call one day about the transfer switch acting crazy until it destroyed itself and that apparently was during a brownout.

 

[mikester]

Experienced one of those for the first time today. Ran down and shut off main switch. So I never had a chance to measure voltage before the power went out entirely.

Started Generator, no Problem.

Ontario Hydro Outage Map Indicated 680 customers out, crews dispatched, under investigation, pending classification, restoral estimate about three hours. How would they know that?

What do brownouts damage? I know compressors. But after how long?

What else is worth knowing about the effects of brown outs?

One thing to worry about is power surges along with the brown outs when power gets restored. Consider getting a whole home surge suppressor. Some home insurers give you a discount if you have one installed..discount paid for mine in 2 years.

 

[Industrial Toys]

Of course, I have not one but two, UNINSTALLED! One for main panel in garage and another for the house. Another should get at that project.

 

[radios1]

I installed one Generac Generator and Transfer switch for a customer at his cottage years ago. I got a call one day about the transfer switch acting crazy until it destroyed itself and that apparently was during a brownout.

that's very weird, it should be controlled by 12 VDC from the voltage sensing circuitry. battery powered!.. it sounds like a very poorly designed switch that uses a 120 VAC coil to sense the voltage, and switch to the generator during a brownout!..

 

[Industrial Toys]

IF my ASCO switch had been setup to start my generator, I'm curious how it would have handled this brownout. The ASCO switch will close a contact on power failure to start the genny and the genny power will trip the transfer.

 

[radios1]

IF my ASCO switch had been setup to start my generator, I'm curious how it would have handled this brownout. The ASCO switch will close a contact on power failure to start the genny and the genny power will trip the transfer.

it's possibly better, but I like a 1 minute delay before going to generator, and a 1 minute delay before going back to line power. things like air conditioners and refrigerators don't like losing power, then power being restored quickly!.. the thermal overload would be constantly tripping until the high side pressure lowers, and the compressor can start normally!.. btdt. I made a nice transfer switch for a motor home that only had a manual transfer..

 

[Industrial Toys]

Mine has adjustable delays, but I think I have it set to return to Utility after five minutes or so. Sometimes the power comes back on (as they try the fuse) and kicks out again.

Actually one should be happy they have single and not three phase power. A customer of mine with three phase is always loosing a phase and destroying a lot of motors in the process. They have a fancy new generator and ASCO switch, but not everything at the facility is on Emergency Power. I'm sure that fancy new switch cuts off if one phase if out.

 

[radios1]

Mine has adjustable delays, but I think I have it set to return to Utility after five minutes or so. Sometimes the power comes back on (as they try the fuse) and kicks out again.

Actually one should be happy they have single and not three phase power. A customer of mine with three phase is always loosing a phase and destroying a lot of motors in the process. They have a fancy new generator and ASCO switch, but not everything at the facility is on Emergency Power. I'm sure that fancy new switch cuts off if one phase if out.

they can use something like this. DiversiTech DTP-3 Digital 3-Phase Motor Protector: Voltage Monitoring Relays: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific

 

[Industrial Toys]

Interesting, thanks. I will pass it on to the manager.

 

[3Ts]

it's possibly better, but I like a 1 minute delay before going to generator, and a 1 minute delay before going back to line power. things like air conditioners and refrigerators don't like losing power, then power being restored quickly!.. the thermal overload would be constantly tripping until the high side pressure lowers, and the compressor can start normally!.. btdt. I made a nice transfer switch for a motor home that only had a manual transfer..

I had this problem when my generator was first installed. Sometimes the generator would start up and run for no apparent reason. Other times, it would start up and shut off, start up and shut off, etc. One day we came back from shopping and the house was hot because the AC wasn't running. Called the AC guys, everything checked out fine, just as they were ready to leave and still had their stuff hooked up, the generator started. Finally figured out the voltage sensing controls on the generator were not set as they should be. Had the generator folks come over they made some changes and put in a 2 minute delay. Everything works fine now.