Pressure switch on well PLEASE HELP!

ByronBob · Feb 3, 2005

Guy who installed my system had about 35-40 psi in the bladder tank. This is the optimum range for the bladder and it should be also for his system.
What I'm wondering is does he have the bladder tank in the house? Or is it in the pictures mounted there. Looks like a 10 gallon tank. Don't need much more with the 80 gallon in the basement.
I'd leave the set up alone and leave the switches in the pump house. It's not worth the aggravation to move it all. His set up will work fine

turnkey4099 · Feb 5, 2005

( Guy who installed my system had about 35-40 psi in the bladder tank. This is the optimum range for the bladder and it should be also for his system. (

I suspect this has been addressed somewhere in the thread but if not:

The proper pre-charge setting for a pressure tank depends on the pump cut-in setting. It should always be about 2psi below the cut-in. The adjustment is made with the tank empty.

Thus if the pressure switch is set for 30/50 the precharge is 28. If it is 40/60 the precharge is 38.

The precharge only provides a cushion of air that can be compressed by the pump. It has absolutely no effect on delivered water pressure or volume. Settings 2psi below cut-in optimizes the system for best pump operation, i.e., minum start/stop cycles for volume delivered.

Harry K

_RaT_ · Feb 5, 2005

Thats correst. Setting the precharge simply provides more longevity to the tank bladder.

gordon · Feb 5, 2005

You have a few different problems but one that has not been addressed as of yet. The location of your well expansion tank should be within 10 feet of your pressure switch. With the location of your expansion tank up at your house you can get a short cycle problem causing premature pump burnout. You can also get a high\\low pressure problem.

The little x trol tank located on top of the tee is all but useless for a pump of that size. More than likely put in to try to cure the existing water hammer and pressure problem that you have.

The other items have been addressed on the switch and the tank no load pressure setting. I have always taught 3 psi before pump cut in.

For now I would start with a new pump switch and go from there. Your still going to have to crank on the new switch to get any pressure at your house. Reason being--the 100ft elevation difference. For every foot you raise water you loose .433 in pressure. So don't think your going to put a new switch and all will be well at the well.

That was some lame plumbers humor. /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

But it would be in your best interest to move your pressure switch up to your house. Yes that would involve alot of work but that is the correct fix to your problem. /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

good luck
Gordon

turnkey4099 · Feb 6, 2005

Considering the elevation difference, the high pressure needed at the well head, etc. the best solution would probably be to set the well pump at about 40-60 and install a booster pump/tank at the house. Might require a real pressure tank in addition at the well tho.

Harry K

gordon · Feb 6, 2005

( the best solution would probably be to set the well pump at about 40-60 and install a booster pump/tank at the house. )

Yes good point a booster pump would prove to be the best set up.

Gordon

RobertN · Feb 6, 2005

See the end of my post above. We just did a small storage tank and booster pump...

_RaT_ · Feb 6, 2005

I have installed booster pumps on domestic services where the utility water did not have enough pressure to get to the top of the hill. They introduce another whole set of issues. He could do it, but I don't think he needs too. In this case, a 3 HP well pump should have more then enough ability to supply plenty of water even with the elevation change. I would surely use at least a sch 40 PVC pipe with a check valve or two along the way. I don't remember if he mentioned the depth the pump sits at, but my guess is being a submersible well pump, it is more then capable of charging the tank as well as dealing with the head pressure. It was mentioned leaving the system as it is, but as important as the well is for a residence, it would be nice to set it up correctly. Pressure tank/pressure switch up at the house where the water will be used, a relay down at the pump house. This certainly makes pressure adjustment much easier, but also makes maintanence easier. It is recommended to check tank precharge each year, it would be more likely that you would do it if it's more conveniant.

Westonium · Feb 7, 2005

( I have installed booster pumps on domestic services where the utility water did not have enough pressure to get to the top of the hill. They introduce another whole set of issues. He could do it, but I don't think he needs too. In this case, a 3 HP well pump should have more then enough ability to supply plenty of water even with the elevation change. I would surely use at least a sch 40 PVC pipe with a check valve or two along the way. I don't remember if he mentioned the depth the pump sits at, but my guess is being a submersible well pump, it is more then capable of charging the tank as well as dealing with the head pressure. It was mentioned leaving the system as it is, but as important as the well is for a residence, it would be nice to set it up correctly. Pressure tank/pressure switch up at the house where the water will be used, a relay down at the pump house. This certainly makes pressure adjustment much easier, but also makes maintanence easier. It is recommended to check tank precharge each year, it would be more likely that you would do it if it's more conveniant. )

I don't think a couple of y'all read my message. I don't have an issue with not enough pressure. In fact, AFTER REDUCING the pressure a bit, the house pressure was reading 110 (finally got a pressure gauge that works). I subsequently got a reading of 135 ish down at the pump. It was not an easy location to read it, but that is close.

I then cut the pressure range a few more turns back. I think that the pressure was originally cranked way up to allow for irrigation pipes which was leaking. The valves were shut off, but they were crappy gate valves and leaked pressure.
I think the system at the house was probably 90psi or so before I fixed that manifold just outside the house that also supplied the broken irrigation. By disconnecting the dead lines, the pressure had no where to leak and it shot my pressure up quite a bit (the rewards of doing good work I guess

)

I'll measure it again after a shower in the morning. I suspect it is down to something a lot more reasonable.

There is one check valve right off the pump. I will be installing at least one more in the main heading toward the house. Any irrigation that gets re-connected will be checked as well.

I'll have to check out the pressure tanks to see what they are set at.

_RaT_ is correct - I don't need a booster pump. We have insane pressure if we need it - we just need less than we are (or were) getting.

I think I will set up the remote switch/relay system when I redo the main. Maybe PVC is safe - maybe it isn't. We use a 5 stage RO system for drinking anyway so I am not THAT concerned about it. Still - PVC is known to release small amounts of carcinogens. Not real crazy about that.

Frankly, I'm kinda fond of old-fashioned rigid copper. My grandfather built his own radiant slab system with it and it never needed repair in 50+ years. The copper pipes in the house never ever failed.

I am considering, though, using Wirsbo piping for the long main line since it is thermally insulative (something I think radiant folks really need to think more on) and will expand tremendously before failing - or so they say.

_RaT_ · Feb 7, 2005

The bad thing about copper is that it oxidizes inside releasing the resultant copper in small but quantities that get concentrated as the water sits in the line. This happens in water that has a slightly acidic PH. If your well water is neutral, it is not an issue. Believe it or not, a young girl who was a friend of a family member died from copper poisoning. Now not to alarm you, but she had a genetic disposition for this and in the autopsy, this is exactly what they found out. Subsequently, they pulled all copper from the house. I have never heard of it before. My water is slightly acidic, not that you could taste it, but it certainly is etching the inside of my water lines, all my neighbors are having the same issue. Everyone who is springing leaks is going PEX.