Properly securing a CUT for trailering

RonR · Sep 1, 2004

Hi Gary.

I'm not wanting to argue, but I just don't see where having 4 separate chains attaching is any better than 2. Are you saying that if one of the 4 breaks (for example), the other three will hold it on the trailer?

I am not an engineer, so I can't argue loads and such.

I would think that if I had four and one broke, the unit could move away from the direction of the broken chain, maybe even off the trailer.

I agree that the third chain would limit the travel fore/aft somewhat, and maybe that's the redeeming value to it. I guess I need to check with our state DOT and see if the laws here have changed. For as long as I've known, it was "securely fastened" and didn't specify any number of tie downs.

I am probably safer than most operators and try not to take chances. However sometimes I think we loose sight of what we are dealing with here. Without getting out my specs, I think my tractor, fel, and any attachment would come in around 2K pounds, maybe 2500 max.

I have two grade 70 5/16" chains, which at the time I bought them and I checked the specs, seemed WAY more than I could ever load them with. I hook one chain in back, through a clevis on the drawbar, crossed, and secured to the trailer. This puts the rachet binder in front. So if the binder comes loose, the rear keeps the tractor off me. Braking hard (or running into something immoveable) and not having the binder in that path seems logical to me.

The front chain goes though a clevis on the front grill guard, crossed, and secured to the trailer. The rachet binder takes up the slack.

I haven't hauled this unit very much yet, but I have yet to have it loosen.

In a past life, I dragged a loaded trailer thousands of miles like this with no problems. If fact, the chains were 1/4 inch and the loads much heavier....... Granted, every time I stopped, I checked the load and adjusted as necessary. (guess this is the anecdotal story, huh?)

One other thing--my load chains NEVER get used for anything other than securing the load--no tree pulling or towing cars, etc. I'd never loan them to anyone either!

I'll post here if I find out our state laws are different.

Best wishes, stay safe out there.
Ron

OkieG · Sep 1, 2004

Hi Gary,
Didn't intend to push your "hot" button. My method, flawed as it is, was offered to dirtwhisperer (and to you) not as a recommendation, but as information for critical review and comment. And, I thank you for supplying the critical comments. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 in the final analysis, four is certainly better than two. Besides that, in many jurisdictions, mine included, it's the law. 

Your words come from the heart, and I appreciate that. 4 are better than 2? Yes, I agree.
I will have to ask around and find what the Ok. law says. The possibility that a state law governs this issue is a good point. Glad you brought it up. Something I hadn't even thought about. I will comply with the law, if I find I currently do not.

I don't claim 4 point, or modified 4 point, or anything else. I do claim to feel comfortable with my setup. When it comes to my laziness/lack of knowledge/arrogance , I strongly claim the defect in the middle.

What I consider my gem, offered to the TBN readership, is looping the tie down chain "end hook" over the top of the tiedown pocket. I think RonR has a gem, too...using the binder on the front chain. It makes sense to me that if the binder can loosen (which sometimes it can) or could be weaker than the chain (I don't know about that one), to use it on the front chain. Thanks for the good tip, Ron.

Oklahoma is a state of legal ironies. You can be cited for not wearing your seatbelt, but it's OK to drive down the road with your pick-up bed full of people. Unbelieveable!! THAT is something I feel strongly about. Moving along....

If state law yields anything interesting, I'll post.

OkieG

RonR · Sep 2, 2004

Couldn't sleep, so I searched for our state's commercial driver's license manual (couldn't find state DOT requirments, but I'll keep looking). I'm wondering if these aren't mirrored from federal, but will check that later on).

I'm summarizing here not to post a manual...........

"On flatbed trailers or trailers without sides, cargo must be secured to keep it from shifting or falling off.........(I skipped some stuff here)

"Tiedowns must be of the proper type and proper strength. The combined strength of all cargo tiedowns must be strong enough to lift one and one-half times the weight of the piece of cargo tied down. Proper tiedown equipment must be used, including ropes, straps, chains, and tensioning devices (winches, ratchets, clinching components). Tiedowns must be attached to the vehicle correctly (hook, bolt, rails, rings)."

"Cargo should have at least one tiedown for each ten feet of cargo. Make sure you have enough tiedowns to meet this need. No matter how small the cargo, it should have at least two tiedowns holding it."

So I read that in KS, I'm legal with two chains, as long as they meet the 10' rule, which I think they do, and the combined weight of the tractor/FEL/attachment is less than 1.5 times the combined strength of the two chains.

Will be curious what others find in reference to this........

This said, I would never discourage someone that felt safer with 4 chains or 6. Just my two cents.

Stay safe,
Ron

Gary_in_Indiana · Sep 2, 2004

"I just don't see where having 4 separate chains attaching is any better than 2. Are you saying that if one of the 4 breaks (for example), the other three will hold it on the trailer?" 

In a word, yes. Further, if I only have two chains and one breaks I've definitely got a problem. I just like my odds better with two on each end.

 "I would think that if I had four and one broke, the unit could move away from the direction of the broken chain, maybe even off the trailer." 

Not really. Whichever end has two still on will hold that end square. The remaining one on the end with the failure is then just holding against the two. Granted, there may be some minimal slackening but the load will stay on the trailer.

