Question moving dirt

[jomar215]

I dug my basement, 28'x24' 6' deep with the house above me, by hand. It took 5 months and another month to build the block wall and backfill. I figure a man moved 3.5-5 yards per day - hard digging ... pick, pick, pick, chunk, hoe back, shovel shovel shovel, repeat ... Conveyor belts would have helped a lot, as half the work was chucking it up out of the hole.

Loose soil, in my experience, can be moved much, much quicker.

 

[jomar215]

I dug my basement, 28'x24' 6' deep with the house above me, by hand. It took 5 months and another month to build the block wall and backfill. I figure a man moved .5 yards per day - hard digging ... pick, pick, pick, chunk, hoe back, shovel shovel shovel, repeat ... Conveyor belts would have helped a lot, as half the work was chucking it up out of the hole.

Loose soil, in my experience, can be moved much, much quicker.

 

[jomar215]

Oopsies, that first post had wrong math - thought about it for a sec and just didn't seem right. Probably took a bit because I was thinking of how dumb I was to start that project in the first place ... oh well.

 

[jdtractor]

Hi Ive done that kind of work under a mobile home , my brothers, we used machines , front end loader and dozer to spread the dirt . I know that doesnt pertain to your project. My suggestion to you is what ever you do to remove the dirt ,1st be careful etc, you said you have experience, etc..... BUT I would avoid all possible contact with your neighbors property. Talk Yes,Dig No based on what you have said, I have been down the same road, and its never good.By that I mean unless you get what work he wants done in writeing and signed (contract) you may never get done< Been there and done that. Just my O.02cts. GOOD LUCK to YOU.

 

[charlz]

This isn't the thread I was thinking of but it may have some ideas for you

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/projects/27365-digging-out-basement.html

Somewhere I saw a project where they used a mini excavator or skidsteer, thought it was on here but must have been somewhere else on the interwebs

 

[Cat_Driver]

Have the house lifted by a house moving contractor, then RAMP in on one side of the basement with your tractor.

He will support the house with steel beams any pylons many feet away from the house to give you room to move.

I'm afraid digging by hand you may be down there for a very, very, very, long time.

 

[jomar215]

Have the house lifted by a house moving contractor, then RAMP in on one side of the basement with your tractor.

He will support the house with steel beams any pylons many feet away from the house to give you room to move.

I'm afraid digging by hand you may be down there for a very, very, very, long time.

Eh, maybe not - around here it costs 7 gran to lift a house. If you go that route, I will personally come and dig that for you, charge you 6 and you can pocket the 1.

 

[2manyrocks]

Construction companies get written easements anytime they need to use somebody else's property to complete a job.

It is sort of telling in a sense that nobody so far has given an estimate of how much a person can dig in 8 hours by hand. I had a laborer help me hand dig a trench for a foundation drain last year, and it was not fun. Our productivity was not good, and I wouldn't have pushed either of us any harder on that one.

 

[amstaff]

Interesting, and timely, thread. I have a contractor coming over tomorrow to talk about a very similar project. Ans a second coming out next week. House is to be raised a couple feet, full foundation dug out (only have a "basement" in 1/3 of its footprint currently), and ulimately some additional living space with a full walkout basement. I look forward to watching your progress.

 

[hr3]

I'm considering digging out a basement. The reason for doing this is:
1 The old foundation is brick and needs to be replaced with a more substantial concrete foundation with all the proper hold downs.
2 I want to make it into a full basement, full 8' height where as it is presently a half basement at 6' 6" in height.

Unfortunately it's not convenient to use my tractor. So it will need to be dug out by hand using pick, shovel and electric Hilti with a spade and wheel barrow to move the dirt out about 80 ft. I can hire laborers to do most of the work. I'd like to estimate the feasibility to doing this project and of course the cost.

So my question is - roughly how much dirt (yards) can one man dig and move in an 8 hour day? The dirt here is not very hard to dig.

A slight Engineering question if I may.. How are you going to support the walls as you dig under them and tear out the old wall and add the extra height??

 

[hitekcountry]

A slight Engineering question if I may.. How are you going to support the walls as you dig under them and tear out the old wall and add the extra height??

First dig a trench along the outside but not to the extent that it under cuts the existing foundation. Put down a temporary mud sill. On the mud sill build a temporary post and beam support that will carry sistered up extensions of the floor joists. Second dig on the inside down to the level that I need to go, build a second temp wall to support the floor. Now remove the old wall and dig down, frame up for the new foundation and pour. that leaving out a lot of detail but should give a rough idea.

I plan to do sections at a time. Maybe 6 or 8 sections in all

 

[quicksandfarmer]

I put perimeter drains in my house and had to do some excavation under pretty tough conditions: hard rocky soil, a six-foot ceiling, and the dirt had to be carried up the stairs in five-gallon buckets. I could fill about three buckets an hour, which works out to about 18 hours for a cubic yard. It took me almost all summer, going down every evening after the kids went to bed and listening to the Red Sox and digging for a few hours.

There's two parts to it, digging and hauling. If you want to estimate how much you can dig, go down with a five gallon bucket and see how long it takes to fill it, working at a reasonably sustainable pace. There are 45 buckets in a yard. If you have sand you could fill a bucket in a minute, which works out to a yard an hour. If you have New England soil figure on one-eighteenth of that rate!

The other part is hauling. It doesn't matter what kind of soil you have, what matters is how you're going to haul it. Figure out how you're going to haul the dirt and then figure out how long it's going to take!

 

[hitekcountry]

I have a dump trailer so the hauling is not a problem.

 

[hitekcountry]

Somethings of interest.