I have to note that my trailer is not only of my tractor (3,000# + FEL + BH) but also of trucks in the 4,000-5,000 pound range. Also, my frame of reference is coming from the towing and recovery industry where the standards may well tend to be a bit higher (and rightly so). Lastly, I've seen the result of not using a second chain on each end first hand here when the load left the carrying bed, crossed the median on an interstate and hit a car head on killing the driver.

Gary_in_Indiana · Sep 2, 2004

Okie,

I guess I didn't realize what a "hot button" this is with me until you pointed it out. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif I guess there are worse things I could have as a "hot button" issue. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

As I read your post I realized that my comment about laziness/lack of knowledge/arrogance could easily have been read as having been intended to have been pointed and I want to thank you for not taking it that way as that was not my intent. Your remark about claiming the middle ground there made me smile because I know if I ever fail to use what I know about this my failing has to be from one or both of the others. I know I possess those traits. I just try not to showcase them. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

As to legal ironies, the very concept of being ticketed for failure to wear a seat belt by a motorcycle officer has always struck me as odd. I am happy about being able to ride mine without a helmet, however. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Yep, Mr. Four Point Tie Downs here rides without a helmet! Go figure... /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

RonR · Sep 2, 2004

Gary,

I respect the words you wrote. I'm sure from your recovery experience, you have seen the worst of the worst in load securing.

I'm not in that biz, but I still cringe several times a year when I see how sloppy some folks are in securing loads. Heck, even today at lunch I was out running errands and came up behind a local wholesale food delivery truck. He hit a bump and one of his back doors (the floor to ceiling kind) swung open and around to the right. He was in the inside lane, so any big cars/truck to his right were in peril. I followed him about 8 blocks in traffic and he never saw it flopping in and out................ To my knowledge, he didn't hit anyone, and I didn't get any box of steaks that I was hoping would fall out /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif.

If I were doing higher risk hauling, such as hauling my tractor cross country, or towing it at night a lot, or at higher speeds for longer distances, I might opt for 2 more chains/binders. (Of course, first thing I'd do is get a tandem axle trailer with brakes.) But for right now, my trips are short at low speed, during the day, where I can see stuff happening. (I've passed trucks at night and witnessed their loose chains).

Since most of my current hauls are short, within 10 miles, at speeds less than 50MPH, I'll continue to use my setup because I feel it is safe. And it is quick for me. If I thought it were not safe, I certainly would take longer and use more stuff.

Thanks for the discussion. I'm curious if other states really do call out more than two tie downs and would like to see people in other areas check and post what they find. My feeling is that states don't like to specify a set number, but rather use generic words that require the load to be secured and maybe state a minimum. That way if they dump a load, they can't say "Well, your laws said to use 4 chains, and I did, so it's not my fault........"

Let's all stay safe out there. Best wishes,
Ron

Gary_in_Indiana · Sep 3, 2004

"Since most of my current hauls are short, within 10 miles, at speeds less than 50MPH, I'll continue to use my setup because I feel it is safe. And it is quick for me. If I thought it were not safe, I certainly would take longer and use more stuff." 

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one, Ron. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I have a good friend who never secures much of anything ever. I've seen him take delivery of three new flatbeds decked and, since he didn't have a ramp at his place the delivery driver couldn't undeck them and just took his chains and binders and left. My buddy would then back under the units and drive them across town to a place where he could undeck them. Notice I never mentioned anything about him putting his chains or straps on them. He never lost any but that sure didn't make it safe.

This is the same guy who drove out to Phoenix and finished delivering a refrigerated load when a driver had a heart attack. After he delivered it he took the refrigerated trailer back to pick up his Jeep Cherokee which he just drove into the box on the corrugated aluminum floor, put on the park brake and closed the doors. Sure, he made it back without a problem but, again, that doesn't mean it was safe.

As to the time savings, I can back my trailer up to what I'm loading and get out of my cab and have my trailer loaded with my four point tie down and be back in my truck pulling away in about ten minutes. I don't know how much faster I need to do it. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

coopers · Sep 4, 2004

I believe our state requires four chains and any boom needs to also be secure. So any backhoe or trackhoe's boom needs to have a chain across it, like the bucket area. We use four chains and binders to do the job.

Blake
WA

DannyD · Sep 4, 2004

When they delivered my tractor it was tied down with 2 straps, ATV ones at that, on a goose neck trailer. Now I could care less if they lost it, they owe me a new one then, but I do care if someone is hurt or killed by their stupidity. I have mentioned it, but it goes in one ear and out the other.

I use 4 5000 lb straps, tied to the frame, and INSIDE the rail on my trailer. The straps are also tied to the frame of the tractor, never the implement. Tractor has emergency brake on, in gear, bucket and any implements down. If I am going close, not on the freeway I may even turn on the flashers of the tractor.

just my 2 cents worth

dummy · Sep 6, 2004

I've got one to add to the do not do list. Saturday, a fellow was hauling a Jeep on a trailer. The only thing attaching the jeep to the trailer was a comealong. He was rather creative though, the cable was run across the top of one tire then secured fore and aft of that tire.

Dale