MAX DUMPER Motorized Wheelbarrow - Dumper

Digging It Out: April 2005

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/build-yourself/138768-build-your-own-dirt-conveyor.html

 

[JimRB]

My friends started to excavate for their house and they hit rock on a third of it. They had to blast if they wanted to use that site. I got lucky on my house and hit no rock.

 

[Gramps in NM]

I vote for hiring some riggers (or rigging contractor) for a day and raise the building. Not near as expensive as you may think. Cut out a ramp and excavate by machine getting the material out quickly. Dig for your footers, pour concrete footers then start laying block walls up to the height you need. Pour your concrete floor. Backfill. Do not even need to go full height maybe if you would like the house to sit higher. All things considered, digging, haul out and away, pouring floor, setting up walls and my way is better cheaper. What if you start your way and it rains like the dickens. your supports may well give way. Plus your way may take one heck of a lot of time. Yes I admit you will have to do some disabling of utility lines but you may need to do that anyway. The age of this building may be a factor also and was not mentioned nor was the existing means of support.
My thoughts anyway and I have supported many heavy power transformers (50plus ton) on wood blocks in order to move them.
Good luck
Gramps

 

[hitekcountry]

I vote for hiring some riggers (or rigging contractor) for a day and raise the building. Not near as expensive as you may think. Cut out a ramp and excavate by machine getting the material out quickly. Dig for your footers, pour concrete footers then start laying block walls up to the height you need. Pour your concrete floor. Backfill. Do not even need to go full height maybe if you would like the house to sit higher. All things considered, digging, haul out and away, pouring floor, setting up walls and my way is better cheaper. What if you start your way and it rains like the dickens. your supports may well give way. Plus your way may take one heck of a lot of time. Yes I admit you will have to do some disabling of utility lines but you may need to do that anyway. The age of this building may be a factor also and was not mentioned nor was the existing means of support.
My thoughts anyway and I have supported many heavy power transformers (50plus ton) on wood blocks in order to move them.
Good luck
Gramps

On having riggers/house movers lift the building and going at it full tilt, yes of course I've thought that through. To begin with the building is fully rented. It's a 130 year old Victorian in excellent condition (except for the foundation). If I have it lifted and all the foundation removed I would have to have everyone move out. The loss of rent will add up really fast. So it would make most sense in that case to just let them go full bore and finish it as fast as possible. And THAT IS expensive. There is a house mover that we have dealt with before that moved a house for my father, great people to do business with, the only ones I would consider working with. Cost for them to do what I want done, somewhere around 100K. There is a lot more to this but I'm not good at writing. (slow)

Also it's a designated historic building in an historic district and is under very strict architectural guidelines. Therefore I can't raise it. I can't do anything to change the look of it at all. Don't want to anyway.

As I mentioned, the plan I'm considering is to go at it a section at a time. There would be no risk of the building falling.

About the rain - this is California, after April - May, what little rain we might get would probably barely be enough to keep the dust down.

 

[Gramps in NM]

OK, I'm with your now that more info is available. Again, good luck.
Gramps
PS, sorry I can't help you with your original question, I'm now older and slower, but still available.

 

[jomar215]

I've got a very poorly installed stack and bond foundation to repair next month. I'm going to have it jacked for $3000. I'm going to dig out the bottom from the inside with a track skid steer and pour a full foundation. Total cost to the client, about $50,000. We can move a house around here 100 feet for $7000. Why so expensive to lift a house where you are?

I agree with some of the guys, getting the dirt out is one thing and won't/shouldn't take all that long - especially is it isn't too packed/full of clay and gravel - the big time consuming thing is going to be getting rid of the dirt. In any case, what's the square footage of your basement? Total yardage of dirt to move? It's only like a foot and a half deep right?

 

[hitekcountry]

I've got a very poorly installed stack and bond foundation to repair next month. I'm going to have it jacked for $3000. I'm going to dig out the bottom from the inside with a track skid steer and pour a full foundation. Total cost to the client, about $50,000. We can move a house around here 100 feet for $7000. Why so expensive to lift a house where you are?

I agree with some of the guys, getting the dirt out is one thing and won't/shouldn't take all that long - especially is it isn't too packed/full of clay and gravel - the big time consuming thing is going to be getting rid of the dirt. In any case, what's the square footage of your basement? Total yardage of dirt to move? It's only like a foot and a half deep right?

To be more exact. 896 square ft needs to go down 5 ft and the other area 608 square ft needs to go down 1.5 ft. I get 200 yards of dirt to be removed.

If this building were out in the country this would all be a piece of cake The 3D Sketchup model that I submitted might be a little deceiving, it gives the impression of lots of room all around. In reality there is little room to work with. On the side of the building with the round turret, the turret is 2 ft from the property line. On the other side, the driveway, there is 9 ft. anything 10 wide trying to move down the driveway would be gouging both buildings. My dump trailer is just under 8ft wide outside of tire to outside of tire, 94 inches to be exact. Try backing a trailer down a 70ft drive with 7in of clearance on both sides assuming you're perfectly centered. The working space behind the building is 36 x 46 max. Parking on the street is hit and miss. Sometimes you can't park on the street at all or maybe a couple of hundred feet away. If you need to park a big truck, plan on blocking off the area the night before. Move your truck and you'll be lucky if the space is still there in a half hour

To dig a ramp would require removing a section of concrete paved parking area, what ever size of the ramp

The 100k wasn't just to lift the building, that would be the complete job lift dig and remove the dirt, form it up and pour. But even that was just a ball park number.

Also you need to know that this is the center of Silicon Valley. Everything is more expensive here.